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Thread: O/T Tommy Robinson Speaks About Manchester Terror Attack

  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by ragingpup View Post
    Been meaning to say something about Tommy and trying to find time to review some of the videos and comments from both sides.
    This 'mini thread' on this unfortunate incident is a good point to comment.

    First of all, in looking at the videos and some public reaction to them, it's true that the police don't come out looking great in that moment, nor do some of the Muslim responses. I've looked to see if I can find any direct evidence (in the limited time available) of BF actively using racist language per se. I was interested in his appearance with at a Q&A with students at Oxford (on YouTube where he makes some very good points and in this context, I can understand where he's coming from and appreciate the energy and concern behind his work.

    However, these are limited observations and am always willing to review these points if someone directs me to contrary evidence. In the meantime, I'm taking him at face value on the evidence I've looked at.

    However, what I am concerned about is not so much the message but how they choose to present it. Looking at this 'charity walk' for a little girl, I can appreciate their thoughts and taking the time to make a considered gesture. What sticks in the craw though, and for me cheapens some very good points, is the pair's decision to choose a route where a walk comprising members of BF would be likely to cause unrest, both from the multicultural residents and from AFL. From the reports, the police contacted BF to offer a couple of alternative routes but for a reason that sounds sinister to me, Tommy and co seemed to want to insist on the 'controversial' route that would obviously provoke a response.

    This appeared to me to reveal an intention to provoke. They were offered and in the negotiations appear to negotiate an alternative with police but this was after a horrible incident that quite frankly they knew all along was going to happen. My impartial feeling on this is to dislike their organisation as they seemed to be wanting to create a hostile situation and response. The idea that they used a dying girl as a reason for this 'walk'. knowing all the time that they were aiming to create a provocative situation is repulsive. It completely turns me off, following my initial thoughts of "seems quite a reasonable bloke". If they had negotiated a route before hand that the police and locals were happy with, I'd be quite happy for them to proceed. I wish they'd have kept the dying girl walk separate to this though, or done it privately?

    Similarly I saw another extended clip that followed BF on an 'official walk', handing out leaflets with their views on it. On this walk they walked around Brick Lane, East London - a heavily Muslim area handing out their newspaper. On this walk they:

    1. Carried their large white crosses down a road where most of the locals are Islamic
    2. Chanted "We want our country back" repeatedly
    3. as they handed out their newspaper, they used the phrase "Take our country back"

    All together, this obviously makes for a highly charged situation that was obviously calculated and executed to upset and incite the locals. Why do this? As I said above, Robinson has some good points to make but this puts someone like me completely off his cause. It makes him look cold, calculating and hateful. I don't know that much about him other than views on here and my own look at the Oxford debate. As I said, he came over well in this kind of context but in these two clips (and BF actually put the video of Brick Lane so that's how they wanted to portray themselves obviously) it really demeans themselves and their arguments.

    Sorry if this is a bit rambling and disjointed - keep being made to do some work!
    Before I go into answering this, I really need to clear something up. I think you are getting Tommy Robinson and Paul Golding confused. Tommy is the smaller guy in the charity video I posted. He is the co-founder and ex-leader of the EDL, NOT Britain First. Paul Golding is the leader of Britain First. Tommy Robinson is not and never has been a member of Britain First. However, he has recently been on a couple of walkaround videos with them. But NOT at Brick Lane.

    Britain First are more right wing than the EDL. I wouldn't describe them as far right, although the media always does. They are certainly not far right like Nazis, the Ku Klux Klan or the National Front.

    Paul Golding does always preach about them going on peaceful marches, though that seems to depend on what mood he is in. I have seem him and other members confront aggressive Muslims several times. Although it does have to be said, it is nearly always the Muslims who become abusive or aggressive first, BUT, there is no doubt that Paul Golding and Britain First purposely use antagonistic tactics. I have seen videos of them walking into mosques and shouting about Muhammad being a *****phile, and other things. Whilst what they are saying is actually true, it is inflammatory, and although I don't like any religion, I don't see the need to walk into ANY place of worship and try to intimidate or annoy the people worshipping there.

    I think that is a fair review of Britain First.

    So to the charity walk. Remember, it's not Britain First, but EDL. And actually, only two members of the EDL. If they had wanted to be inflammatory they would have had a march through the area with a few thousand EDL supporters, as at other rallies.

    But let's just make a couple of points on that. Firstly, I don't know what reports you have read. I do know, though, that Tommy and Kev told the police if they would be arrested they would take a different route, but were NEVER informed of this. IF you have read that the police told them this, it doesn't surprise me. The police are often known for lying - Hillsbrough, Orgreave to name but two. So it wouldn't surprise me if this was another police plan to just arrest Tommy. As they allowed assaults to take place in front of them, it does seem to be yet another police stitch up.

    Let's also remember, everyone has a right to raise money for charity. Everyone also has a democratic right to protest. As I already acknowledged to millmoor - I am always an honest man - perhaps part of it WAS for their own benefit. As with plenty of celebs who raise money for charity. Their protest here, I feel, is the point that we supposedly live in a free democracy.

    It sounds to me, ragingpup, that you are unwittingly suggesting that there should be Muslim only areas in this country? That there should be no-go areas for whites, Christians or atheists. Remember this is still a Christian country.

    And every man, woman or child should be allowed to walk down any street in the country and not be attacked. Especially if they are doing a peaceful charity march. So it shouldn't be Tommy or Kev who should be punished for walking through their own country and coming under attack (in this case by violent leftists, but no doubt it would have been by extremist Muslims had they walked through the area). It might be common sense that they don't walk through there, but why shouldn't they? The police's job is to keep innocent people safe and arrest the criminals. Walking through certain areas is not a criminal offence (yet) but if we bow down to this kind of behaviour that certain people aren't allowed to walk through certain areas for fear of attack, then what kind of country are we becoming?

