Ot- May calls for election in June.

[swaledale]

I'm in exactly the same position, the combined votes of the opposition would not topple our MP, but then again if a few thousand apathetics did it might make a difference!

[swaledale]

Yeah people don't spoil your vote. Just mark x for the Conservative party.

Thats spoiling your ballot paper IMO!

Its actually more likely in my personal interests to vote Conservative! yet I'm astounded that people who it clearly isn't in their interests who do vote Tory, anyone in public services for a start!

[Romanis]

How much will security be a factor come Thursday at the ballot box?
Normally a terrorist attack so soon before an election would have devastating effects on the ruling party p Spain's train bombing.
Here we've had 2 in 2 weeks during the final stages of the campaign.
However perhaps Senor Jeremy's pacifism or whatever you want to call his strange security policies, is not allowing this to be the death knell it normally would. In fact will it instead strengthened the Madame's hand? Despite it happening under her watch!

[Andy_Faber]

Take your point and arguably, for the same reasons as you, having already voted I too may have 'wasted' my vote but, just out if interest...when was the last time you did actually have 'faith in any of the parties on offer'?

Would you like me to tick each party off in turn? Quite happy to!

For now, I'll just focus on The Conservatives, who I was most likely to vote for, say, at the turn of the year. They were on a last chance with me after the National Insurance U-Turn, then used up that chance with the dementia U-Turn. I actually agreed with the dementia proposal as it was first documented, despite the fact it may well 'cost me' in the future, but the Conservatives' desperation to 'clarify' smacked of desperation. I don't agree with all this U-Turning, IMO they and all parties should decide on policy, justify it in statement and debate, and let the polls decide, I believe the conservatives would say just about anything to get elected given recent efforts.

Labour?

[swaledale]

Would you like me to tick each party off in turn? Quite happy to!

For now, I'll just focus on The Conservatives, who I was most likely to vote for, say, at the turn of the year. They were on a last chance with me after the National Insurance U-Turn, then used up that chance with the dementia U-Turn. I actually agreed with the dementia proposal as it was first documented, despite the fact it may well 'cost me' in the future, but the Conservatives' desperation to 'clarify' smacked of desperation. I don't agree with all this U-Turning, IMO they and all parties should decide on policy, justify it in statement and debate, and let the polls decide, I believe the conservatives would say just about anything to get elected given recent efforts.

Labour?

Actually the labour proposal on care costs which was a 20% tax across all estates would be fairer, rather than just hitting those who lose out in the wealth lottery, that and recognising that dementia is an illness and making proper provision for it within a combined NHS and social care plan, one which would actually save money!

As for Labour, a good slightly left of centre bunch of policies that a hell of a lot of people agree with and costed openly which is more than the vague uncosted proposals of "not very strong and definately not stable" May

[Andy_Faber]

Actually the labour proposal on care costs which was a 20% tax across all estates would be fairer, rather than just hitting those who lose out in the wealth lottery, that and recognising that dementia is an illness and making proper provision for it within a combined NHS and social care plan, one which would actually save money!

As for Labour, a good slightly left of centre bunch of policies that a hell of a lot of people agree with and costed openly which is more than the vague uncosted proposals of "not very strong and definately not stable" May

Your maths are totally unsound Swale, don't be blinded by the fact its a Labour policy

Anyway, for Ramanag's benefit, on to my reason for not voting Labour - there are actually two. 1. Diane Abbott, seriously. 2. As Corbyn and his rear gunner McDonnell have improved their performance and put their policies over so well to a point where they might do a Leicester, so the Labour MPs previously so critical of him have pulled their heads well below below the parapet in the hope they will end up being forgiven and land some cushy cabinet job. No thanks, I don't want anyone to be that desperate to be running the country, and again as with the cons, they've U-turned (individually, not collectively).

[Andy_Faber]

Actually the labour proposal on care costs which was a 20% tax across all estates would be fairer, rather than just hitting those who lose out in the wealth lottery

'Here's The Math'.
Dementia sufferer A with an estate of £1m. Dementia sufferer B with an estate of £100k
Gross cost of dementia care £500k
Under the Conservative method, A pays £500k, B pays nothing
Under the Labour method, A pays £200k, B pays £20k

Am I missing something?

And calling it a 'Wealth Lottery' is demeaning to those like my dad who chose not to smoke 40 fags a day, piss twenty pints up the wall three times a week, bust a ******* in local engineering firms to a) buy his own place and b) pay the mortgage offand who actually 'planned for retirement' from a relatively early age.

[KingCharlieGeorge]

I'll have a go at showing that the Tory policy (anyone actually know what the policy is?) is unfair.

It is aimed aimed at the 90%, rather than the top 10% of wealth owners. The top 10% will not have to sell houses to pay for social care, because they have more than enough of the wealth to easily afford the costs. Nearly all the wealth was produced by the activity of the 90%, the top 10% keep nearly all the wealth. Most of the people paying the social care costs will be people with properties with values between £100-440K. So basically most people could be caught by the policy, but certainly not the very rich.

Because it is our efforts that produce the wealth I would suggest we have paid more than enough for our social care already.

Just remind me, because I don't remember it, did Thatcher say we want you to buy your own house so you can pay for your care costs when you're old?

[ramAnag]

Your maths are totally unsound Swale, don't be blinded by the fact its a Labour policy

Anyway, for Ramanag's benefit, on to my reason for not voting Labour - there are actually two. 1. Diane Abbott, seriously. 2. As Corbyn and his rear gunner McDonnell have improved their performance and put their policies over so well to a point where they might do a Leicester, so the Labour MPs previously so critical of him have pulled their heads well below below the parapet in the hope they will end up being forgiven and land some cushy cabinet job. No thanks, I don't want anyone to be that desperate to be running the country, and again as with the cons, they've U-turned (individually, not collectively).

I'm a tad jet lagged Andy but I think you may have misunderstood. I'm not having a go or asking you to defend yourself. As I recall you were a reluctant 'remainer' in the referendum and a reluctant Cameron voter in the election. This time you've opted to spoil your paper but I just wondered when was the last time you could vote with real commitment. I know he went wrong but for me it was for Blair...think that was the only time I've ever really believed in a leadership candidate.

[Andy_Faber]

I'm a tad jet lagged Andy but I think you may have misunderstood. I'm not having a go or asking you to defend yourself. As I recall you were a reluctant 'remainer' in the referendum and a reluctant Cameron voter in the election. This time you've opted to spoil your paper but I just wondered when was the last time you could vote with real commitment. I know he went wrong but for me it was for Blair...think that was the only time I've ever really believed in a leadership candidate.

I didn't think you were having a go I thought it was a straight question that maybe I misunderstood as being when did I lose faith in the bunch of wazzocks this time round....I hadn't even finished yet!

I voted LibDem (despite the waste of time vote etc) in 2015 because my belief was that if Clegg had enough perseverance to put up with another five years of being bum****ed by Cameron, he (and the LibDems) may put the brake on some of the Conserves more wacky policies. No-one else did, and look where we ended up...