Poor, clueless, woeful

[somersetcrewe]

Allegations leveled at Steve Davis after Yeovil .............but curiously not after Leyton Orient!?!
But that's because he got it right at Brisbane Road. I just wish some would come out and acknowledge it for the sake of balance.

I don't know about you but I think it's clear why there was a difference - and no, not because Yeovil were great and Orient poor.
It's that old problem we have whereby if a team denies us space to play, compresses the game and shuts us down, we are stifled and struggle. Yeovil did that, Orient didn't.
I recall Cheltenham did the same at their place. It will be interesting to see if they adopt the same energetic style tomorrow.

I guess it is a compliment to us in a way that teams set up against us to do this, even if it is frustrating that we don't appear to be able to combat it. But we are not alone, it happens to the best. Anyone recall Man City's Champions League encounter a month or so ago in Glasgow?? Celtic gained a creditable draw that night applying similar tactics that Man City seemed powerless to defy.
Does that make Guardiola poor, clueless ........... woeful??

I think we will win tomorrow with lessons learned.

[Proggs]

Allegations leveled at Steve Davis after Yeovil .............but curiously not after Leyton Orient!?!
But that's because he got it right at Brisbane Road. I just wish some would come out and acknowledge it for the sake of balance.

I don't know about you but I think it's clear why there was a difference - and no, not because Yeovil were great and Orient poor.
It's that old problem we have whereby if a team denies us space to play, compresses the game and shuts us down, we are stifled and struggle. Yeovil did that, Orient didn't.
I recall Cheltenham did the same at their place. It will be interesting to see if they adopt the same energetic style tomorrow.

I guess it is a compliment to us in a way that teams set up against us to do this, even if it is frustrating that we don't appear to be able to combat it. But we are not alone, it happens to the best. Anyone recall Man City's Champions League encounter a month or so ago in Glasgow?? Celtic gained a creditable draw that night applying similar tactics that Man City seemed powerless to defy.
Does that make Guardiola poor, clueless ........... woeful??

I think we will win tomorrow with lessons learned.

Nah! Not having some of that!!

3 points:

I defo came out and said it!

Same could be said of those who wax lyrical after one win but say little about the run of 7 without

One win against LO away, though a good win, but a team who have not had a result at home for 6 before our visit is hardly vindication?!?!

Oh and point 4. LO were better than Yeovil, so work that one out folks, but both were poo.

(in my LO reply post to Somerset, I did mention the "team that only wins", the one he picked v LO but hadn't since last win. I must be a genius )

[Proggs]

Well that was poor, clueless and woeful!

The usual defensive/worry display that means we need to concede to improve.

1 1 v 10 men.

Clueless indeed. We are a good team with stifling tactics and motivation.

so, 1 from 10 inc cup!!! Super Davis....

[somersetcrewe]

I defo came out and said it!

Did you? Good man, we agree! 

Same could be said of those who wax lyrical after one win but say little about the run of 7 without

With respect, not the same thing.
I was arguing for balance. It’s amazing how many go quiet when, in all honesty, they have something to shout about. I don’t need to say anything about the 7-match winless run – because everyone else has said it!!
But if by “waxing lyrical” (as you put it), you think I’m suggesting all is rosy again after one win, I'm afraid I must have misled you.

One win against LO away, though a good win, but a team who have not had a result at home for 6 before our visit is hardly vindication?!?!

Never suggested it was.
Balance.

Oh and point 4. LO were better than Yeovil, so work that one out folks, but both were poo.

You think so?
Not how I saw it.
To me, one looked like they had won 3 on the bounce, the other looked bereft of confidence.

[somersetcrewe]

Well that was poor, clueless and woeful!

Not brilliant I agree, but not quite as bad as that.
Yes, it was only Cheltenham – and Cheltenham with a man down for an hour – but haven’t we always been like this? Always find it hard to break down 10 men.
Gillingham aside in 2012, I can’t recall too many other occasions before or after where we over-powered teams with a man advantage.

I just wish we didn’t keep trying to go through them and not try going around – lacked width.
Excellently crafted equaliser though. Definitely worth a mention!

The usual defensive/worry display ......

I agree defensively we were suspect today, especially at set pieces. They looked like they could score at any time from those. Definitely worried about that.

...... we need to concede to improve.

I might agree with you if I understood what you mean

...... so, 1 from 10 inc cup!!! Super Davis....

Far from super!

[ruocul]

I also said they were woeful, clueless, and useless. And I 100% stand by the opinion based on the displays I have witnessed this season. Totally unacceptable.

