Election Year or Fear!

[Trickytreesreds]

That's where your wrong, race "sensitivity" was part of the equation, but the far bigger issue was the fact that the girls were viewed as "worthless" or contributing to their own situation or even "willing " participants. The same issues were around other grooming gangs where the perpetrators were white. So contrary to your assertion, blaming it on "ethnic sensitivity" was the easier option, rather than admit, that the attitudes of the Police, social workers and other authorities was the key issue.

After all one doesn't have to look very far, to see widespread, misogyny, disregard of women, amongst the Police nationally in cases involving child abuse, domestic abuse not to mention the seemingly inability to bring successful prosecutions for rape

Anyway, the FACT remains that the vast majority of child abuse crimes are committed by white perpetrators. Something you and others like you who label every issue a "race" issue when it really isn't, don't seem to be able to understand. But then if you listen to an echo chamber of your own prejudices then that's hardly surprising.

Its certainly the case that there are issues around race, (although their impact on people like you is actually minimal) but Blaming it on "multi culturalism" is neither helpful nor accurate, you'd do well to actually get information from unbiased sources, rather than parrot the crap spun by people who have an alternative agenda. Until you do, you will just look rather stupid, not to mention a little bit xenophobic.

But I guess at least your prejudices are open, its obvious what you think, though not obvious that you think very hard.

Rubbish.

Apply population demographics against crimes committed and the results are damming.

Its facts like that, that you avoid. Blaming bias and predjudice.
Yes it was white girls abused.
because the situation was there to be exploited by one demograph of ethnicity. (Pakistani)
1. it was against the law in many ways- it was the perps fault not the vicims, no matter how much you try to white wash that
2. drugs and alcohol were used. They certainly were not wanting to be raped/peddled/passed around like a piece of meat
3. They complained, the authoritys didn't want to take it seriously and it was swept under the carpet.
4. You mention mysogyny? Go the whole hog then
The Muslim back ground of the perpetrators -
women are second class citizens/ white girls are beneath that/ they were easy to tempy with booze and drugs. In their eyes , their faith didn't condemn a lot in what they were doing.

The fight against grooming gangs is still being hampered by authorities’ fears that they could be called racist for documenting abusers’ ethnicity, an official has said.

A damning report by the Independent Inquiry into Child ***ual Abuse (IICSA) found child ***ual exploitation continues in all parts of England and Wales, a decade after it became a national scandal.

The report said children were being abused “in the most degrading and destructive ways” amid “extensive failures by local authorities and police forces”.

John O’Brien, secretary to the inquiry, called for a “cultural change” to ensure that child ***ual exploitation can be understood and prevented.

“We need to break the culture where people are worried that they might be accused of being racist just because they record factual information,” he told The Independent.


You keep apologising and trying to deflect the outrage, by blaming the likes of me for calling it out for what it is.

[Trickytreesreds]

Tbf Andy, I don’t think Swale is writing as an ‘apologist’ and I’m certainly not…I speak as someone who is wholly opposed, both practically and idealistically, to all forms of child abuse.
It’s interesting that you’ve never come back to clarify your strong objections to my initial post but that’s up to you.
I am glad that you recognise that abusers seem to be fairly evenly spread across the cultures…that’s certainly the case in my experience, and was the rationale behind challenging TTR’s predictable portrayal of Muslims as abusers.

My portrayal as you cal it.
Was in line with the topic of the thread. That Islam now manifests itself in many ways in UK society,
The grooming gangs were and are outrageous, but you have to look deeper than that, as to why it happened.

The word "racists" has been weaponised and used as a shield to cover up all sorts crimes and outrages committed by ethic minorities in the last 30 odd years.
Islam, is a force of its own. It now has spread into politics, where racial sectariamism, is a platform to get elected.

It will now get worse, as Labour is about to lose a huge proportion of its imported voters, that Blair instigated.

Stop covering it up. Face up to it and deal with it, as one nation , under one law.

