Championship Owners Who's Who - Pound for Pound .........

[WTF11]

No need to discuss from my point of view. Much more succinct than I, you hit every nail on the head.

One small additional point, the most televised matches outside those featuring the top 6 in the PL have featured.......you guessed, Leeds United. Why? Because just as the owner of various ilks have known that they can depend on the cash cows (sorry, fans), the broadcasters know they have a guaranteed audience when Leeds are on the box.

[Marley past ghosts]

Indeed - what price blind loyalty eh? Fans AND players.

The result can be being walked all over without complaint. Or it can be glory and success.

And the reason players don't have any of it anyore, is that they were being walked all over without complaint, so they flipped it to the opposite - no loyalty and total control.

Fans can't have it both ways - if we're blindly, positively loyal, we will get walked all over. And club-organised fora and 'opportunities to speak' don't constitute a voice, just as those old players asking the chairman for a raise and never getting it didn't.

So - how are the fans REALLY going have a voice, now the players have got theirs? If Pontus is able to exercise his democratic rights and choices, without club control or insider manipulation, then so are we. Here's how:

* Massive social media storm against stupid club choices (the badge)? Check.

* Large numbers declaring dissatisfaction when players are not able enough/fit to wear the shirt? Check.

* Supporter demonstration at matches rather than misplaced blind support. Hmm.

* Withdrawal of revenue streams - not buying tickets, not buying new kit etc, not buying food/drink. Hmm.

So, ready for the storm of righteous indignation about ALAW and all the other b ollox spoken when anyone dares to suggest that we are in need of a different way of doing things, how about we consider that we as Leeds fans are a part of the problem - that very unquestioning, loyal, blind support is enabling - it has allowed all those owners and their acolytes to use the club, because they know/knew that 25000+ will buy whatever they sell, however c rap it is. And that's been going on for 15 years.

So maybe we need to look at ourselves and ask if going home and/or away is actually being a great Leeds fan.

Perhaps NOT going is going to get change quicker - an owner with a quarter full ground needs to do something about that a lot quicker than one with a two thirds full ground.

Discuss.

bang on the nail jez . paying money for old rope springs to mind , loyalty is one thing , when the owners are taking the piss then its another thing entirely .

you dont need to be an einstein , to already see what will happen next season , more of the same as this season , with less sugar on top , because jansson and saiz will be gone and more dross will be brought in to replace them.

the income stream will certainly drop next season as more fans will wise up to radrizaanis so called five year plan, 30,000 gates will be a thing of the past , with the team we currently have at our disposal . the fans are the only ones who can force radtizaanis hand in the transfer market , or force him out altogether , opposition groups will begin to form the same way as they did with cellino . its only a matter of time.

if radrizaani thinks the fans will accept another four years of what we have witnessed this season , he is in for a rude awakening indeed ..

[Marley past ghosts]

Where are all these money people with fortunes to spend, and why haven't they bought the club years ago?

That's not having a pop at you but my answer is that the club has been run down for years by the dodgy owners. What would the new owners get for buying the club pre- Radrizanni? A name. We all know that the fans have been abused for years from these owners.

To get investment we need assets, the buying back of ER makes us a better proposition for investment. To me the future of this club isn't about just throwing money at the playing squad but investing in the structure of the club as well.

Wood and Taylor wasn't sold for profit, they were offered more than what we could ever offer them and wanted out. I keep hearing about the Wood money and why it hasn't been reinvested but wasn't that 15 million in increments over 3 years?

I think money has been invested this year, but invested poorly in some areas. I'm hoping the mistakes of this season (one of the biggest was saying minimum target was a top 6 finish if this is part of a 5 year plan) will be learnt.

I do understand your point of view about our better players and are they going to want to stay at a club that is trying to re-build itself but I struggle to see if he is using it as a cash cow just yet.

