OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[Andy_Faber]

I don't think I was (wrong) but I'm equally incapable of sending links. That's why I said look at the Travelex Pound Euro history...then go to last six months. Bottomed out early October, then rose a little before bottoming again in first week of November. Since then it's been on the rise again. High Court decision was 1st week of November...draw your own conclusions.

I think you are onto a loser on this one R, amongst many pieces of fact I've published re £/euro exchange rates recently, here are two.

First, the current rate is within 5% of where it was in April, and that's almost 'lost in the rounding' for companies who hedge their foreign exchange dealings (I know because I do).

Second, the rate now is slightly HIGHER than it was in mid-2013, and I don't recall there being any panic then, and I double-don't recall anyone blaming the rate on us BEING in the EU

You would be better focussing on the £/$ rate which is a bit of a concern, for instance for R-R

EDIT; which also suggests that, when he focusses on a single line of argument rather than ranting like someone waving a bible in the market place, even TTR deserves a hearing

[swaledale]

I think you are onto a loser on this one R, amongst many pieces of fact I've published re £/euro exchange rates recently, here are two.

First, the current rate is within 5% of where it was in April, and that's almost 'lost in the rounding' for companies who hedge their foreign exchange dealings (I know because I do).

Second, the rate now is slightly HIGHER than it was in mid-2013, and I don't recall there being any panic then, and I double-don't recall anyone blaming the rate on us BEING in the EU

You would be better focussing on the £/$ rate which is a bit of a concern, for instance for R-R

EDIT; which also suggests that, when he focusses on a single line of argument rather than ranting like someone waving a bible in the market place, even TTR deserves a hearing

I don't think Tricky deserves a hearing, mainly because he has about as good a grip on economics as he has on geo politics! I'm still pissing myself from his complete balls up on NATO...cracker.

Your right on the £ against the Euro and that its the fall against the dollar which is worrying, because lots of things we use,are priced in dollars, I'm already looking at increases in excess of 10% for a lot of materials that are used in making things here, plus the increase in costs of manufactured items, oil and food which is going to hit those who voted Brexit the hardest.

[Andy_Faber]

The difference is that Leave actually peddled proven lies - the £350 million was plastered all over the cmpaign bus, its a bit convenient to say lets forget about that brazen lie (we don't even pay £350 million in the first place).

Yes remain predicted economic armageddon - overhyped but in reality as Brexit hasn't actually happened yet, the indications are showing that actually most of what they said economically is at the very least a distinct possibility, whereas none of leaves lies were even close to the truth.

The 37% is only relevant when Brexiteers say stuff like the "will of the people" and the legal status of the referendum is advisory if it had been a legally binding referendum then it could not have been overturned - if by recent events you mean the legal challenge to not letting parliament have a view on the terms of any deal, why would any leave campaigner have a problem with the UK sovereign parliament overseeing Brexit? After all that was one of the so called reasons for leaving the EU!

So I think we're almost on the same page on lies and deceit. You forgot to mention Osbourne's 'punishment budget' which he stated as fact before the vote but which never looked remotely like happening, so I reckon that sort of evens things up

So to try to find some more common ground. No doubt you would be happy for me to concede that the £350m was a lie, and ignored the simple bit of maths that we immediately get a £110m rebate on that, so we actually send £240m a week. Why the Leave campaign didn't focus on that number I will never know, but anyway. So, £240m. We then genuinely get back frfom EU around £80m per week in line-item subsidies. So that means we are net contributors to the EU of £160m per week. That fair? We could all argue about that number if you want

[Ram59]

I don't think I was (wrong) but I'm equally incapable of sending links. That's why I said look at the Travelex Pound Euro history...then go to last six months. Bottomed out early October, then rose a little before bottoming again in first week of November. Since then it's been on the rise again. High Court decision was 1st week of November...draw your own conclusions.

Yes, the conclusion is that any 'freefall' stopped at the beginning of October when as you say, it lifted a little before dropping back to the early October level. If you think the difference between the early October and early November rates is classed as freefall, then I think you need a new dictionary.

[ramspride]

Oh dear the Euro falling on fears about the no vote in Italy's referendum. It'll soon be on a par with the £ against the dollar. Still it won't matter it was only a referendum and not binding.

[Trickytreesreds]

Oh dear the Euro falling on fears about the no vote in Italy's referendum. It'll soon be on a par with the £ against the dollar. Still it won't matter it was only a referendum and not binding.

Strike one......

France next

[roger_ramjet]

You would be better focussing on the £/$ rate which is a bit of a concern, for instance for R-R

EDIT; which also suggests that, when he focusses on a single line of argument rather than ranting like someone waving a bible in the market place, even TTR deserves a hearing

I am not overly concerned abou a strong US Dollar - as most of my income is dollar iriented it makes my exports seem cheaper.

[ramAnag]

Yes, the conclusion is that any 'freefall' stopped at the beginning of October when as you say, it lifted a little before dropping back to the early October level. If you think the difference between the early October and early November rates is classed as freefall, then I think you need a new dictionary.

Well I've tried to be polite throughout but it's getting tedious. The facts simply are that the fall in the pound against the Euro reversed around the time of the High Court decision. Prior to that it had been in, more or less, continuous freefall/decline since the Referendum and if you can't recognise that there's little point in debating further. The other, more telling, points I've raised in response to Tricky I note you haven't challenged. As others have said the £/$ rate is probably of greater significance but the seismic events in the U.S. have obviously had a significant impact there so it cannot be considered to reflect the Brexit effect alone.

[ramAnag]

Oh dear the Euro falling on fears about the no vote in Italy's referendum. It'll soon be on a par with the £ against the dollar. Still it won't matter it was only a referendum and not binding.

This may come as a surprise RP but, despite the anti Europeans thinking we're all totally dominated by Brussels bureaucrats, the laws in Italy and the UK differ as far as referenda are concerned. As I understand it - not completely - the result in Italy is legally binding...in the U.K. it isn't . Vive La Difference!

[swaledale]

Strike one......

France next

Oh dear you really don't have a clue do you? Whats funnier is that you have qualms about showing how uninformed you are! I describe your incohrent ramblings as schoolboyesque, but they are not even at that level tbh!

I just love how people connect a series of events to a dissatisfaction with the EU, even citing Trump's election which clearly has **** all to do with the EU.

The referendum in Italy was about constitutional change, which would have given more power to the prime minister, it was not about the Euro or membership of the EU.

Furthermore, the coalition of political parties who supported the vote against the changes are not anti EU, though they are anti the eurozone.

Really if your going to participate in a discussion about a complex subject, you do at least have to demonstrate a semblance of understanding about the issues and at least be able to recognise what is fact and what is fiction!