Originally Posted by
ragingpup
What I'm confused about, and what I have learned on this thread is that through the withdrawal agreement you say (and I take on trust now, not got time to read) the EU have given us what we want in terms of the freedom to control our borders (good thing for me), the ability to make our own laws (good or bad dependent on who is running the country) and the ability to strike trade deals with other nations (good thing).
I don't even have time to go back over the 7 page doc you linked to this morning - wasn't there a commitment between the EU and UK to aim for tariff/friction free trade in the opening part? I thought I saw that but may have read it wrong as am crap at legal docs (as you see). If there is a genuine resolve in faith between the EU and UK to negotiate as close to that as possible, that ain't a bad outcome. If it isn't, then I'm concerend that we will be remorselessly penalised in the trade agreement for having our cake.
Where I differ from Davis, Mogg etc is that I always expected to get a battering from the EU (for same reasons you highlighted) but hoped that the public would become well informed that we couldn't have it both ways, see the light and pressure for a re-vote to give us either the option to remain or an informed willingness, through another democratic vote, to take the economic risks.
Biglad, GF etc are I think more on the side of Davis, Mogg in that they just want to get away, think we'll be fine and are willing to take whatever risks to secure a hard Brexit, ot at least believe they can force the EU to renegotiate more to our whims. My position is that I would not take that risk with this negotiating team or any from further right who are vying to replace her - I agree with you that the EU are not willing to give more to this government and their own red lines - but they would happily wait for a change of negotiating team via a GE or re-vote if this falls down. I say this as it would be hugely in their interests. You obviously don't see this so let's agree to disagree.