O/T. The Government's handling of Covid

[ramAnag]

Achievements include the Oxford vaccine, the nightingale hospitals, the economic and financial measures (in a finance guy and they literally took my breath away), vaccine approval

Note if you think I’m including you in my U.K. shaming I’m not, I think we’ve had that discussion elsewhere

Well yes, I agree...the Oxford vaccine will be a great achievement if and when it becomes available.
I’d love to agree about the Nightingale Hospitals and, back in the Spring I did think so...but they haven’t been ‘built’...they’re spaces that have been acquired and furnished but which we seemingly don’t have the staff to use.
The financial measures? I don’t feel equipped to comment. The amount of money must be truly staggering...incomprehensible. Was there any choice? I don’t know. Will it have to be paid back? Of course.
Vaccine approval? I have my doubts. The only vaccine that’s been approved is of Turkish, German and Belgian origin. Quite why the EU hasn’t been so approving yet is a concern, as is Hancock’s childlike enthusiasm to shout ‘we were first’, and that is a concern two medics of my acquaintance share.

[Ram59]

How is deploying the vaccine first an achievement?

There are stupid statements and there are STUPID statements. Is there one other person in this country who would agree that deploying the vaccine with minimal waste of time, not an achievement? By the time the EU starts deploying the vaccine over a million of our vulnerable people will have received theirs and will not die from this virus.

Let's imagine what's happened, HM GOV "we need this vaccine examined ASAP, get it done, no matter what the cost, people are dying"

The EU "now we've got to examine this new vaccine, let's organise a conference to decide how to split up the scrutiny, so everyone gets a look in. Pierre will work at it flat out for the maximum 35 hours a week (unless he's on strike). Georgio will work at if flat out, but has still got a weeks holiday that he must take before the end of the year. Christian in Poland will get on with it, as long as the Polish government get a bigger handout. Boris in Hungary will only release his findings, if Hungary gets a larger share of the vaccine. So, when everyone's ready, let us know and we'll arrange a conference in the next couple of weeks to decide whether to agree with the Brits (spit), the yanks and the Canadians. Don't worry there's no rush, it's not like it's an emergency".

[Andy_Faber]

I’m not going drag up another thread, but the media (and especially the BBC) are at it again - I listened to some late night stuff last night and noticed the phrase ‘overpromised/underdelivered’ seemed to come up a lot. Suddenly EVERYONE is at it, Evan Davies twice uttered a nonesense statement earlier to squeeze it in - it’s either a semi-co-ordinated attack or the journalist community have even less imagination than I give them credit for (and working among them in one of my jobs that’s not much)

[ramAnag]

I’m not going drag up another thread, but the media (and especially the BBC) are at it again - I listened to some late night stuff last night and noticed the phrase ‘overpromised/underdelivered’ seemed to come up a lot. Suddenly EVERYONE is at it, Evan Davies twice uttered a nonesense statement earlier to squeeze it in - it’s either a semi-co-ordinated attack or the journalist community have even less imagination than I give them credit for (and working among them in one of my jobs that’s not much)

But he does, repeatedly, ‘overpromise’ and ‘underdeliver’ - just as Trump did. They’re two of a kind, so maybe the ‘journalist community’ are just telling the truth. Personally I’ll believe Fergus Walsh over any Cabinet member every time.

Ram...I think your post simply betrays your anti European bias, but I certainly wish Boris was in Hungary.

[Andy_Faber]

Well yes, I agree...the Oxford vaccine will be a great achievement if and when it becomes available.
I’d love to agree about the Nightingale Hospitals and, back in the Spring I did think so...but they haven’t been ‘built’...they’re spaces that have been acquired and furnished but which we seemingly don’t have the staff to use.
The financial measures? I don’t feel equipped to comment. The amount of money must be truly staggering...incomprehensible. Was there any choice? I don’t know. Will it have to be paid back? Of course.
Vaccine approval? I have my doubts. The only vaccine that’s been approved is of Turkish, German and Belgian origin. Quite why the EU hasn’t been so approving yet is a concern, as is Hancock’s childlike enthusiasm to shout ‘we were first’, and that is a concern two medics of my acquaintance share.

