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View Full Version : Ched Evans - Should he not work again?



BURNLEY2014
12-11-2014, 10:26 PM
People are stating he should nt be in football but is it ok of he goes and gets a job as a postman? Im a firm believer that if people commit a crime once they have paid there due that the british justice system deemed a fair time then they should be given a chace to earn there crust in the best way they possibly can.

bf2k
12-11-2014, 10:35 PM
I'm glad someone has brought this up. This stroy has really p*ssed me off today. I've read all sorts of guff on the news pages. Even a woman who is an ambassador for Sheff utd throwing her toys out of her pram and resigning. If he did commit this crime (which based on the public evidence I'm of the opinion he didn't) he's served his sentence set out by law. Agree with the term or not it is the law. Now he should be able to return to work as long as that profession isn't impacted by the crime he committed (or didn't). Now being a convicted rapist shouldn't stop you playing football. It should stop you being directly involved with children (teacher for example) but a football isn't directly involved with children.

Now with the evidence which was put forward, how on earth can anyone form such a hatred for this man? These people calling for him not to return to football I'm sure haven't read a thing about this case. If they did and still agree with the verdict they'd be asking for Clayton

wherewasi
12-11-2014, 10:56 PM
I'm not revisting the verdict of the jury. To be honest, in a civilised society, Evans' own events of that evening would get him banged away. However, the clamour for further punishment for him is being acted out in entirely the wrong arena. Those who feel 2 1/2 years' prison for that crime is not a fit punishment should lobby their MP, not try and deprive Evans of his livelihood.

The sad part is that the noise round this will end up with opposition fans ripping into Evans, which will (as tribes do) cause the Sheff U fans to rally round Evans, regardless of the nuances of how they feel individually. That will then be taken by those in the media who love to say such things as evidence of the neanderthal nature of football fans.

Evans is a 5cumbag by his own admission. He's not someone I would ever want to spend time with or shake hands with. I would be deeply saddened if he played for Burnley. But he's entitled to work and football is what he does.

Bin_Ont_Turf
12-11-2014, 10:57 PM
Average Joe who is a convicted rapist goes to get his job back.

Sorry but we can't employ you, it's bad for our image.

Average Joe who is a convicted rapist goes for another job. Sorry but the CBR check doesn't make great reading. Sorry we can't employ you.

Only in football and government are the rules different.

Jamb0MackemClaret
12-11-2014, 10:58 PM
Of course he should be allowed to work. The question is more about whether he should be allowed to be a very well paid footballer and rightly or wrongly he will be seen as a role model - what sort of message does it sent out to young men if a rapist is allowed to go back to such a privileged position after serving such a short period of time in prison?

I'm torn on it really. I think Evans probably should be allowed to play again, but then I certainly wouldn't like him to be a Burnley player. It'd be one of the very few things that could make me seriously consider walking away from the club.

And Charlie Webster was absolutely right to resign imo.

Jamb0MackemClaret
12-11-2014, 11:00 PM
"Now with the evidence which was put forward, how on earth can anyone form such a hatred for this man?"

Regardless of the evidence, he was convicted. He's a convicted rapist.

Bin_Ont_Turf
12-11-2014, 11:07 PM
'I think Evans probably should be allowed to play again, but then I certainly wouldn't like him to be a Burnley player. It'd be one of the very few things that could make me seriously consider walking away from the club'

Que?

So your morality doesn't extend to him playing for anyone else, as long as it's not Burnley. :s

tybfc
12-11-2014, 11:15 PM
2.5 years of his sentence should have had the . taken out of the middle and he should never be allowed to be earning 20k a week again which he will be doing next week.

A convicted rapist being cheered on by my kids? No thanks.

wherewasi
12-11-2014, 11:15 PM
BOT

Really? You can't understand how someone could be resigned to something being the least bad solution in a difficult situation but hope it doesn't impact them directly? Is that a very taxing concept for you?

tybfc

What is the upper earnings limit you're putting on him earning? You seem very clear it's not 20k/week - what is it? And anyone who's worried about their kids cheering him perhaps could explain to them that just because someone plays football for their team, that doesn't make them a saint or a role model or anything other than a footballer. It's called 'being a parent'.

dsr
12-11-2014, 11:20 PM
Rape is rape. It's the same offence whether you drag a teenage virgin into a dark alley and rape her with violence, or whether you take a drunk and willing experienced woman to bed but she passes out before she has formally given consent. It's the same crime in law, and in the eyes of many of the public the two offences are morally equivalent. Rape is rape.

wherewasi
12-11-2014, 11:26 PM
dsr: rape is clearly heinous under any circumstances but even our legal system recognises that some rapes have aggravating features and this is reflected in sentencing guidelines. So, it's recognised that there are differences, as there are for other serious crimes, and, I suspect, there is even more recognition of that among the public. 'Rape is always wrong' - yes. 'Rape is rape' - that's just trite.