A question for you Marley, do you think Radrizanni has been an improvement over previous owners, Cellino, GFH, Bates, Krasner?

he could not be any worse fella , but he is nowhere near what is required , the fans want promotion now , they are sick to death of sitting around waiting forever, waiting for father christmas to walk through the door.

[MrsORichSenior]

Indeed - what price blind loyalty eh? Fans AND players.

The result can be being walked all over without complaint. Or it can be glory and success.

And the reason players don't have any of it anyore, is that they were being walked all over without complaint, so they flipped it to the opposite - no loyalty and total control.

Fans can't have it both ways - if we're blindly, positively loyal, we will get walked all over. And club-organised fora and 'opportunities to speak' don't constitute a voice, just as those old players asking the chairman for a raise and never getting it didn't.

So - how are the fans REALLY going have a voice, now the players have got theirs? If Pontus is able to exercise his democratic rights and choices, without club control or insider manipulation, then so are we. Here's how:

* Massive social media storm against stupid club choices (the badge)? Check.

* Large numbers declaring dissatisfaction when players are not able enough/fit to wear the shirt? Check.

* Supporter demonstration at matches rather than misplaced blind support. Hmm.

* Withdrawal of revenue streams - not buying tickets, not buying new kit etc, not buying food/drink. Hmm.

So, ready for the storm of righteous indignation about ALAW and all the other b ollox spoken when anyone dares to suggest that we are in need of a different way of doing things, how about we consider that we as Leeds fans are a part of the problem - that very unquestioning, loyal, blind support is enabling - it has allowed all those owners and their acolytes to use the club, because they know/knew that 25000+ will buy whatever they sell, however c rap it is. And that's been going on for 15 years.

So maybe we need to look at ourselves and ask if going home and/or away is actually being a great Leeds fan.

Perhaps NOT going is going to get change quicker - an owner with a quarter full ground needs to do something about that a lot quicker than one with a two thirds full ground.

Discuss.

Hi Jez (in peace).

Blind faith ?

The club to me and many more is about more than just 90 minutes.

It's about a group,friends spanning many generations coming from all over the planet to share experiences good and bad,just like life.
Nobody travels from France,Ireland,Scotland to see a League Championship outfit on a cold wet day as in 2010 to congregate in the away end of S****horpe's Glanford Park with any sense - but many did and saw a glorious Howson treble hit the back of the net inside 15 mins in a 1-4 away day.
The same group stood with our backs to a game of football in Istanbul too and cheered the lads in Parc des Princes stadium on a dire night for all Leeds fans world wide ..... I could go on and on and on.

Why ?
Cos its 'our thing' and it makes us a family - no bloody logical reason but when you've done it you'd understand Jez.
Come what may we'll all be there again and again - even my daughter who suffers from Mental Health issues,one of which is OCD and who struggles to get through doorways BUT show her a turnstile to a Leeds match and she goes straight through without hesitation with all the other said fans,a medical phenomenon.
Madness,crazy but a fact ....... so no answers for you mate as Marley will tell you it's genetic.

ALAW - MOT

[MrsORichSenior]

Where are all these money people with fortunes to spend, and why haven't they bought the club years ago?

That's not having a pop at you but my answer is that the club has been run down for years by the dodgy owners. What would the new owners get for buying the club pre- Radrizanni? A name. We all know that the fans have been abused for years from these owners.

To get investment we need assets, the buying back of ER makes us a better proposition for investment. To me the future of this club isn't about just throwing money at the playing squad but investing in the structure of the club as well.

Wood and Taylor wasn't sold for profit, they were offered more than what we could ever offer them and wanted out. I keep hearing about the Wood money and why it hasn't been reinvested but wasn't that 15 million in increments over 3 years?

I think money has been invested this year, but invested poorly in some areas. I'm hoping the mistakes of this season (one of the biggest was saying minimum target was a top 6 finish if this is part of a 5 year plan) will be learnt.