The problem with the UK (AND EUROPE), is that mass immigration has occurred over a short space of time, with minimum integration.
The brains behind this hadn't thought it through.

As the USA under Biden are now finding out. The democrats were all boo hoo, let them come. Until its ended up in their own back yard and now they are screaming.
The irony being, the ones that are suffering there, are the legal immigrant poor, who voted Democrats.

Meanwhile, China/Russia have clear plans for expansion and their countries fIrst. The West gets softer and implodes under woke and race issues.
Trouble coming.

[ramAnag]

My portrayal as you cal it.
Was in line with the topic of the thread. That Islam now manifests itself in many ways in UK society,
The grooming gangs were and are outrageous, but you have to look deeper than that, as to why it happened.

The word "racists" has been weaponised and used as a shield to cover up all sorts crimes and outrages committed by ethic minorities in the last 30 odd years.
Islam, is a force of its own. It now has spread into politics, where racial sectariamism, is a platform to get elected.

It will now get worse, as Labour is about to lose a huge proportion of its imported voters, that Blair instigated.

Stop covering it up. Face up to it and deal with it, as one nation , under one law.

The problem with the UK (AND EUROPE), is that mass immigration has occurred over a short space of time, with minimum integration.
The brains behind this hadn't thought it through.

As the USA under Biden are now finding out. The democrats were all boo hoo, let them come. Until its ended up in their own back yard and now they are screaming.
The irony being, the ones that are suffering there, are the legal immigrant poor, who voted Democrats.

Meanwhile, China/Russia have clear plans for expansion and their countries fIrst. The West gets softer and implodes under woke and race issues.
Trouble coming.

Do stop shouting Tricky…using a bigger font doesn’t make anyone take any more notice of you.

The ‘topic of the thread’ as you call it is the impending elections on either side of the Atlantic. Islam, Muslims and *****philia hadn’t been mentioned until you resurfaced and the tone had been quite reasoned and rational.

Why not start your own thread in your capacity as the forum’s guest ‘foreign correspondent’? See how many people want a sensible discussion about immigration and Islam instead of piggybacking and catastrophizing an existing one.

[MadAmster]

Meanwhile, in other news.... announced on Dutch News today (TTR will like this one, I believe) the EU and UK are to cooperate on reducing/eliminating the use of the small boats to the UK by wannabe unregistered immigrants.

I've, purposely, not used the term "illegal" as, under the 1951 Refugee Convention, to which the UK is a signatory, refugees may settle in a place of THEIR choosing.

[swaledale]

Rubbish.

Apply population demographics against crimes committed and the results are damming.

Its facts like that, that you avoid. Blaming bias and predjudice.
Yes it was white girls abused.
because the situation was there to be exploited by one demograph of ethnicity. (Pakistani)
1. it was against the law in many ways- it was the perps fault not the vicims, no matter how much you try to white wash that
2. drugs and alcohol were used. They certainly were not wanting to be raped/peddled/passed around like a piece of meat
3. They complained, the authoritys didn't want to take it seriously and it was swept under the carpet.
4. You mention mysogyny? Go the whole hog then
The Muslim back ground of the perpetrators -
women are second class citizens/ white girls are beneath that/ they were easy to tempy with booze and drugs. In their eyes , their faith didn't condemn a lot in what they were doing.

The fight against grooming gangs is still being hampered by authorities’ fears that they could be called racist for documenting abusers’ ethnicity, an official has said.

A damning report by the Independent Inquiry into Child ***ual Abuse (IICSA) found child ***ual exploitation continues in all parts of England and Wales, a decade after it became a national scandal.

The report said children were being abused “in the most degrading and destructive ways” amid “extensive failures by local authorities and police forces”.

John O’Brien, secretary to the inquiry, called for a “cultural change” to ensure that child ***ual exploitation can be understood and prevented.

“We need to break the culture where people are worried that they might be accused of being racist just because they record factual information,” he told The Independent.


You keep apologising and trying to deflect the outrage, by blaming the likes of me for calling it out for what it is.

