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Kerr apologies for interrupting your two way battle with Wanchai Miller but I cannot sit idly by and let you post drivelling crap such as,Originally Posted by KerrAvon
'Whatever individual striking miners aimed to achieve from the strike none of that can possibly be justifiable'
We were in unison with our fellow mineworkers whose livelihoods were being ripped apart by Thatcher, who by the way brought in a yank to do the dirty work for her or have you forgot that piece of history? Someone who got paid millions to just to drift off back to the States and be forgotten about.
Thatcher and her Gang decimated the entire coalfield of the UK and whittled it down just to crush the union who were battling to save working class people being thrown on the scrapheap. The closure of coal mines that were even profitable, mine included, not only cost miners their jobs but the ripple effect to other private businesses who supplied the coal board with tools, oil, machinery etc also went to the wall as they no longer had a business to supply.
There was and still is over 300 years of fossil fuel left underground in the UK. Now look at the state of our energy reserves. Look at who supplies the power to the UK. We have to seek the majority of our electricity from France, our gas from Russia who at the flick of of a switch could cripple and shut this country down within weeks. What a calamitous position to be left in in the 21st century.
What are we trying to do now? Fracking, in the hope they can bore deep enough to draw off the methane left by the closed mines and fossil fuel that still lays beneath our land.
You may say you are not against Unions but boy do you still hate the miners and I feel there's a deep seated reason there somewhere.
Last edited by Brin; 11-02-2018 at 07:09 PM.
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Ok thanks for your reply Kerr and I am pleased that you at least recognise workers need representation in disputes with management ar times.I have obviously missed your posts on your union representation.They are the positives that I personally get out of your reply.
As Brin as said though would it be fair to say you have a grudge against the miners? Did you not have any sympathy for their cause and the dangerous and arduous work they do/did?
Last edited by rolymiller; 11-02-2018 at 07:13 PM.
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The NUM and it's members fought like they did because we knew what the Thatcher government's motives were , to decimate the industry totally , they spoke of a number of unprofitable collieries that they intended to close but we knew that was only the tip of the iceberg and that's now a proven FACT but we knew at the time it was a FACT .
Does anyone actually believe that miners would go without wages for 12 months , suffer horrendous hardship , lose their homes and split from their families in some cases over simply bringing a stupid women down and her minions , really ???????
Our whole working lives were on the line here , I was only 22 myself and there was nothing else in my town , there still isn't in real terms 30 plus years on .
This was an industry decimated to avenge the falling of the Heath government and the fact that working people could no longer be dictated to and kept down , just as history shows you with the working class and Tory governments .
The only people with evil in their eye were sat in Westminster and didn't even have the minerals to do the dirty work in public , " Iron Lady my @ss .
They had me returning to work in March 1985 but they never beat me with their council house sales or fantasy share holding , I wouldn't have had either for nowt , full stop .
Replaced by greedy young w@nkers in the city , that's a joke right , tell me how that ended in 2008 and how much it cost the taxpayer ?
You sell out to the tories without having privilege , Eton and Oxford behind you and you get what you deserve .
Take a good look at the UK today , nuff said .
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With respect, you were not in unison with your fellow mineworkers. You were in unison with those who agreed with you upon whether there should be a strike. You don't know if you were in unison with the majority of your fellow mineworkers, because the NUM leadership denied them the secret ballot that the unions constitution guaranteed them. They denied them a ballot because they were scared that they might not get the result that they wanted, which was a confrontation with the government.
Rather than receiving the benefit of any form of ‘unison’ your fellow mineworker’s who did not share your view upon whether there should be strike faced intimidation both at their places of work and at their homes and elsewhere. Some may feel that was justified or acceptable, whereas I don’t. The leadership of a union should act upon the wishes of the whole membership, not just those members who agree with them.
Yes, Thatcher wanted the confrontation and prepared for it. The reason for that is that the unions had acted recklessly and unreasonably throughout the 60s and 70s and had caused immeasurable damage to the UK economy and the government was determined to end that. The NUM leadership knew that very well and were also playing a political game. Mining communities paid a huge price for it.
The days of coal are over, Brin: https://www.theguardian.com/environm...017-uk-figures
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Manufacturing is declining everywhere in the West, even Germany is becoming more of a service economy, we simply can't compete with countries like China where costs are so much lower.
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Of course I recognise that workers need representation in disputes and in wage negotiations etc. As I said to Brin, however, the leadership of a union should act upon the wishes of the whole membership, not just those members who agree with them. In addition, a union should respect its own constitution - that is, after all, the basis upon which they take subscriptions from their members. Do you agree that something has gone wrong when union members have to take their union to court to enforce their rights? Who is there to represent their interests when that happens?
I don't have any grudge for miners and have huge respect for them given the dangerous and unpleasant job that they do. I think the destruction of mining communities and the hardships that flowed from it were and, to an extent, are, a tragedy, but every industry has it day and times move on. Perhaps if the NUM had had a different leadership and been willing to work with the government, the industry might had received a softer landing. Who knows?
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What an extraordinary outburst that was by the way.
You must be John Major's biggest fan.
Also, contrary to popular opinion on the left, calling people "Nazi", "fascist" or "racist" doesn't actually mean you've won the argument.
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Kerr don't believe all you read. There have been hundreds of applications to site powered wind farms that have been turned down by planning associations so, to say this is the way forward it doesn't always mean they will get over the finish line.
I do like the point though that back's up my point on being held to ransom by other countries.
'However, if we continue to use gas at the rate that we do, then Britain will miss carbon targets and be dangerously exposed to supply and price risks in the international gas markets'
Don't say we haven't been warned!
By the way do you like my thread on 'instrumentals' ? Sure you have one in your locker somewhere....look forward to hearing it.
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I assume you are talking about the Nottinghamshire miners. My argument would be that if they wanted to forge a breakaway union they shouldn't benefit from anything the striking miners gained from the dispute.
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Bet their sons and daughters are proud everytime they clock on at Sports Direct every morning .
That said many were good solid lads many of whom who did come out were transferred up here to avoid intimidation and physical harm coming to them when the strike ended .
Not a lot of people know that , then again you wouldn't would you .
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