Bin_Ont_Turf
12-11-2014, 11:30 PM
'Really? You can't understand how someone could be resigned to something being the least bad solution in a difficult situation but hope it doesn't impact them directly? Is that a very taxing concept for you?'

It would only impact on him directly if Ched became a Burnley player because that's when he chooses to have morals. Ched is all right being employed by any other football club, which to me is a contradiction.

Not very taxing at all.

cloughyclaret
12-11-2014, 11:31 PM
He was convicted of rape. Regardless of whether you believe the 'guff' in the newspapers or have formed an opinion that he is not guilty is irrelevant, He's a convicted rapist.

Now, as to whether he should play again. He
he has served his sentence and so this should be clear cut, but it isnt. He does work with children directly - football players visit hospital wards, have a part to play in meeting mascots, etc. Indirectly they are role models - whether they want to be or not.

In regards to 'being a parent' I would not want to explain this situation to a child - away chants can be vile for example.

In short. No, I don't believe he should play.

tybfc
12-11-2014, 11:32 PM
whereasi - 20p or 2k or 20k or 200k a week I wouldn't care.

I am not a proper parent. I have adopted a couple of kids.

But I would not ever dream of taking them to cheer a player who has been quite openly sentenced and then released after two and half years of rape and shown not one ounce of remorse.

I'd chuck him back inside.

PaintYorkClaretnBlue
12-11-2014, 11:37 PM
Don't talk b*llox ty! If you've adopted two kids and treat them as your own then you are a very special proper parent!

wherewasi
12-11-2014, 11:39 PM
"He does work with children directly - football players visit hospital wards, have a part to play in meeting mascots, etc."

Firstly, that can (and clearly) will be all avoided. That said, there's no suggestion that Evans has any sexual interest in children so I'm not quite sure of the relevance.

"Indirectly they are role models - whether they want to be or not."

To whom? Who would have Ched Evans as a role model? Anybody who allowed their kid to grow up with someone like Ched Evans as a 'role model', even before this, is likely to be feeding them White Lightning and fags for breakfast. Unless you mean 'role model' in the modern day, generic "someone you have heard of" use of the term. In which case it means nothing. Presumably Evans shouldn't do any work for charity to atone either; after all those who do charity work are 'role models'?

wherewasi
12-11-2014, 11:42 PM
BOT

So, a Burnley fan should say it would make him feel like turning his back on Burnley if Sheff Utd employ Evans? Is that your point? Or maybe he should turn his back on Burnley FC if a well-known regional biscuit manufacturer in Eritrea employs some other convicted rapist? Bilge.

dsr
12-11-2014, 11:44 PM
It was meant to be trite, wherewasi. This is how a lot of the population, rightly or wrongly, see rape. Rape is rape, whatever the circumstances, and cannot be forgiven.

Personally, I don't think that Evans is a fit person to appear as a footballer. But then, nor is his apparently innocent colleague in the same bed, who gets nothing like the opprobrium. They both behaved disgracefully and should be run out of town, so to speak; but the idea that McDonald is an innocent with no case to answer and Evans is the devil incarnate, is not how I see it.

Bin_Ont_Turf
12-11-2014, 11:48 PM
'Anybody who allowed their kid to grow up with someone like Ched Evans as a 'role model', even before this, is likely to be feeding them White Lightning and fags for breakfast'

XD

butterflyvenom
12-11-2014, 11:49 PM
Imagine the sceanario, you are accused of something similar. You contest the allegations but ultimatley are found guilty.Punishment is meted out accordingly.Time served, then what ?
Are we to assume that after serving the alloted time, we are then to be persecuted indefinatley ?
To the extent that once outside the justice system, we are further judged to be unfit to work based on public hostility.It makes a mockery of the punitive system we have put in place.
Angry mobs don't make it any better.