How the **** did you reach that conclusion? The outrage is purely confected by bigoted, xenophobic thickos like you, who it seems ignore the abuse that's being perpetrated by those who are white and focus purely on cases where there is an ethnic element.

The fact that you claim I was victim blaming, demonstrates quite clearly that you either cannot comprehend simple English - a common affliction of the racist gammon I find. because nowhere in my response to your pathetic polemic, did I blame the victims. Not sure why you bother to debate when you can't even understand what's been posted - its not hard really, you just have to read properly and avoid filtering it with your right wing bias!

I was actually clarifying, that far from child ***ual exploitation and the failure to take action on cases of domestic abuse and rape was down to the attitudes of the Police, Social Services and other authorities to TAKE THE VICTIMS SERIOUSLY as evidenced in the very low conviction rates for these crimes.

Neither did I suggest race wasn't a factor in some cases and merely that its convenient for those in authority to use sensitivity to race as an excuse, rather than admit they the fact "victim blaming" was a major factor.

You quote from any source that appears to back up your false claims - again I find that typical of people who are looking to support and agenda.

The recent Home office official report states:

The majority of child ***ual abuse gangs are made up of white men under the age of 30, an official paper has said.

The report, which covers England, Scotland and Wales and summarises a range of studies on the issue of group-based child ***ual exploitation (CSE), also known as grooming gangs, said there was not enough evidence to conclude that child ***ual abuse gangs were disproportionately made up of Asian offenders.

MM BUT CLEARLY YOU DON'T BASE YOUR VIEWS ON EVIDENCE DO YOU?

But obviously you swallow hook line and sinker, those reports which claim that its Asian Gangs that are the issue. I'm not saying they aren't, just not the major one here thats a skewed claim, made purely to advance a certain agenda as you well know, so cut the crap.

I did piss myself laughing when you mentioned applying demographics, sorry but you have shown no ability to understand and interpret demographics or statistics, so forgive me if I take that as you parroting another phrase spewed out by some tw@t online or on a right wing media channel. Jeez if your going to debate a serious subject, then you do need to keep within your ability or as you will make yourself look stupid, as you have done in your latest post.

As indeed is your faux rage of this issue, I'll wager I've had more dealings in reality with these sorts of issues than you have.

“The danger is that by focusing entirely on the ethnicity of the offender, we miss the bigger picture, which is how the unheard, the left-behind women and girls, are invariably the victims. That’s where the government’s attention and action should be primarily focused.”

OH LOOK, THE FOCUS SHOULD BE ON THE VICTIMS! Which is what I said in my last post, yes in certain cases (but not the majority) sensitivity to race was an issue. But by far the greatest issue is that women and girls in these circumstances are viewed by those in authority as being responsible in some way.

I even quoted the recent case where the murderer of a *** worker who has finally been convicted, was hampered by this victim blaming.

So all in all your last post, is wrong on many levels and demonstrates just how your thoughts are influenced by the cr@p you read online, rather than the product of genuine critical thinking and your not calling anything out for what it is, rather your using a particular series of events to falsely justify your obvious xenophobia, bigotry and racism.

I do try and have an honest debate with you, but **** me, you are rally thick sometimes!

[swaledale]

It seems a bit of a common trait amongst you apologists that you choose not to take into account population demographics when making such assertions. The last government study found that 81% of perpetrators were white, roughly in line with the population. Recent posts including but not exclusively your own are riddled with such ignorance

Its seems a bit of a common trait amongst closet racists to try and skew the facts and be a little clever with the statistics, when its actually rather more nuanced than that, even though the figures support what I was saying. How do you know I chose not to mention demographics?

Really not sure how you work out I was acting as apologist, I was merely pointing out the inconvenient fact that actually (as the official Home Office support stated) ethnicity isn't the big problem here, its a failure by those in authority to take vulnerable women and children seriously. Now it might suit the unthinking gammon to blame it on Asians, but that actually won't resolve the issue will it?

