O/T Tommy Robinson Speaks About Manchester Terror Attack

[ragingpup]

I think what will hurt my children more is having a Labour government with Corbyn as PM, when he wants to let in so many more potential terrorists.

I disagree - I think of the three main parties, Corbyn is the one most likely to actually DO something in terms of border controls but not for the reasons you would like. In summery, I think people are right in that mass immigration is generally encouraged by this and previous governments is because the corporations that will always put pressure on the government and industry generally want low wages, and the first thing to do here is have far more workers than jobs. Therefore people will undercut one another to do the same job = lower wages, more profits. I see no reason, despite her rhetoric and her shameless playing up on this in order to lure in UKIP and working class voters who are the ones who suffer from the arrangement.

Historically, Corbyn is against the principle of immigrants being pulled in to undercut current UK citizens and I am certainly convinced that he is, despite the pressures of 'playing the game' that even he falls to on occasion, a man who will act in the best interests of the 'average' working people in the country. Same principles as Tony Benn on the EU.

Much more likely to do something about the problem.

[Ellis_D]

Two wrongs don't make a right, you can't defend that Ellis by blaming 'celebs'...

Two wrongs don't make a right, but even if the reason WAS a selfish one, they were still trying to raise money for a little girl dying of cancer, so it was for a very good cause.

I'll tell you what's even worse though, the charity involved REFUSED to accept the money, despite the little girl needing life saving treatment quickly. The parents of the girl wanted to accept it, but as the charity were the official ones in charge of the donations, they were powerless to act. So out of some pathetic hatred of the EDL (I call it pathetic and uneducated, others may call it justified), the little girl was denied some money that could have helped save her life. So whose morals and principles are in the wrong place there? I'll tell you who, that idiotic left-leaning charity, because that little girl is now dead. More blood on the hands of lefties because of ridiculous policies and pathetic so called principles.

Oh, and Tommy Robinson and Kevin Carroll both attended the little girl's funeral. No-one from the charity did.

[Ellis_D]

he doesn't though, thats the point, and that's why of all the folk who are tagged as blinkered, you, and those that think like you, are the most short sighted of them all, been flannelled by cheap no marks like farage, its a crying shame.

He said, amongst many other things, that we should allow all the 'refugees' at Calais entry to Britain if they had 'family connections' here. Having seen what the men at Calais act like, I'd say they are not the kind of people we want to be welcoming here.

And with the fact all you see is men trying to jump on trucks, it's even worse. If women and children need saving from war, that's a different story. Men should be there fighting to save their own countries and a future for their children, not running like cowards. That is, of course, if they really are running from war, and not in actual fact, would-be-terrorists or economic migrants.

[rolymiller]

It makes me smile when obviously working class people refuse to vote for Labour or some other left wing party. The Labour party was founded with the support of unions ie workers. I can sort of see why some working class people might vote Tory etc if they have made a few bob for themselves in order to protect their wealth although I would question the morality of doing this-forgetting where they came from/ all the sacrifices their forefathers have made for them etc. The Tories are only interested in pleasing big business and people with money they are not bothered about the ordinary person on the street who is scraping a living. I accept that Labour are not perfect and have their foibles but they have ordinary people, like you Ellis, interests at heart. Right wing groups like UKIP have no interest in workers pay and rights and are only interested in deflecting blame and scapegoating ordinary people for all the countries ills. How many times have they blamed the bankers for the sh it state this country is in?

[monty_rhodes]

So, which policy decision would be disastrous, in that case Monty.......

Also love the fact that you're picking up on what i post rather than some of the unsavoury stuff posted, but heyho, that's life.

Now, MMM, you should be flattered I read your stuff. Interesting that you refer to Corbyn stating that UK foreign policy was to "blame" even if only as you say "partly." On The World at One just now two points were addressed on this. Firstly, it was strongly suggested that this is crap and merely giving credence to the terrorists own narrative. Secondly, when confronted with this view Labour spokespeople including the lamentable Baroness Chuckabutty (laughably Shadow Attorney General) denied that Corbyn had suggested any such thing, that it was all mischievous misinformation and that his comments were aimed solely at future conflicts and that these should only be undertaken with a PLAN! Corbyn, Abbot and Chuckabutty coming up with a plan. I can hardly wait.

[millmoormagic]

Two wrongs don't make a right, but even if the reason WAS a selfish one, they were still trying to raise money for a little girl dying of cancer, so it was for a very good cause.

I'll tell you what's even worse though, the charity involved REFUSED to accept the money, despite the little girl needing life saving treatment quickly. The parents of the girl wanted to accept it, but as the charity were the official ones in charge of the donations, they were powerless to act. So out of some pathetic hatred of the EDL (I call it pathetic and uneducated, others may call it justified), the little girl was denied some money that could have helped save her life. So whose morals and principles are in the wrong place there? I'll tell you who, that idiotic left-leaning charity, because that little girl is now dead. More blood on the hands of lefties because of ridiculous policies and pathetic so called principles.

Oh, and Tommy Robinson and Kevin Carroll both attended the little girl's funeral. No-one from the charity did.

So, there you go again, the charity is an "idiotic left leaning organisation" because it refused the money from an obviously politically motivated 'walk' in aid of the little girl, and lets be straight here, that's a cheap shot regarding the girls death, you, nor i, nor anyone i would suggest could predict that not getting another few hundred quid led to her death, once again, its you and the EDL playing politics with the girls life, plainly.