Bin_Ont_Turf
12-11-2014, 11:51 PM
'So, a Burnley fan should say it would make him feel like turning his back on Burnley if Sheff Utd employ Evans? Is that your point?'

Stop being so silly and read the thread and the posts properly.

tybfc
12-11-2014, 11:52 PM
My wife Sky + Loose Women today (sorry).

They discussed this story.

Janet St Porter said he should be allowed back in training if he paid the club.

Fair point and for the next 20 years.

cloughyclaret
12-11-2014, 11:52 PM
This is nothing about being sexually interested in children, as I'm sure you well know.

If his playing for a club shouldn't be an issue then why should this be in the area of 'can and clearly be avoided'? Surely it shouldnt matter? Yet, you make it clear it actually does.

Any footballer is a role model if they are playing well for their team. Again, as you well know. Even more reason not to allow this to happen in this case. A parent would find this much easier to explain this to a child rather than justifying some decent win - 'He's not a role model as he's not a very nice man, son. He's plays football and scores for our team that we follow every week together but don't look up to him'

Charity? You are surely reaching now. There are many instances in which charities have refused to accept donations from cases. Seen to be charitable acts aren't always charitable, after all.

This is how many people see it, me included. There are opinions on both sides, but football is corrupt enoug

butterflyvenom
13-11-2014, 12:33 AM
Bin ont turf, of course, I knew you would be espousing virtue and with ill merited certainty.
You know absolutley none of the facts with this case, but see fit to advise me to read up on it before passing comment !
It boils down to a legal system and decision making. What would be the point of guilt or innocence if the end result meant that people disregard that process and continually chastise someone who has undergone such scrutiny.
Do you think you support a team with nearly a century and a half of players who were saints?
M god, the arrogance !!!! naive doesn't begin to cover it .Bin ont turf ? been nowhere in my opinion.

Bin_Ont_Turf
13-11-2014, 12:50 AM
'but see fit to advise me to read up on it before passing comment !'

I haven't 'advised', responded or even acknowledged that you have even posted on this thread (until now).

So pipe down Butterfly you utter gobsh1te.

Newcastleclaret1993
13-11-2014, 05:55 AM
I think the better question is why would a club sign him? Surely all it is going to do is cause rivalries an disagreement in the changing room (just like it is on this board), the club who signs him will get there tarnished nationwide and will struggle to get sponsors because no company will want to be associated with a convicted rapist.

ClaretsEngineer
13-11-2014, 06:21 AM
If the charges brought against him were rape against a child, there wouldn't be a discussion here, but it's not the case.

He has served his sentence as administered by law and should therefore be allowed back into work. The gripe here with many people, I suspect, is the particular job which he undertakes. Footballers are high profile people and are idolised by many, so yes it is equally right to say that a rapist shouldn't be allowed to continue with a high profile career. Morally at any rate.

What about the other party in this case? I presume she was happy to accept the hospitality of Ched Evans in the club / bar in which they were drinking? Being intoxicated is not a defence for any crime but it is reckless to be in such a state.

i wonder what the 157000 people, that patron bird of Sheffield etc will do if when the case is reviewed he is found to have been wrongly punished...

BereavementDividend
13-11-2014, 06:26 AM
Our club employs someone who had sex with a 15 year old girl when he was 31. - view external link (http://news.stv.tv/west-central/188848-teenager-who-assaulted-sex-shame-falkirk-fc-coach-avoids-jail/)

CardyTheClaret
13-11-2014, 06:34 AM
As soon as I saw the thread title I just knew there'd be some over the top drama-queenery from tybfc.

BereavementDividend
13-11-2014, 06:38 AM
Whilst I agree there is a lot of hyperbole on this thread I must disagree with your comment there CardyTheClaret.

tybfc's opinion is just as valid as the ones who oppose his viewpoint. I don't think you can say it is over the top, it's just how he feels. I don't agree with it, but respect it none the less.

My thoughts on the matter? Two drunk people had sex, he is convicted, served his time, and should now be allowed to pursue whatever he wants and if a football club wants to take on the burden of that, then that's up to them.

And if someone can't see the difference between a violent rape and what happened with Ched, then that's very unfortunate.

Steve_Harpers_Perm
13-11-2014, 06:40 AM
It's true he's done his time but for example if he was a teacher or social worker would there be support for him to return to his job?