Would guess Somerset you have not been to the home games? If you had you would have heard the complaints from hundreds of supporters who are sick and tired of the garbage we have endured for years now.

[somersetcrewe]

Would guess Somerset you have not been to the home games?

I was in the GRE when we played Yeovil.
I certainly noticed the atmosphere was a lot different to what I'd witnessed elsewhere.
A long way to travel for little enjoyment.
I'll stick to away games for the time being

[bigroof]

I also said they were woeful, clueless, and useless. And I 100% stand by the opinion based on the displays I have witnessed this season. Totally unacceptable.

Would guess Somerset you have not been to the home games? If you had you would have heard the complaints from hundreds of supporters who are sick and tired of the garbage we have endured for years now.

The usual over-the-top comments from lukcour/ruocul. Hundreds? This season? The team could perhaps be doing better - perhaps - but the ship has been stabilised, if not turned around properly. Most fans recognise this. People will moan - anywhere - at points dropped, but the 'boo levels' are nowhere near what they were last season, and before.

Of course the division is poorer - the clue is in the name. Davis's and Collins' team though don't seem clueless to me. The 4-4-2 pattern is clear. Perhaps when Bingham plays with Jones, they don't achieve the right defensive/attacking balance in that area. When Hollands plays, usually with Jones, it's more defined; and I don't agree that the midfield are backing off. The wide midfield places have been claimed by Cooper & Kiwomya, over Ainley & Kirk (and add Lowery to that).

Some teams set up to stop us playing. Those that don't, particularly, obviously feel they should be beating us; that gives us more space. Those that come to stop us, are well-coached, in my opinion, regardless of their players' abilities on the ball. The first goal, as the manager has being saying, is very important; having said that, this season Crewe have come from behind several times, and that's something that's been lacking in recent seasons.

My own criticism would be: flogging Dagnall & Lowe, his flagship players. You can understand why. They're on good wages for Crewe, you'd expect. They can get a goal, of course, but ultimately Udoh & Saunders have to be trusted with more minutes on the pitch, as the two older players are not going to run around for 46 matches. saunders has had an injury again, and I know he's not highly regarded by many; but why shouldn't he thrive, as Cooper has done, at this lower level? We, and he, will never know unless he has some chances. Udoh looks reliable in keeping the ball when it comes to him, and makes sensible passing options; he's feeling his way into professional football.

The management could also veer away from the orthodox 4-4-2 at times; perhaps the diamond with Kirk at its attacking tip? They experimented with that against Wolves' under 21's; Lowery showed up well there too.

I'd just be interested to know what alternatives others may have in mind: those who say the management are clueless for example? Given the players we have, how else should we go about things?

[England_First]

Some great points raised in this thread, on both sides of the debate, here's my take for what its worth,

Davis, yes, he has turned us around I guess, but then it was him who had turned us the wrong way in the first place.

Dagnall & Lowe, good signings from Davis, this pair give us a chance in most matches, but these lads have a combined age of 68, they need to be looked after, which the brings us nicely to Udoh and Saunders, both these lads need game time, and if not with us at the present then loan one of them out to a national league side, strikers are all about confidence.

This division is obviously poorer, but I have to admit I am surprised at just how poor it is, you can only play what is in front of you but surely to god we should end up in the top 10 as a minimum.

Why has nothing been done to address the back 4, why over the last so many season have we moved on decent CB's, Artell and Ellis and have never replaced them, its a glaring problem as any ball pumped high into the box causes instant panic, shipping 5 against Wycombe highlights this, we also have that type of performance in us.

Still no plan B, Yeovil was a classic case, we were ok 1st half, looked good going forward, only bad luck kept us from being in front, but come the 2nd half because we hadfailed to break them down we just slipped into our shell and nothing was done to alter it, worrying.

Watching the Alex this season is more positive experience, I know enter the stadium thinking we will get something form every match, not something I have felt for a few seasons, however, Davis was largely the reason we are back in the league, the club have been very generous in keeping him on-board still, or they cant afford to pay him off, but even if we were to win promotion I would hope he moves on, another club may come in for him, and as he has shown with interviews at both Burnley and Wolves he is ambitious, so for me it would be thanks, you have righted your wrong but you are free to move on.

[jamesdad]

Like the rest of you I am not a manager and only have an opinion as a footballer supporter.I feel the time is up for SD. We had an hour to break down a 10 man team and come away happy with a draw. He never appears to have a plan B and his tactics seem wide of the mark.
The players are trying harder but will respond more if we had a new face at the helm and not the promotion of a member of staff from within the club.

Division two is very poor in football terms and so is the football we are playing so its time for a change