I do understand your point of view about our better players and are they going to want to stay at a club that is trying to re-build itself but I struggle to see if he is using it as a cash cow just yet.

A question for you Marley, do you think Radrizanni has been an improvement over previous owners, Cellino, GFH, Bates, Krasner?

Fair points Fred ............ Je veux faire l'amour avec vous !

ALAW - MOT

[Ozwhites]

Hi Jez (in peace).

Blind faith ?

The club to me and many more is about more than just 90 minutes.

It's about a group,friends spanning many generations coming from all over the planet to share experiences good and bad,just like life.
Nobody travels from France,Ireland,Scotland to see a League Championship outfit on a cold wet day as in 2010 to congregate in the away end of S****horpe's Glanford Park with any sense - but many did and saw a glorious Howson treble hit the back of the net inside 15 mins in a 1-4 away day.
The same group stood with our backs to a game of football in Istanbul too and cheered the lads in Parc des Princes stadium on a dire night for all Leeds fans world wide ..... I could go on and on and on.

Why ?
Cos its 'our thing' and it makes us a family - no bloody logical reason but when you've done it you'd understand Jez.
Come what may we'll all be there again and again - even my daughter who suffers from Mental Health issues,one of which is OCD and who struggles to get through doorways BUT show her a turnstile to a Leeds match and she goes straight through without hesitation with all the other said fans,a medical phenomenon.
Madness,crazy but a fact ....... so no answers for you mate as Marley will tell you it's genetic.

ALAW - MOT

Fantastic that through illness she clutches on to something with passion which is dear to her. Win or lose. Would imagine it provides as good a therapy as any other. ☺

[Jezleeds]

Hi Jez (in peace).

Blind faith ?

The club to me and many more is about more than just 90 minutes.

It's about a group,friends spanning many generations coming from all over the planet to share experiences good and bad,just like life.
Nobody travels from France,Ireland,Scotland to see a League Championship outfit on a cold wet day as in 2010 to congregate in the away end of S****horpe's Glanford Park with any sense - but many did and saw a glorious Howson treble hit the back of the net inside 15 mins in a 1-4 away day.
The same group stood with our backs to a game of football in Istanbul too and cheered the lads in Parc des Princes stadium on a dire night for all Leeds fans world wide ..... I could go on and on and on.

Why ?
Cos its 'our thing' and it makes us a family - no bloody logical reason but when you've done it you'd understand Jez.
Come what may we'll all be there again and again - even my daughter who suffers from Mental Health issues,one of which is OCD and who struggles to get through doorways BUT show her a turnstile to a Leeds match and she goes straight through without hesitation with all the other said fans,a medical phenomenon.
Madness,crazy but a fact ....... so no answers for you mate as Marley will tell you it's genetic.

ALAW - MOT

In peace too - but....

Ah you never fail to do it! The patronising part, that is. In amongst fair enough stuff.

when i've done it? You think i don't i've gone through anything to support my club?

You don't think i've had those same experiences of doing it through thick and thin?

Just because you've done it Mrs O, doesn't mean other people haven't and don't.

As i said, the problem is the unquestioning part - you see that as something wonderful and special - i see it as allowing those that run OUR club off the hook, and failing to see how it never calls anyone to account. Living in hope and desperation and funding that vicious circle as they know you will.

You're spot on about the whole part about us, and family stuff (even though you seem to think you're the only one that is part of that, for some reason - you really ought to try and find out about other people's Leeds experiences a bit more before assuming you are holier than thou - thanks for telling me it's 'genetic' by the way - i just never realised that with my grandad in Bramley when we got the bus to town to take the bus to Elland Road all those years ago, and now you've helped me see the light).

I'm glad your daughter is doing well - and that your particular Leeds experience helps her. Just bear in mind that yours isn't everybody's Leeds experience though - walk in other people's shoes a bit.