We'll see what happens with his case when it reaches the court of appeal.

CardyTheClaret
13-11-2014, 06:41 AM
Whilst you disagree with me BD, I think you've just about hit the nail on the head with your comments.

tybfc
13-11-2014, 07:00 AM
Thanks cardy for the continuing insults.

Have a good day.

CardyTheClaret
13-11-2014, 07:01 AM
You too, sweetheart, don't them grind you down x

Claretforever
13-11-2014, 07:10 AM
He's served whatever time the system stated he should serve. Yes' I know he's been let out early, but that's the system we have, unfortunately.

I would normally say he should be allowed to return to his profession, like I would anyone else, but football is a bit different. Perhaps a better solution would be for him to return to the football profession, but instead of as a player, more on the coaching and back room side. I don't think it would have been as big of an issue then?

arise_sir_charge
13-11-2014, 07:13 AM
Couple of things here, I think role models and heroes are being confused. Ched will be a hero if he scores goals for his club, a role model is much different.

I assume he will be on the sex offenders register. This would exclude him from many occupations regardless of the gravity of his crime. Should pro footballer be added to that list? Perhaps it should. That would take the moral "he's done his time" argument out of it as he's effectively still serving time whilst a registered sex offender.

Claretdj
13-11-2014, 07:28 AM
I think the main problem here is that Evans has showed no remorse or guilt for the crime he's been found guilty of in a court of law, if he would of come out & apologized for his actions & maybe made a donation to a local charity he would of been seen in a better light... At no time as he publicly apologized to his victim which would of been the right thing to do & then try to move on with his life/career... Utc.

beddie
13-11-2014, 07:34 AM
He is a convicted rapist, not a convicted pedophile, there is a difference. What would your opinions be if he overturns this case?

cockneyclaret
13-11-2014, 07:41 AM
Such a difficult subject to comment on.
If it was in my line of work I wouldn't even be aloud near the premises let alone anything back from my employer.

As a talented footballer you are a rare commodity, yes millions can play but only a handfull actally make it.
If Sheffield don't take him up on a new contract there will be many that will.
Sadly backgrounds don't come into it in football!
Remember a certain graham rix

Jamb0MackemClaret
13-11-2014, 07:53 AM
He can't/won't apologise as he maintains his innocence.

My position might well be a contradiction BOT but it's a very difficult situation.

And whoever brought Michael Jolley into it, the two cases aren't remotely comparable.

The Bedlington Terrier
13-11-2014, 07:54 AM
Convicted of a crime.
Sentence carried out, time served.
Second appeal being considered.
Now released but living under the auspices of the National Probation Service.
Now on the Sex Offenders Register.
Salary/income stream stopped.
Now living constantly under the media spotlight.
If that's all not enough to cope with the anti-redemptionist movement don't want the lad to earn a living at his chosen profession.
Once and for all, footballers are NOT role models, they are lads who happen to be good at playing football. Micah Richards, Wayne Rooney etc etc are not considered to be role models in our house. Quite the bloody opposite in fact.
So for all of the sanctimonious sods out there - give the lad a break?

mansfieldCLARETS
13-11-2014, 08:00 AM
gets my back up with some of these people at shef united

1 he was found guilty
2 he was sent down
3 he is then release from prison on licence
4 he should then return to club to train
5 hes ok to play once his license has ended


simple :?

MJT
13-11-2014, 08:20 AM
If I was found guilty of such crime, do you think my company would keep my job open for two and a half years...

yosserhughes
13-11-2014, 08:21 AM
I really don't get this, Lee Hughes kills someone after drinking and then driving, does his time and plays football again.

I can't see what the difference is, in fact is rape worst than killing someone?

Darthlaw
13-11-2014, 10:15 AM
I don't get it either Yosser.

Lee Hughes - Kills someone after drink drive.

Luke McCormick - Kills two people after drink drive.

Marlon King - Sexual assault and ABH amongst countless other convictions.

Ched Evans - Stupid boy who put himself in the position where he could be convicted of rape (remember she has never said she told him no, just not that she remembers saying yes), and theres all this media attention to finish his career.

