last nights game

[darrenshedtastic]

sorry if theres already a thread for this but i normally do this sort of stuff for the games i went to.

1st half
first 30mins i dont think united done anything. they should have scored before they did. looked well off the pace. couldnt string two passes together and yet we some how managed to still go in level at half time. it took us 30-40mins to realise it was a derby and up the tempo in our play. when we did that we done better. level at HT but dundee should have been ahead.
2nd half
i thought the 2nd half was scrappy, odd chances for both teams but it was more of a midfield battle, whos picking up 2nd balls and stuff. not alot of quality in the game at that time. then they scored and i think they just took control. we changed things that didnt work and actually made no difference what so ever.
overall
a deserved victory for the bitter lot. we looked too far off the pace and like most derbies in recent years they looked up for it more.

ratings
Lewis
solid enough made a good save in the 2nd half at point blank range. dealt with alot of crosses (some might say struggled) but decent game (7)
Toshney
decent game generally but distribution is shocking (dillion got more pelters when he lost the ball) although defended well most of the game, the winner came from his side again. carbon copy of previous derbies goal. (6)
Edge
defended well at times but struggled with haber who is more physical and aggressive than any Championship strikers. kinda found out as being an average defended who would struggle if we got up :/ (5)
Durnan
done decent enough but similar to edge struggled with haber and el bak. (6)
Scobbie
not on very long but looked like he would have struggled to deal with deacon again (-)
Briels
gets stuck in and has some nice touches but was way off the pace at the start which allowed them to gain momentum. slowly growed into the game but couldnt really control the game. (5)
Fyvie
took his time to get into the game. some nice touches but wanted far too much time at the start. giving benefit of the doubt for 1st start. (6)
Mcmullan
they kept him quiet and didnt really do much in the game. works hard (5)
King
likes to have 4 touches before he does anything. looks decent at times but at other times looks woeful. worked hard (6)
Stanton
when centrally is a big threat and drives the team forward and looked much better in there. will be a big player for us (7)
mcdonald
some nice touches and made things awkward for their CBs without causing too much problems. tired early and should have been taken off but again will be a decent signing for us (5)

subs
Robson
worried when he came on cause thought he'd be dominated by deacon but he done well against him. got stuck in and wasnt scared of him. easily are best player (7) MOTM
Keatings
wasnt on long enough to do anything tbh should start v QotS (-)
Murdoch
wasnt on for long (-)

starting 11/tactics
was surprised with the lineup he went with. dont think Fyvie should have started. hes not played in while so he wouldnt have been match fit. allaydice should have started in there imo. we started with 442 which is a big reason why they dominated us in the first 30mins. they outnumbered us in the middle all the time so they could easily keep the ball while we were struggling to keep the ball. when we changed it to 4231 (moved stanton centrally) we started to play abit and looked more solid as a team.
Durnan up front might work against championship teams but up against more physical teams it doesnt! plus that forced us to start launching the ball up to him which done nothing. before he moved up front we were starting to pass the ball around abit.

subbies
i dont know what he was trying to do with the subbies. scobbie coming off wasnt ideal but mcdonald looked dead on his feet by 70mins and yet he finished the game. he took briels off when we were losing the midfield battle as it is. keatings should have came on for Mcdonald imo. he was obviously just giving murdoch some game time.

Dundee
they deserved to win but i dont think they were miles ahead of us like NM suggests. they have more physical players who were up for it more than us. thats two games where they should have beaten us quite comfortably but havent. yeah a wins a win but they celebrated asif they had won the trophy. i dont think they will go down but i dont see them doing anything in the league (8th, 9th or 10th).

Are all the dundee fans going down to the city square for their trophy parade?? derby wins are added to their major honours

beat qots then we will be in a good position for the league which is priority FTD

[Chick A Saw]

Spot on assessment!

First time this season i didnt like Briels but im not sure if the new midfield partner had something to do with that. But i cant say that Allardice would have done any better. King for me showed again why i had reservations about him, and on another day might have passed for 2 chances and McDonald might have had a goal or 2.

Anyway, as i said last night, the distraction is out the way and we can now concentrate on the league with a wee bit more money in the hipper, but i think some fans will wear last nights hangover for a wee while.

