Attn Sinkov and others

[sinkov]

Evening Sinkov! I missed your last post.

Two points there. The current position is that the MP's will get the final say...are you saying that is also a waste of time?

"Yes, how many times do I have to point this out, they will be getting a final say on the trade deal, and whatever they say, on March 29th 2019 we're out. Our MPs will have the power gainsay the trade deal, if we have one, they won't have the power to gainsay Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty, they subjugated themselves to that, in their wisdom, a long time ago.

And you are assuming that the choices on offer are simply deal or no deal. In other words, we accept the deal on the table or just bugger off with no deal.

I'm not assuming anything, that is what's on offer to Parliament. You might wish it otherwise but that IS what they have been promised, a say on the trade deal.

Despite what you say, there IS a third option - to remain. The author of article 50 recently confirmed that article 50 CAN be rescinded right up until the time that we leave. It would need the agreement of all the member states, but it is still a possibility.

Therefore the referendum should have three choices. 1/. Accept the deal on offer 2/. Reject the deal and leave 3/. Rescind article 50 and express our wish to remain.

If you wish to believe there is a third option then that's your perogative, A50 of the Lisbon Treaty doesn't allow for it, and the EU says we're out next March. Maybe your referendum should have three choices, but that's another story, and this referendum is a figment of your imagination anyway, there is no intention to hold one. The poll you referred to originally referred to the trade deal, check your link to the Mail if you doubt my word, and therefore the one I've been talking about.

Can we stick to that, and given that it simply refers to the trade deal and cannot have any bearing on whether we leave or not, could you now agree with me that it's pointless.



If you want to discuss whether there should be a 2nd referendum on whether we leave or remain, then that's worthy of another thread, but not relevant to this one.

Have a pleasant evening.

[sinkov]

1959-60 --another well-known saying "He who hesitates is lost"
It has been apparent right from the word go that there was no plan and that nobody has had the balls to take the bull by the horns and get in and sort it out. In other words --we are bloody lost.
I do not agree on another referendum because you cacn go on like that for ever.
All this just confirms to me what a useless lot of politicians we have these days, with a few exceptions -- no matter what party they represent.

You're right Ss, the biggest problem that I can see is the politicians, on both sides. When you strip away all the bollox about a Hard Tory Brexit, what you have is a government, the vast majority of whose MPs are Remoaners, with a Remoaner PM and a Remoaner Chancellor. They are obliged to carry out the wishes of the electorate but their hearts clearly aren't in it, as you can see from their continuous concessions to the EU, culminating in their crossing of another of their red lines today and attempting to sell out Northern Ireland. Fortunately the DUP aren't having it and have sent the traiterous cow homewards to think again.

[army88]

You're right Ss, the biggest problem that I can see is the politicians, on both sides. When you strip away all the bollox about a Hard Tory Brexit, what you have is a government, the vast majority of whose MPs are Remoaners, with a Remoaner PM and a Remoaner Chancellor. They are obliged to carry out the wishes of the electorate but their hearts clearly aren't in it, as you can see from their continuous concessions to the EU, culminating in their crossing of another of their red lines today and attempting to sell out Northern Ireland. Fortunately the DUP aren't having it and have sent the traiterous cow homewards to think again.

We really are starting to look very weak which IMO is the worst position for us because ,

The rest of the world is watching with baited breath to see if we actually have any *******s and if we can negotiate and be strong in trade terms( if it keeps on like this we won't have a strong position to debate with anyone).

There are many countries within the Eu that in all honesty won't want not to deal with us , reality is if they want to tariff us it will cost those countries hundreds of millions of euros going forwards and they won't want that , so that brings us back to the greedy bar stewards in Brussels who are trying to play a trump card they simply don't have.

We should become the strong proud nation we once were and stand up and be counted , tell them what we want and what we'll pay on leaving and say it's up to you now.

I'm willing to bet that outside the Eu we could buy things we get from inside the Eu - where will that leave them with a tariff we simply won't need to pay to them and our business gone completely?

It's a dangerous game they are playing at the moment ( even more so now with Germany in turmoil- another major contributor to Eu )

[1959_60]

We are looking like complete tosspots to the rest of the world now.

We almost had an agreement today, I am trying to get my head round how Theresa May failed to tell the DUP about keeping Northern Ireland in the customs union and single market while the rest of the UK was to leave. With all the related border controls. They are supposed to be working together to run the bloody country.

How this can be sorted out is anyones guess.

The agreement failed not because of the EU, but because we can't sort our own domestic difficulties out.

Why the heck are we so intent on leaving the customs union and single market anyway? if we stay in them then MANY problems just disappear, and we will be much better off as a nation anyway.

To many Brexiteers it is now simply a matter of principle. Most people realise that we, as a nation, will suffer from leaving the single market and customs union but, such has been the nastinest of the "debate", from both sides, that they simply refuse to admit the truth.

Ultimately they, along with their children, will suffer the consequences, but they are too proud to see sense.

How would YOU sort out the Irish border issue?

[Altobelli]

We are looking like complete tosspots to the rest of the world now.

We have looked like Tosspots for a while now 59.

And anyone viewing tonight's Panarama about the aid "given" to Syria must surely confirm we are Tosspots.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ansparency-bbc

[sinkov]

How would YOU sort out the Irish border issue?

There have been several workable solutions that I've read, my solution would be to walk away from the farce and tell the EU to call us back when they have a workable solution they'd like to discuss. This is a huge problem for the Republic and the EU as well, which they won't discuss, so let them stew and consider the consequences of their intransigence. They've known our position on this for a long while now, I'd ask them what their position is and wait for their response.

This is not a zero sum game where we lose and they win, but they're acting as if it is, time we got off our knees and called their bluff. That woman is embarrassing. But this is what you get when you have a Remoaner in charge, a bloody shambles.

[1959_60]

Well, I have yet to see a workable solution Sinkov.

I can't see beyond a hard Irish border or a Northern Ireland/rest of the UK border.

I can't see either of them having a chance.

Prepare for Corbyn (shudders)

[Norder]

.

Chlorinated Chicken / GM food and much much more - so to hell with safety regulations....this is Global Britain - this is business, this is the New Trade Bill...and with no Parliament to amend - and no public consultation - the Commanders in Scum have the freedom to purchase the Shat feed from anywhere...so it's goodbye to food standards - all done without consultation, and all on the hush hush....Democracy at it's finest.


..

[The Bedlington Terrier]

What in the name of God are we doing letting Theresa May run (ruin) our country?

Why are we are so afraid of trying an alternative?

London (Yes, London), Scotland and Wales now want the "special" deal envisaged for Ireland even though the bigots from the DUP have already scuppered it and May can do nothing about it because without them her Christmas goose is well and truly cooked.

The so-called Social Mobility Tsar resigns, Davis threatens to go with him if his pervy mate in Cabinet is sacked and Brexit is bolloxed.

It was good in Germany but the Brady news diminished an otherwise excellent visit.

We visited the site where the Nurnberg rise of the right wing fascists began. Trump is starting to sound a lot like Hitler to me and he needs shutting down and quick.

[The Bedlington Terrier]

We have looked like Tosspots for a while now 59.

And anyone viewing tonight's Panarama about the aid "given" to Syria must surely confirm we are Tosspots.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ansparency-bbc

Cameron lied and coerced his spineless, gutless cohorts (including several Labour MP's) to bomb the sh-i-te out of Syria and then we worry about where a few quid of "aid" ended up?

We are now fully complicit in bombing the sh-it-e out of a few million defenceless citizens of Yemen but let's keep our lucrative arms deals with the Saudis intact and to hell with decency and diplomacy.