What he's done is classed as rape, no two ways about it. I understand that he wants to continue fighting the conviction if he truly believes that she gave consent on the evening, but its frustrating to see that he has an opportunity to educate young men on what they can be convicted of if they can't demonstrate absolute consent with whoever they go home with, and he's letting that opportunity go.

rickclaret
13-11-2014, 10:20 AM
I think we should just brand him for the rest of his life and stop messing about with people's moral judgements; stop him playing and get him doing a proper job. But if he is accepted back then at least stop him from going to all charity events or hospitals at Christmas; appearing in media; photos only with rapist photo-shopped onto his forehead, and just get him training and playing football in the development squad and have done with it. He will be earning and doing what he loves; I'm sure he will accept a low wage just to be playing again. We can't be fairer than that; an eye for an eye I say!

ClaretsEngineer
13-11-2014, 10:36 AM
''I think we should just brand him for the rest of his life and stop messing about with people's moral judgements; stop him playing and get him doing a proper job. But if he is accepted back then at least stop him from going to all charity events or hospitals at Christmas; appearing in media; photos only with rapist photo-shopped onto his forehead, and just get him training and playing football in the development squad and have done with it. He will be earning and doing what he loves; I'm sure he will accept a low wage just to be playing again. We can't be fairer than that; an eye for an eye I say!''

I've seen and heard some utter shyte in my short time on Planet Earth, but you must be from another planet. You must be a patron of The Sun (newspaper not the big bright thing in the sky).

You must have missed the 'couldnt remember saying yes, but equally couldnt remember saying no'

Hardly the same as a violent sexual assault in a dingy back alley.

A silly boy with too much money and f

Steve_Harpers_Perm
13-11-2014, 11:11 AM
'Give the lad a break'.

Maybe people would if he showed an ounce of remorse for his criminal conviction.

nil_desperandum
13-11-2014, 11:21 AM
"'Give the lad a break'.

"Maybe people would if he showed an ounce of remorse for his criminal conviction."

I'm not going to get involved in the main debate, but if he were to express remorse at this stage, would this not be prejudicial to his appeal?
It's quite a complex case.

LancasterClaret
13-11-2014, 11:24 AM
What nil said.

He believes he's innocent and is awaiting another appeal. It would be an admisson of guilt surely?

jojomk1
13-11-2014, 11:46 AM
He believe's he is innocent and is awaiting another appeal
Fair enough
If he wins any appeal then he can resume playing
The issues raised re Lee Hughes etc only go to show how some football clubs work with few if any principles

Darthlaw
13-11-2014, 12:10 PM
Principles in football? There are none.

Its a sport where cheating such as diving or trying to get your opponent sent off goes relatively unpunished.

A sport where players actively try to con the impartial officials by claiming for something as trivial as a throw in or corner when they know full well it isnt their set piece.

It goes right the way to the top with corruption throughout the governing body FIFA.

Either way, most fans of the sport won't give a monkeys whether he plays or not. My objection is to the media furore thats been stirred up for a bloke who basically slept with a girl who had far too much to drink and, due to it all happening behind closed doors, her explicit consent couldnt be confirmed. The fact she knows she didn't tell him 'No' but can't remember whether he said 'Yes' says everything about the complexity of this case.

To band anyone, footballer or not, above people who have killed, caused ABH or actually sexually assaulted someone is frankly ridiculous.

notnowbernard
13-11-2014, 12:19 PM
Divides opinion, no surprise. Notnow junior in the camp of served his time deserves another chance, as for me I wouldn't go on any game if he ever came to us.
That simply won't happen under Sean I might add

Claret_Russ
13-11-2014, 12:36 PM
I can't understand how anyone thinks banning him from playing football is justifiable. He'd be paid to kick a ball around and his conviction doesn't intefere with his ability to do that in any way. The amount of money he'd earn from doing it is completely irrelevant.

The role model argument is completely irrational. He could become a musician, actor, writer, politician, charity worker or pursue any number of other careers and still be deemed by some to be a role model. One assumes if he becomes a father he'll be a role model. Should he be banned from all of the above too?

I wouldn't want him at Burnley, and I can't understand why any club would want to sign him - but that is very different from believing there should be some legal restriction from Burnley or any other club offering him a contract.

claretchrish
13-11-2014, 12:37 PM
Most football clubs get rid of players whose bad attitudes or behaviour taint their brand.

Sheffield United probably think that employing a rapist improves theirs.

