OT another terrorist attack.

[lbj]

Those meaningless quotes mean a great deal!

Perpetuating violence never works....great for a short term personal need for retribution but "Good people" of all nations / faiths know that SOMEONE HAS TO SHOW PEACEFUL METHODS TO SOLVE THE WORLD'S PROBLEMS.

BUT IT TAKES EMPATHY AND INTELLIGENCE TO REALISE THIS.

[John2]

As usual you present your interpretation as fact. I saw no such implication and see no relevance to the geography of attacks.

He used the expression that Muslims consider themselves suffering.

He also used the number 1,604 victims in the last 12 months. He didn't state the Geography, but the slightest modicum of intellect would figure that this figure is not deaths within the UK.

[lbj]

OK.....going back...

"The harming of any third party NOT IMMEDIATELY INVOLVED.....makes the perpetrators WORSE THAN THE ORIGINAL ACT !'

IN MY OPINION !

And I guess many more!

Where does it end - oblivion !

[millmoormagic]

Completely different. I meant the quotes that he used in the conversation we were having were absolutely meaningless, as they were nothing to do with the conversation or the points being debated. Had he used them in a conversation surrounding passages in the Bible, then of course they would be relevant.

When I quote from The Qur'an, I don't just throw random quotes into a discussion that have nothing to do with the conversation. I make valid points pertinent to the discussion, and use quotes from The Qur'an to back my points up.

you couldn't make it up really...

[monty_rhodes]

He used the expression that Muslims consider themselves suffering.

He also used the number 1,604 victims in the last 12 months. He didn't state the Geography, but the slightest modicum of intellect would figure that this figure is not deaths within the UK.

I don't see your point at all. The poster's observations and conclusions were perfectly reasonable and valid.
To your great disappointment (shared by the BBC, roly, mike, Kerr and MMM on here) this attack will be found to be the work of a sad loner with no right-wing affiliations but a record of heavy drinking, mental instability and erratic behaviour. Friends, family and neighbours state he had never expressed racist views and got on well with Muslim neighbours UNTIL the recent attacks in London and Manchester.
There are no ramifications, no implications and no lessons to be learnt. Random acts of violence by disturbed individuals are unfortunately a fact of life. The fact that Muslims argue this single act has made them fear for their lives and as on the Today programme demand the government make Islamophobia in all its manifestations a crime is clearly self-serving tripe.

[John2]

I don't see your point at all.

As stated, that would require the smallest modicum of intellect.

I don't necessarily disagree with the rest of your post, though there are always lessons to be learned and hate crimes are definitely on the rise. It's just an irrelevance to the original post.

[KerrAvon]

I don't see your point at all. The poster's observations and conclusions were perfectly reasonable and valid.
To your great disappointment (shared by the BBC, roly, mike, Kerr and MMM on here) this attack will be found to be the work of a sad loner with no right-wing affiliations but a record of heavy drinking, mental instability and erratic behaviour. Friends, family and neighbours state he had never expressed racist views and got on well with Muslim neighbours UNTIL the recent attacks in London and Manchester.
There are no ramifications, no implications and no lessons to be learnt. Random acts of violence by disturbed individuals are unfortunately a fact of life. The fact that Muslims argue this single act has made them fear for their lives and as on the Today programme demand the government make Islamophobia in all its manifestations a crime is clearly self-serving tripe.

That's a pretty foolish post even by your standards, monty

I'm not disappointed by this being, on the face of it, a lone wolf attack by a disturbed individual. On the contrary, albeit it being a despicable act, I'm relieved, as any sensible person would be, that the attack is not, on the face of it, part of a campaign.

To suggest that there are no lessons to be learned is also wrong. To my mind, I think it should remind us all of the need to be careful to avoid language and attitudes that create an atmosphere in which distributed individuals might feel inspired to act in the way that this bloke did. 'Islamic' terrorism provides plenty of inspiration without adding to it with some of the nonsense that appears on football message boards and elsewhere.

Islamaphobia, just like Christianaphobia, are already arguably offences with some crimes being capable of being committed in a 'religuously aggravated' form and with sentence 'uplifts' being available across the board for religiously aggravated offending

[lbj]

All the laws are in place to be used for the "Enemy Within' .....or wherever they are.

[Ellis_D]

That's a pretty foolish post even by your standards, monty

I'm not disappointed by this being, on the face of it, a lone wolf attack by a disturbed individual. On the contrary, albeit it being a despicable act, I'm relieved, as any sensible person would be, that the attack is not, on the face of it, part of a campaign.

To suggest that there are no lessons to be learned is also wrong. To my mind, I think it should remind us all of the need to be careful to avoid language and attitudes that create an atmosphere in which distributed individuals might feel inspired to act in the way that this bloke did. 'Islamic' terrorism provides plenty of inspiration without adding to it with some of the nonsense that appears on football message boards and elsewhere.

Islamaphobia, just like Christianaphobia, are already arguably offences with some crimes being capable of being committed in a 'religuously aggravated' form and with sentence 'uplifts' being available across the board for religiously aggravated offending

Let's have it right. This man almost certainly wouldn't have committed this act of terror were it not for the recent terror attacks in London and Manchester. So rather than pointing to the terrible reactionary incident(s) that follow that, we should be, as a united nation, attacking the root cause. And that is a million miles away from being Islamophobia; it is Islamism.

[Grist_To_The_Mill]

All this childish bickering is quite sad.

For what it's worth my view is that this attack on "muslim" type targets won't be the last.