I get it that racists will be racists - but I live in the real world and would actually rather like to see the perpetrators of whatever ethnicity brought to justice and women and children protected. But then that's not the name of Trickys game is it?

[Trickytreesreds]

Do stop shouting Tricky…using a bigger font doesn’t make anyone take any more notice of you.

The ‘topic of the thread’ as you call it is the impending elections on either side of the Atlantic. Islam, Muslims and *****philia hadn’t been mentioned until you resurfaced and the tone had been quite reasoned and rational.

Why not start your own thread in your capacity as the forum’s guest ‘foreign correspondent’? See how many people want a sensible discussion about immigration and Islam instead of piggybacking and catastrophizing an existing one.

CORRECT, CURRENT IMPENDING ELECTIONS.

We have just had a new MP admitted, who campaigned on the demographics, of Gaza first?
A UK MP, elected on the back of a Muslim problem 3000 miles away.
The reasons why are there for everyone to see, but you think it's irrelevent.
Welcome to religious sectarianism in the electorate.

[Trickytreesreds]

Its seems a bit of a common trait amongst closet racists to try and skew the facts and be a little clever with the statistics, when its actually rather more nuanced than that, even though the figures support what I was saying. How do you know I chose not to mention demographics?

Really not sure how you work out I was acting as apologist, I was merely pointing out the inconvenient fact that actually (as the official Home Office support stated) ethnicity isn't the big problem here, its a failure by those in authority to take vulnerable women and children seriously. Now it might suit the unthinking gammon to blame it on Asians, but that actually won't resolve the issue will it?

I get it that racists will be racists - but I live in the real world and would actually rather like to see the perpetrators of whatever ethnicity brought to justice and women and children protected. But then that's not the name of Trickys game is it?

No you wasn't, and never have.
Youa re an apologist and always have been. Call out every wrong doing then.
There is no coincidence that the far left and Islamic radicalism and now partners in crime.

Here's a lovely video for you of what the current hate peddling is going on. Bearing in made this krank bussed himself in from Germany.
This behaviour is now dictating , who is voted in.
You've been rumbled before when it comes to racist accusations deary.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lHb...=MahyarTousiTV


So all in all your last post, is wrong on many levels and demonstrates just how your thoughts are influenced by the cr@p you read online, rather than the product of genuine critical thinking and your not calling anything out for what it is, rather your using a particular series of events to falsely justify your obvious xenophobia, bigotry and racism.

So which bit is xenophobic, bigotry, and racist then.

You are the equivalent of a 20mm cannon at a rabbit shoot, when it comes to trying to hush someone up. Corbyn has nothing on you

[ramAnag]

CORRECT, CURRENT IMPENDING ELECTIONS.

We have just had a new MP admitted, who campaigned on the demographics, of Gaza first?
A UK MP, elected on the back of a Muslim problem 3000 miles away.
The reasons why are there for everyone to see, but you think it's irrelevent.
Welcome to religious sectarianism in the electorate.

I don’t think it’s ‘irrelevant’…I just don’t think the circumstances and the individual concerned make it at all indicative of the issues that the next General Election will - or should - be fought on.
The exceptional circumstances of the Rochdale by-election and ‘Curious George’ are not high on most people’s list of concerns. He’s another self serving attention seeker…the political opposite of Farage but otherwise they have much in common.

[Andy_Faber]

How do you know I chose not to mention demographics?

I know you chose not to mention demographics because I read your post, you didn’t mention demographics

I know you chose not to take account of demographics because you never do when it’s inconvenient for your line of reasoning, the regrettable thing being that you drag people along with you. Your posts are riddled with prejudicial inaccuracies and unfounded assertions - try your assertion ‘there are more bad (U.K.) ‘Christians’ that bad (U.K.) Muslims - pure invention on your part which you never offered any substantiation for despite being asked to

Note also the lack of name calling in my post, something you seem addicted to - used extensively by you and your like to deflect from poor lines of argument