KeighleyClaret
13-11-2014, 12:38 PM
Its a tough one this. On the one hand he has served (some of) his time and is entitled to get on with his life. On the other hand he has shown very little sympathy for his victim. Even if he continues to protest his innocence the effect of the events on the girl could and should be acknowledged. I wonder if she will get her life back as easily as Evans appears to be doing?

Fact is that in very many jobs and professions this conviction would end his career (teaching, health care etc etc) so its just not a matter of serving time and being automatically placed back where you were. It wouldn't happen to any of us, I suspect. Getting on with our lives would mean very many changes, not including instant forgiveness i suspect.

The killer fact however is that the footballers lifestyle seems to lend itself to the exploitation of vulnerable women, and a particular form of misogyny that thinks its OK to travel 20 miles to have sex with a friend's girlfriend because she is drunk in a hotel ro

superdimitri
13-11-2014, 12:47 PM
What about this guy? Not sure how this ended but somehow I don't think he went to jail.

#Edit, oh he is playing for Sunderland now, nothing like good ol Poyet to have him in his team. - view external link (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2011/may/03/bolton-marcos-alonso-car-accident)

nil_desperandum
13-11-2014, 12:54 PM
"I certainly won't be at Turf Moor if he ever plays there in future and I hope others will feel the same"
So let's get this right.
Should Burnley be relegated and Sheff Utd. promoted, you'll not go to Turf Moor and support your own team?
I accept your moral stance, but why take it out on your own club, who can do nothing about it?

superdimitri
13-11-2014, 12:56 PM
You never know, someone on our team may feel obliged to offer him some of there own justice, should we ever come up against him :D

Steve_Harpers_Perm
13-11-2014, 04:56 PM
Maybe his lack of remorse is due to his appeal.

Interesting to know what his future teammates think of him should he earn a contract anywhere. Can't imagine too many of us being overjoyed turning up for work on a Monday morning to be told the new employee you'll be working alongside is a convicted rapist.

Rileybobs
13-11-2014, 06:25 PM
I knew this would be a good read. It's quite simple for me:

Of course he should have the legal right to earn a living as a footballer but Sheffield United should not offer him a new contract on moral grounds.

There is a huge difference between the two points.

Jarrow_Claret
13-11-2014, 06:56 PM
So for all of the sanctimonious sods out there - give the lad a break?

I must say I do agree with the majority of your post and he is going through a pretty torrid time at the moment. That said did he not bring on all this himself by either putting or allowing himself to be put into the situation in the first place.

I'm not sure whether I think he should be allowed to play Pro Football again I understand both sides of the argument. What I do know is that if he was serving in the Armed Forces and convicted of rape he would be looking for a new career right now with no chance of a reprieve. Unless of course his second appeal is successful.

NJclaret
13-11-2014, 07:10 PM
Although what Evans did is disgusting and disgraceful behaviour they guy has served his sentence. If we don't allow people to get on with their life after serving their sentence then may as well be a death penalty instead. Otherwise they will for the remainder of their lives claim benefits ue to not working and we all know what happens when people have idle time, they find ways to entertain themselves.

I say if a team wants to sign him then let it happen and deal with it

Montevideo
13-11-2014, 07:54 PM
On the plus side for Sheffield United , given Jessica Ennis Hill's stance it should be reasonably easy to change the stand to The Sick ***** Stand.

AuntSally
13-11-2014, 08:05 PM
'Maybe people would if he showed an ounce of remorse for his criminal conviction'

You don't show remorse for something if you're innocent. Remorse is regretting doing something wrong. If he didn't actually do anything wrong, he won't show remorse.

This has nothing to do whether I think he's guilty or not, just a reply to the above.

daveisaclaret
13-11-2014, 08:09 PM
Happen cheating on your missus with a girl who turns out to be too drunk to consent is doing something wrong regardless of if you think it's rape or not.

RileyBobs is 100% spot on btw, just so everyone knows.

tybfc
13-11-2014, 08:11 PM
AuntSally - 12 people on a jury who heard all of the evidence found him completely guilty.

AuntSally
13-11-2014, 08:20 PM
'AuntSally - 12 people on a jury who heard all of the evidence found him completely guilty'

That is completely irrelevant. If 10,000 people find you guilty and you know you didn't do it - you'd never show remorse. I point out my reply wasn't with regards to whether her should work again, or not, or even if I think he is guilty.

Remorse = guilty. Guilt should = remorse. This isn't guilt from a jury, this is guilt from within. Something he himself knows is true.