    Imagine two Muslims being told they are not allowed to walk through certain areas or they would be arrested. There would be outrage and rightly so, yet for some reason lefties only want equality for themselves and minorities.

    As for the rest of your post, as I explained, that has nothing to do with Tommy Robinson. That is Paul Golding and Britain First. The walking around with white crosses, the storming of mosques, the shouting 'We want our country back', the walk through Brick Lane, and many other intimidating and antagonistic things. And although I do agree with some of their objectives, as I explained earlier, I don't like some of their bully-boy tactics. But I do like it when they went round Islamic hate preachers' houses. I don't like to see any innocent person being bullied. I am sure me criticising some of these things Britain First do will shock some people on here who have already formed a view of me in their minds, but there you go.

  2. #182
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    For all those who bang on about free speech (within reason of course!), what is wrong then with this particular BF march and protest, in Luton - England/Britain.
    What is Jayda and her team saying or doing here that is wrong or offensive or even insulting eh ?
    Yet the muslim cowards come out and offer their usual disgusting violence and insults and whats worse, they ARE allowed to do this yet again by the police.




  3. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by ragingpup View Post
    Hi again Mr S. This sounds like a crap experience with a crap teacher. And that can scar a person for sure. But my posts on here have been about good schools that have good teachers. My kid is mixed with loads of other cultures but all the lessons are (necessarily) in English. Some kids have esol support but my daughter is doing great,as are her multicultural friends. Hence the positive ofsted rating. So, with the ofsted quality rating, that the children have better than average with lots far better ratings and an assurance that lessons would be fully conducted in English (as they are meant to be) would you still send your kids to such a school? And it's your opinion that counts, not your mum!
    100% I would send my child to a multicultural school. My wife worked in an international school. She said the kids were great.

    By the way, the lesson in my brothers case was also conducted in English. It was just that the children were not speaking it when discussing the lesson between themselves etc. Do I get assurances of that?

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by ragingpup View Post
    Mr Shark. I'm not really sure I understand you. My question was whether Grist/Fire/Anyone would be willing to send their kids to an outstanding school that happens to have a high proportion of ethnic children including children from Muslim families? I'm trying to establish what we want? Do we want Muslim families to integrate in our schools? If so, are white English parents willing to send children into such schools where there are large numbers of ethnic children?

    I think that's a really crucial question. If you aren't, why not? I'm trying to understand if we white brits might not be willing to do so, or if, like Mr EllisD, you'd be quite happy to (if it was a good school). It's not a trick question, I just want a honest response with reasons.

    Anyone?
    Just a further point there, from me, as Shark27 raised. I would only be happy sending my children to that school if English was the only language spoken in the classroom. At home and in the playground they can speak whatever language they like. But if they don't speak English, meaning interpreters are needed, that can only be detrimental to the English speaking children in the classroom.

  5. #185
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    Just like in Rotherham, the police are on the wrong side:


  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by great_fire View Post
    So you didn't see his interview with Andrew Neil then?

    Said he'd never met the IRA a demonstrable lie.

    https://order-order.com/2017/05/26/c...never-met-ira/

    It's Corbyn who is the liar.

    And you are a total dick.
    millmoor can't stand the truth, but Jeremy Corbyn is a supporter of terrorists and has been proven to lie and backtrack constantly.

    Just as an addition to the IRA theme, an interview from the other day from a former IRA member:

    'An ex-IRA killer today says Jeremy Corbyn has blood on his hands - because without his support the terrorist murders and torture would have ended much earlier.'

    'Sean O'Callaghan claims the solidarity proclaimed by Corbyn and John McDonnell in the 1980s and '90s encouraged the IRA to "prolong the violence". O'Callaghan, 63, says: "IRA men and women, many young and hopelessly politically naive, derived great encouragement from the solidarity openly displayed by Corbyn, McDonnell and their associates."

    "I know, I witnessed the effect. They might not have pulled a trigger or planted a bomb but they certainly made it easier for those who did."

    "By boosting our morale, they prolonged the violence and without a doubt, for that have blood on their own hands."

    'O'Callaghan claims Corbyn and Shadow Chancellor McDonnell's attempt to now portray their IRA solidarity as a campaign to promote peace is "a self-serving lie".'

    'He insists they only ever sought an IRA victory. O'Callaghan was an IRA member from 1974 to 1988 and was jailed for two murders.'

    I know you will only argue and disagree with that millmoor, and that is the problem; you refuse to see Corbyn's many, dangerous faults, and continue to make excuses for his behaviour.

  7. #187
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    People say he has integrity, even though he supported Remain when he's always opposed EU & it's Labour policy to support Trident even though he doesn't support it, promises free stuff to everyone to get votes even though he knows we wouldn't be able to pay for it, the train stunt, he isn't even the nice guy they paint him as, he's very thin skinned and short-tempered as seen in Neil interview and previous ones.

  8. #188
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    ISIS have called for an all out war on the west at the start of Ramadan..beginning this weekend.

    I know we are on full alert but just what can be done to stop one of these nutters going into a busy public place and pulling the string on a suicide bomb vest and creating more terror and killing god knows how many innocent children/Adults.

    Scary times.

  9. #189
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    Hey Rev I know we both disagree on our footy teams etc, but this terrorists thing is a horrible topic here isnt it.
    And Im really concerned about where this next attack will happen, which they are talking about already at the moment!!

  10. #190
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    Over the last few seasons I have had words with you and Roma Acido but agree 100% with you on this terrorist topic..certainly puts our footy spats into perspective.

    We are on high alert but there are so many soft targets where they could strike..I share your concerns.

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