Interesting that Marley (who apparently goes every week) says that my suggestion of not going every week is a good one. Still waiting for you to argue with him about anything, by the way, given he says everything twice as strongly as WTF or I or anyone else ever does, but for some reason, you can't see anything in his posts to criticise....

[Jezleeds]

In peace too - but....

Ah you never fail to do it! The patronising part, that is. In amongst fair enough stuff.

when i've done it? You think i don't i've gone through anything to support my club?

You don't think i've had those same experiences of doing it through thick and thin?

Just because you've done it Mrs O, doesn't mean other people haven't and don't.

As i said, the problem is the unquestioning part - you see that as something wonderful and special - i see it as allowing those that run OUR club off the hook, and failing to see how it never calls anyone to account. Living in hope and desperation and funding that vicious circle as they know you will.

You're spot on about the whole part about us, and family stuff (even though you seem to think you're the only one that is part of that, for some reason - you really ought to try and find out about other people's Leeds experiences a bit more before assuming you are holier than thou - thanks for telling me it's 'genetic' by the way - i just never realised that with my grandad in Bramley when we got the bus to town to take the bus to Elland Road all those years ago, and now you've helped me see the light).

I'm glad your daughter is doing well - and that your particular Leeds experience helps her. Just bear in mind that yours isn't everybody's Leeds experience though - walk in other people's shoes a bit.

Interesting that Marley (who apparently goes every week) says that my suggestion of not going every week is a good one. Still waiting for you to argue with him about anything, by the way, given he says everything twice as strongly as WTF or I or anyone else ever does, but for some reason, you can't see anything in his posts to criticise....

PS - What Marx said about religion being the opium of the masses? Kept us working class northerners down for all those years till good old Keir Hardie helped our people see what they were doing to us. Worth thinking about that.....

[Marley past ghosts]

In peace too - but....

Ah you never fail to do it! The patronising part, that is. In amongst fair enough stuff.

when i've done it? You think i don't i've gone through anything to support my club?

You don't think i've had those same experiences of doing it through thick and thin?

Just because you've done it Mrs O, doesn't mean other people haven't and don't.

As i said, the problem is the unquestioning part - you see that as something wonderful and special - i see it as allowing those that run OUR club off the hook, and failing to see how it never calls anyone to account. Living in hope and desperation and funding that vicious circle as they know you will.

You're spot on about the whole part about us, and family stuff (even though you seem to think you're the only one that is part of that, for some reason - you really ought to try and find out about other people's Leeds experiences a bit more before assuming you are holier than thou - thanks for telling me it's 'genetic' by the way - i just never realised that with my grandad in Bramley when we got the bus to town to take the bus to Elland Road all those years ago, and now you've helped me see the light).

I'm glad your daughter is doing well - and that your particular Leeds experience helps her. Just bear in mind that yours isn't everybody's Leeds experience though - walk in other people's shoes a bit.

Interesting that Marley (who apparently goes every week) says that my suggestion of not going every week is a good one. Still waiting for you to argue with him about anything, by the way, given he says everything twice as strongly as WTF or I or anyone else ever does, but for some reason, you can't see anything in his posts to criticise....

me and mrs o, never argue , we are like mother and son lol . her son rich is a good friend of mine . many fans will withdraw from shelling out if it means getting rid of an unscrupulous owner , i had plenty of practice when bates was here. and that guy makes radrizaani look like mary poppins .

[Jezleeds]

me and mrs o, never argue , we are like mother and son lol . her son rich is a good friend of mine . many fans will withdraw from shelling out if it means getting rid of an unscrupulous owner , i had plenty of practice when bates was here. and that guy makes radrizaani look like mary poppins .

lol says it all really Marley. You attack people relentlessly and at times viciously for holding views exactly like Mrs O's, but she's your mate's mum, so you don't do it to her?

I think you're right on Radrizzani though. If he doesn't get his hands in his (supposedly deep) pockets, then there will be a lot of discontent.