My thoughts is that he looks like a thug. He sounds like a thug. I think he is a thug and I reckon he did rape the victim. But that's nothing to do with my comment. My reply is down to the poster who said he should be showing remorse - well, he shouldn't, if he knows he didn't do it.

That's my point.

Darthlaw
13-11-2014, 08:31 PM
'AuntSally - 12 people on a jury who heard all of the evidence found him completely guilty.'

Not all of them did. The majority did initially after 4 hours, which could have been seven of them, which in turn goes to show how difficult the decision was. The judge however chose not to accept a majority verdict and sent them back out to deliberate further which forced them into a verdict less than an hour later.

The only people who know if she gave consent that evening are Evans and his 'victim', as is in the case in most sexual encounters. The jury had already decided she had given consent to McDonald by going back to his hotel with him but then had to decide if it was likely she consented based upon her evidence, footage on cctv in the hotel and testimony from staff at the hotel.

She definitely says that she didn't tell him no, just that she didn't remember whether she told him yes. He maintains se said yes.

Realistically whatever happened between Evans and the girl happened behind c

Eddie_M
13-11-2014, 08:55 PM
I wonder how many parents would take their child to a concert to see the child's favourite pop star knowing that one of the warm up artists was a convicted sex offender.

In this case instead of being their favourite pop star it is their favourite football team and the warm up artist is the opposition.

No right minded parent would feel comfortable about their child attending the concert in my opinion. So why a different standard when you take your child to a football stadium. :?

When children are part of the audience, the football clubs have a moral responsibility to them to ensure the product they are displaying is suitable for them. Watching a convicted sex offender kick a football about is not appropriate for children.

As long as he remains a convicted sex offender he should not be in first team football. I would go further and ban him from the stadium.

Eddie_M
13-11-2014, 09:08 PM
Also you know how mascots walk out on to the pitch sometimes holding hands with the players, would you feel comfortable with your child holding Ched Evans hand ?

tybfc
13-11-2014, 09:32 PM
NO. Thankfully we won't be playing them any time soon.

dy1geo
13-11-2014, 09:56 PM
The people who say Ched Evans has served his time so should be allowed to work in football cannot be hypocritical, in that the same should apply to a "*****phile etc" if they have served there time.

Ultimately in football money talks and if it is the case that sponsors will walk away he has no chance of being reemplowed. If I was a chairman I would take the view of Dave Whelan in that he sacked Marlon King and that in this occasion the crime of rape is so heinous that he shouldn't be allowed to play again.

cloughyclaret
13-11-2014, 09:59 PM
Now being debated on QT.

rickclaret
13-11-2014, 10:06 PM
Just to clarify to Engineer Clarets; I was being ironic; can't believe people would think another person would say such a thing so bluntly but it is what many have said, in varying ways, previously to my post and therefore I was trying to be ironic.
I don't believe, in what seems to be a complicated case,(only from what people have posted on here as I dont know the ins & outs of the case) that a person should be so victimised and scrutinised in the public. I am not condoning the act but to prevent him from carrying on with his life and being victimised in this way I think is wrong. Many on here would have him labelled and thrown out of society for good and I dont believe this eye for an eye nonsense; he's done what the laws say he had to do; he should be allowed back to play football. If you choose to not go and watch him then that is your decision but don't sit on the fence and say it is OK for him to play for another team but not mine; what a load of cra*; happy for others to be poi

AuntSally
13-11-2014, 10:10 PM
Some people on this thread could never be taken seriously anyway as they think rape has the same definition as pedaphilia.

That in itself is rather confusing, even before we read what they have to say about whether he should work again.

Steve_Harpers_Perm
13-11-2014, 10:13 PM
One of the patrons of which you speak Charlie Webster has been a victim of sexual abuse.

Probably just interested in her self image though...

oldcolner
13-11-2014, 11:34 PM
The FA needs to decide what is acceptable behaviour and adopt professional standards. In many professions convictions can stop people doing their former jobs. They have rules and then judge cases individually taking individual circumstances into account.

The fact that his friendsd the victim has made his situation worse ao I doubt he will get back in Sheffield.