[shedka]

Good summary

Already looking forward to Saturday, would be a big 3 pts against a fresher side, thing is we have a lot of options, once we get everyone upto speed we will be quite strong this season

[ianharab]

Agree with most Darren , but didn't start 4-4-2 , Briels and Fyvie were two holders , Stanton and King wide McMullen of McDonald in a 4-2-3-1 , looked better when Stanton switched in inside , should have played 4-4-2 , that's why I don't like that system we are far to easy to play against and the opposition outnumber us in midfield

[shedboy71]

Agree with most Darren , but didn't start 4-4-2 , Briels and Fyvie were two holders , Stanton and King wide McMullen of McDonald in a 4-2-3-1 , looked better when Stanton switched in inside , should have played 4-4-2 , that's why I don't like that system we are far to easy to play against and the opposition outnumber us in midfield

This

[darrenshedtastic]

Agree with most Darren , but didn't start 4-4-2 , Briels and Fyvie were two holders , Stanton and King wide McMullen of McDonald in a 4-2-3-1 , looked better when Stanton switched in inside , should have played 4-4-2 , that's why I don't like that system we are far to easy to play against and the opposition outnumber us in midfield

well from what i noticed at the start of the game mcmullan and mcdonald were both straight up top when attacking and they were both sitting deeper to stop kamara on the ball and allowing the CBs the ball but for a short spell at one point it was definitely 442. mcmullan started the game very high and central same with mcdonald. we only started to gain some sort of control when we went back into the 4231 with stanton moving centrally. before we changed it, they were getting penetrative balls into their attacking players easily past our midfield but once we changed it that didnt happen again for the rest of the half or much until they scored their 2nd and we began to chase it.

442 left us too open in midfield and allowed them to outnumber us. yes most people dont like the 4231 but it at least allows us to match the 3v3 in their midfield and stop any passes into feet of the strikers which they were getting before the switch.

[stokearab]

well from what i noticed at the start of the game mcmullan and mcdonald were both straight up top when attacking and they were both sitting deeper to stop kamara on the ball and allowing the CBs the ball but for a short spell at one point it was definitely 442. mcmullan started the game very high and central same with mcdonald. we only started to gain some sort of control when we went back into the 4231 with stanton moving centrally. before we changed it, they were getting penetrative balls into their attacking players easily past our midfield but once we changed it that didnt happen again for the rest of the half or much until they scored their 2nd and we began to chase it.

442 left us too open in midfield and allowed them to outnumber us. yes most people dont like the 4231 but it at least allows us to match the 3v3 in their midfield and stop any passes into feet of the strikers which they were getting before the switch.

How can 3 be better in midfield than 4

[shedboy71]

How can 3 be better in midfield than 4

An example its all relative to who plays:

Toshney Fraser Sneider Rojas

versus


Bowman Badger McInally

[Arabdad]

4-2-3-1 works well for Barca because they have world class players to make it work. With the best will in the world we really, really don't. As per the Inverness game we gave the ball away too cheaply when in possession last night and allowed Le Fun to dominate proceedings. Our midfield have clearly been playing too much FIFA 17 based on the number of mid air flicks they tried to pass the ball to an overlapping team mate. Please keep it simple and hold onto the ball. We can and will get better as players get fitter and the team gels but I really believe Ray needs to give serious thought to what the best formation is for our starting 11. Back to bread and butter games on Saturday and we need to get a second league win under our belts, but we will continue to struggle unless we keep possession and pressurise our opponents.

[shedboy71]

4-2-3-1 works well for Barca because they have world class players to make it work. With the best will in the world we really, really don't. As per the Inverness game we gave the ball away too cheaply when in possession last night and allowed Le Fun to dominate proceedings. Our midfield have clearly been playing too much FIFA 17 based on the number of mid air flicks they tried to pass the ball to an overlapping team mate. Please keep it simple and hold onto the ball. We can and will get better as players get fitter and the team gels but I really believe Ray needs to give serious thought to what the best formation is for our starting 11. Back to bread and butter games on Saturday and we need to get a second league win under our belts, but we will continue to struggle unless we keep possession and pressurise our opponents.

2014 - i remember saying this exact phrase OA, GB, AP etc all did. Sid was cooking at the time so didnt have a view but i am sure he would agree.

spot on dad

its essentially a 2 man midfield or 5 man where no one can really do holding, passing and running required. Its a specialist formation that can be devastating but only with the right players