I’m not going to pick holes in this, I think we are collectively getting too it picky about stuff, but your response shows that there’s been some good and some bad, and I’ll bend a bit to your POV and say some decisions have been clearly bonkers, but HMG are not being helped by the soothsayers. I’ve decided that the most constructive I personally can be to help the cause is do as I’ve been asked and persuade people I can influence to do the same. That’s so far resulted in one person not travelling out of tier 4 against the rules and one not travelling into tier 4 against the rules and I consider that far more constructive than criticism of the macro performance of the govt

[Andy_Faber]

But he does, repeatedly, ‘overpromise’ and ‘underdeliver’ - just as Trump did. They’re two of a kind, so maybe the ‘journalist community’ are just telling the truth. Personally I’ll believe Fergus Walsh over any Cabinet member every time.

Ram...I think your post simply betrays your anti European bias, but I certainly wish Boris was in Hungary.

Yes you are right about Fergus Walsh but for every Fergus Walsh there’s a Hugh Pym, who adds no true journalism to the piece, I’m listening to him now just trotting out stuff I’ve heard 100 times already. Waste of license fee

[Ram59]

But he does, repeatedly, ‘overpromise’ and ‘underdeliver’ - just as Trump did. They’re two of a kind, so maybe the ‘journalist community’ are just telling the truth. Personally I’ll believe Fergus Walsh over any Cabinet member every time.

Ram...I think your post simply betrays your anti European bias, but I certainly wish Boris was in Hungary.

RA, I think you know that it was an attempt at a lighthearted attempt to explain the reasoning for the difference in the approval time for the vaccine. Much of it was tongue in cheek, but was it that far wrong? The EU is a giant bureaucratic sloth, which seems unable to speed things up when needed.

You are correct of course, concerning Johnson and Trump over promising, there are many business leaders like them, that get where they are, by frequently being passionate and over optimistic. Unfortunately, they've carried over into the wrong job and I cringe at some of the claims they've come out with.

I'm a bit more cautious by nature and have done alright in life, but two friends of mine are very much in the 'Johnson' mould and are always over positive and almost reckless, both have built up two companies worth millions of pounds from nothing in the last 20 years.

[Andy_Faber]

RA, I think you know that it was an attempt at a lighthearted attempt to explain the reasoning for the difference in the approval time for the vaccine. Much of it was tongue in cheek, but was it that far wrong? The EU is a giant bureaucratic sloth, which seems unable to speed things up when needed.

You are correct of course, concerning Johnson and Trump over promising, there are many business leaders like them, that get where they are, by frequently being passionate and over optimistic. Unfortunately, they've carried over into the wrong job and I cringe at some of the claims they've come out with.

I'm a bit more cautious by nature and have done alright in life, but two friends of mine are very much in the 'Johnson' mould and are always over positive and almost reckless, both have built up two companies worth millions of pounds from nothing in the last 20 years.

I can relate to that. Aim low and stay grounded, aim high and if you get halfway you still look down on the crowd.

[Geoff Parkstone]

I can relate to that. Aim low and become a teacher, aim high and if you get halfway you still look down on the crowd.

I'm joking....................

My point being that its just been announced that the EMA / EU have finally approved the Pfizer vaccine

[ramAnag]

RA, I think you know that it was an attempt at a lighthearted attempt to explain the reasoning for the difference in the approval time for the vaccine. Much of it was tongue in cheek, but was it that far wrong? The EU is a giant bureaucratic sloth, which seems unable to speed things up when needed.

You are correct of course, concerning Johnson and Trump over promising, there are many business leaders like them, that get where they are, by frequently being passionate and over optimistic. Unfortunately, they've carried over into the wrong job and I cringe at some of the claims they've come out with.

I'm a bit more cautious by nature and have done alright in life, but two friends of mine are very much in the 'Johnson' mould and are always over positive and almost reckless, both have built up two companies worth millions of pounds from nothing in the last 20 years.

I think, in this case, you’re confusing ‘passionate and optimistic’ with ‘irresponsible and unrealistic’, Ram.
Might work in business when it may just be the individual’s own ambitions at risk. Not good qualities in a national leader...imo.