Perhaps he should be freed from his contract and allowed to go abroad to try to reactivate his career away from the media hype. That way he can wait for his appeal to be heard and demonstrate he has learned his lesson and whether he still has the talent.

rickclaret
14-11-2014, 12:42 AM
when she was a minor and under-age, which is a different matter to this one.
I am saddened to hear that Charlie Webster had to go through that ordeal and that she has opened up about her life experiences; that is not an easy thing to do in public, and I hope she actively and publicly supports and is part of organisations and associations that deal with rape and sexual abuse and not just speaks about it for her own experiences as sympathy because she is a 'celebrity' who should be using this power to effect if she is really serious about such issues. Sad to see though she sold herself to FHM magazine some years ago; kind of loses credibility a little though and should not be resigning the position at Sheff Utd but standing up for her right 'to be a normal lass and a survivor' as she has said.

yosserhughes
14-11-2014, 09:05 AM
Lets say Ched Evans had raped a man and served his time and returned to his former club, would we have all the telly stars and sports stars coming out and complaining.

It would not even make the local paper.

spunkybackpack21
14-11-2014, 09:14 AM
Lets say Ched Evans had raped a man and served his time and returned to his former club, would we have all the telly stars and sports stars coming out and complaining.

It would not even make the local paper.

WTF?

spadesclaret
14-11-2014, 09:27 AM
"Lets say Ched Evans had raped a man and served his time and returned to his former club, would we have all the telly stars and sports stars coming out and complaining.

It would not even make the local paper."

Let's not. Let's stick to the facts as we know them.

The "telly stars and sports stars" are doing no more and no less than we are doing on this message board. They are stating their views and some are taking a stand. They simply have a bigger platform (the media) than we do because of their celebrity status.

the_quoon
14-11-2014, 09:33 AM
yosser's post is phenomenal(ly daft).

yosserhughes
14-11-2014, 09:43 AM
Sorry about the post but I just know why its Ched Evans.

Why are these people coming out and complaining about Stan Collymore wanting him remove from his well paid radio show for beating a women.

Which is as bad as rape in my book.

daveisaclaret
14-11-2014, 09:45 AM
You can always rely on CM

CardyTheClaret
14-11-2014, 09:53 AM
Yosser, are you on drugs? Let me get this right, if I trapped you in a room and gave you a choice of bumming you or giving you a slap, you'd shrug your shoulders and say either?

spadesclaret
14-11-2014, 10:02 AM
"Why are these people coming out and complaining about Stan Collymore wanting him remove from his well paid radio show for beating a women.

Which is as bad as rape in my book."

Which book is that, then? Have you ever read a book? Have you ever read about rape? I think you perhaps should. Perhaps then you'd stop spouting all this nonsense.

thedonz
14-11-2014, 10:23 AM
Should he not work anymore in football? don't think anyone can answer that question.
Could he not work anymore in football? - very possible the answer is Yes.

braindead
14-11-2014, 10:33 AM
Lets say Ched Evans had raped a man and served his time and returned to his former club, would we have all the telly stars and sports stars coming out and complaining.

Why are these people coming out and complaining about Stan Collymore wanting him remove from his well paid radio show for beating a women.

Which is as bad as rape in my book.

Congratulations yosser on two of the most unintentionally funny comments on this board in recent months.

Kudos.

Jamb0MackemClaret
14-11-2014, 11:31 AM
This thread is definitely living down to my expectations. Victim being placed in inverted commas is unpleasant enough, but yosser's post is incomprehensible.

pureclaret
14-11-2014, 05:18 PM
There are a lot of occupations that if you get a criminal record will mean that you are not able to carry on in that trade or occupation.

It is quite often not just the work you are to be doing but the view/ risk to others and that if people are looking to you as a role model/ hero you can not have a criminal record.

I worked in the financial sector and every year you had to sign to say you had not been convicted of any crime and that you did not have any loans or bad debts. If you had then this would be reviewed and could mean you would not be able to carry on in the role you had.
For serious offences then this would mean dismissal and not able to work in the financial sector again ever.

Footballers at the level Ched Evans means that he should not play professional football as he can not be considered to be fit and proper as a role model.

enola_gay
14-11-2014, 05:28 PM
This board has always had the capacity to stun you with stupidity but Christ on a bike, those posts from yosserhughes have raised the bar.

Imploding Turtle
14-11-2014, 05:33 PM
TIL that rape is not worse than assault.

jack_miggins
15-11-2014, 02:55 AM
Surely this is media hype? Would I give him a second chance? I was brought up to believe that you don't get a first chance.