[millmoormagic]

Now, MMM, you should be flattered I read your stuff. Interesting that you refer to Corbyn stating that UK foreign policy was to "blame" even if only as you say "partly." On The World at One just now two points were addressed on this. Firstly, it was strongly suggested that this is crap and merely giving credence to the terrorists own narrative. Secondly, when confronted with this view Labour spokespeople including the lamentable Baroness Chuckabutty (laughably Shadow Attorney General) denied that Corbyn had suggested any such thing, that it was all mischievous misinformation and that his comments were aimed solely at future conflicts and that these should only be undertaken with a PLAN! Corbyn, Abbot and Chuckabutty coming up with a plan. I can hardly wait.

So, are you gunna answer my question or just chuck cheap jibes into the mix.....tick tock, as you might say in another guise...

[ragingpup]

Two wrongs don't make a right, but even if the reason WAS a selfish one, they were still trying to raise money for a little girl dying of cancer, so it was for a very good cause.

I'll tell you what's even worse though, the charity involved REFUSED to accept the money, despite the little girl needing life saving treatment quickly. The parents of the girl wanted to accept it, but as the charity were the official ones in charge of the donations, they were powerless to act. So out of some pathetic hatred of the EDL (I call it pathetic and uneducated, others may call it justified), the little girl was denied some money that could have helped save her life. So whose morals and principles are in the wrong place there? I'll tell you who, that idiotic left-leaning charity, because that little girl is now dead. More blood on the hands of lefties because of ridiculous policies and pathetic so called principles.

Oh, and Tommy Robinson and Kevin Carroll both attended the little girl's funeral. No-one from the charity did.

Been meaning to say something about Tommy and trying to find time to review some of the videos and comments from both sides.
This 'mini thread' on this unfortunate incident is a good point to comment.

First of all, in looking at the videos and some public reaction to them, it's true that the police don't come out looking great in that moment, nor do some of the Muslim responses. I've looked to see if I can find any direct evidence (in the limited time available) of BF actively using racist language per se. I was interested in his appearance with at a Q&A with students at Oxford (on YouTube where he makes some very good points and in this context, I can understand where he's coming from and appreciate the energy and concern behind his work.

However, these are limited observations and am always willing to review these points if someone directs me to contrary evidence. In the meantime, I'm taking him at face value on the evidence I've looked at.

However, what I am concerned about is not so much the message but how they choose to present it. Looking at this 'charity walk' for a little girl, I can appreciate their thoughts and taking the time to make a considered gesture. What sticks in the craw though, and for me cheapens some very good points, is the pair's decision to choose a route where a walk comprising members of BF would be likely to cause unrest, both from the multicultural residents and from AFL. From the reports, the police contacted BF to offer a couple of alternative routes but for a reason that sounds sinister to me, Tommy and co seemed to want to insist on the 'controversial' route that would obviously provoke a response.

This appeared to me to reveal an intention to provoke. They were offered and in the negotiations appear to negotiate an alternative with police but this was after a horrible incident that quite frankly they knew all along was going to happen. My impartial feeling on this is to dislike their organisation as they seemed to be wanting to create a hostile situation and response. The idea that they used a dying girl as a reason for this 'walk'. knowing all the time that they were aiming to create a provocative situation is repulsive. It completely turns me off, following my initial thoughts of "seems quite a reasonable bloke". If they had negotiated a route before hand that the police and locals were happy with, I'd be quite happy for them to proceed. I wish they'd have kept the dying girl walk separate to this though, or done it privately?

Similarly I saw another extended clip that followed BF on an 'official walk', handing out leaflets with their views on it. On this walk they walked around Brick Lane, East London - a heavily Muslim area handing out their newspaper. On this walk they:

1. Carried their large white crosses down a road where most of the locals are Islamic
2. Chanted "We want our country back" repeatedly
3. as they handed out their newspaper, they used the phrase "Take our country back"

All together, this obviously makes for a highly charged situation that was obviously calculated and executed to upset and incite the locals. Why do this? As I said above, Robinson has some good points to make but this puts someone like me completely off his cause. It makes him look cold, calculating and hateful. I don't know that much about him other than views on here and my own look at the Oxford debate. As I said, he came over well in this kind of context but in these two clips (and BF actually put the video of Brick Lane so that's how they wanted to portray themselves obviously) it really demeans themselves and their arguments.

Sorry if this is a bit rambling and disjointed - keep being made to do some work!

[monty_rhodes]

So, are you gunna answer my question or just chuck cheap jibes into the mix.....tick tock, as you might say in another guise...

My dear MMM I disagree with you on many points but I rather like you. Unfortunately I consider your worldview destructive to my own so you would regrettably have to be consigned to the gulag. I would sign the paper with a heavy heart and slip you the odd Red Cross parcel. No, I am not going to answer your question because as Abraham Lincoln famously said "To answer is to give respectability to the palpably wrong." I am hurt that you feel my pointing out that Labour stalwarts fundamentally disagreed with your view on Corbyn's statement is in some way a "cheap jibe". Very odd conclusion.

[great_fire]

I think what will hurt my children more is having a Labour government with Corbyn as PM, when he wants to let in so many more potential terrorists.

IRA, Hamas, Hezbollah, Tamil Tigers, he supported them all, never met a group of terrorists he didn't like.

Also throughout his life has been anti-British but wants to be British PM.