RA you are right I'm not going to try and defened a scum bag like Banks because it's obvious his Russian connections His Russian wife is only allowed to stay in this country because of the string pulling of Mike Hancock a major Putin admirer
I’ll take your word for it mista and I didn’t think Parky was being too ‘harsh’, Andy.
Apart from the monstrous lies and misleading of the public, what I was really referring to though mista, was the allegations about Aaron Banks and the Russians.
Aaron Banks essentially funded UKIP and was a major player in the funding of the Leave campaign, no one can disagree with that. As far as the Russians are concerned, they would be delighted to see a politically fragmented Europe...don’t think anyone would deny that either.
The question then is...how much truth is there in the rumours and suggestions of the allegedly over spending and electoral law breaking Mr. Banks gaining huge financial reward from the Russians for his part in playing the public role of UKIP/Brexit benefactor?
I happen to think that matters and I suspect the £1m you refer to mista is peanuts in comparison.
RA you are right I'm not going to try and defened a scum bag like Banks because it's obvious his Russian connections His Russian wife is only allowed to stay in this country because of the string pulling of Mike Hancock a major Putin admirer
Oh they would, because politicians were using immigrants as a scapegoat for the economic problems caused by the rich and then inflicted austerity on them! Plus as i said before, many quoted assylum seekers and non eu migrants as the problem which Brexit would solve, which just goes to demonstrate the utter ignorance of many!
Then Dutch news clearly isn't very good at stating the facts. The Spanish who aren't the only ones using an opportunity to try and get something - which is not actually Gibraltar reverting to Spain (they are not that stupid)- though quite why a remnant of the British Empire has a right to self determination is open to question, but I'm guessing if for example the Spanish had settled the Isle of Wight the Uk would be quite happy with that?
What has actually happened is, the British ambassador to the EU, Sir Tim Barrow, wrote to concede that Gibraltar would not necessarily be covered by a future trade deal with the EU. Spain will have a say in any such negotiations.
Now the Spanish politicians are saying that this means joint sovereignty will have to be discussed, but thats actually not the case- now it so happens that there are elections in Andalusia the region adjacent to Gibraltar, so its not too hard to see whats happening - still people believe literally everything any politician says..mm
What is it about the economic ruin that a no deal brexit would inflict upon the Uk that you want?
Sure there was a vote for Brexit - most hadnt a ****ing clue what they were voting for, but there wasn't any detail about the type of brexit - anyway whilst this deal is at least something, I very much doubt we will actually achieve Brexit - most people and politicians know that shooting oneself in the foot or ****ing the economy of a country is not a sensible option on some vague idea of "taking back control".
Apparently Boris Johnson went back to his matrimonial home and discovered you cant leave and get the same benefits as before!
Andy...you can sympathise with those you describe as ‘the left behind’ as much as you like and it’s perfectly understandable. What you can’t reasonably suggest is that it wasn’t foolish and ignorant to use the Brexit vote to protest against ‘non EU immigration’. It self evidently was and Swale is demonstrably right.
P.S. Thought Blair was completely right this morning on Andrew Marr. Talked more sense in five minutes than Corbyn has in his entire time as Labour leader or Rees Mogg and Co. have in the whole of their over privileged lives.
Last edited by ramAnag; 25-11-2018 at 11:12 PM.
Yes I can suggest it wasn't foolish and ignorant. It wasn't ignorant because being ignorant is 'lacking knowledge or awareness' and the folk I've listened to (and I'll say again, I get around a bit so it's a lot) were in full awareness that the vote wasn't directly about non-EU Immigration, just as they were in full awareness that the vote wasn't even meant to be soleley/mainly about inter-EU immigration. I would argue that it was those who initiated the vote in the hope that it would put the EU question 'to bed' for good were the ignorant ones, lacking knowledge or awareness of the mood of the folk who put them in their position of power. Whether it proves to be foolish is for history to decide, and I'd suggest that anyone who has already decided that they can read the future on this is suffering from another great vice, arrogance. I'm prepared to wait and see, and revisit their foolishness or otherwise.
Oh it worked alright, as If we achieve Brexit, without staying in the customs union and single market, those "left behind" will find out, as those members of the actual elite get the low wage, low regulation economy they dream of, which basically means they will make millions (on top of the millions they are trying to make by short selling due to brexit) at the expense of the "left behind" who will find themselves in a US style economy which exploits those very people who voted leave.
Of course its ignorance - they dont understand the positives that immigration brings, but they will bear the pain if its stopped - though in reality - they will find that oly low skilled immigration will be stopped - the Uk would flounder without skilled migrants and they will find themselves forced to do the low paid unskilled insecure jobs they haven't shown much inclination to do to date!