Lawlessness under this goverment

[mickd1961]

Where to start...
Originally from Rowley Regis. Moved away from there nearly 15 years ago and now I have a place in London and an apartment in Birmingham City Centre and I divide my time between the two. I still have family and friends where I grew up and go back to see them regularly, never heard of any issues with Europeans. I work and live alongside Europeans right now, never had an issue. I don't know Lye, so I can't comment on it, but I have friends in Halesowen and Stourbridge and they've never mentioned anything to me.

In terms of the problems you describe. An EU population growth of 100k per year over 100 years is a pop growth of 10 million. Would I accept that if our economy was stable and continued to grow...I would answer yes to that. Population growth is not just a UK problem, its a global issue.

Out of 100,000 people coming into the UK. There will be rotten apples, its a given. Just like what we had with the commonwealth influx a few decades ago. But you seem to be directing your anger towards the EU for it, why? The EU has a written law that penniless beggars (burden on the state) or criminals that are EU nationals can be deported. Why aren't you angry with the police or UK Govt for not enforcing this?

The reason I want to remain is the economical benefits. If you look at respected economist forecasts such as the IFS, the CBI or even the Govt's very own Brexit impact report - they make for seriously grave reading. The Governor of the BoE has advised every household is £900 per year down since the referendum and we haven't even left yet. The 2nd worst affected area of the UK (According to the Govt's Brexit dept) will be the West Midlands. The economic damage we are doing to ourselves is enormous, it is actually scary. I speak to many businesses through my line of work, nationally and internationally. Many have held off making key investment decisions in the UK until the uncertainty of Brexit is cleared up. We are putting up trading barriers with our largest trading partner and the largest trading bloc in the world. And why? Because people have been fed lies and misleading reports.

Any rational argument for remaining is being discredited by slogans and soundbites with absolutely no substance behind it. "Project Fear" "Unelected Beaurocrats" "Leave means Leave" "Will of the People".
All created by the Daily Mail and The Sun...what do these sayings actually mean. Want real answers, check out the leaked report from the Govt's Brexit impact report. A body which assumes we will make the FTA's that we intend to without any issue.

I don't think leave voters are thick or racist, half of my family and friends voted to leave. I just can't work out one single benefit of leaving the EU. Not one...

But there are quite a few things you've both stated I can't get my head around...here's a couple of them..

Minn...
"Did you hear the story of the white English lady who wanted to open a shop up Lye high street and was rounded on and threatened by a group of Asian men who threatened her to drop the idea or else?"
What does this have to do with leaving the EU? How many Asian people do you know that are from predominantly EU countries?

Mickd
"Irish border who gives a flying feck!"
The Irish border issue is a real problem, we've had peace since the GFA of the mid 90's...why risk peace?


Anyway, I like to debate and not argue so I'm with you on that one Mickd. We both want the same thing, which is a safe, prosperous country to work and live in and to bring our kids up in. Just how we go about it is where we differ...

I never mentioned the Irish border mate.

It’s only a problem because Europe are making it so,we all know it could be so “soft” as to be hardly noticeable,it suits “Junket” and Barnier to kick off in this.

Minn’s point isn’t aimed at the European influx,as a local I get his drift.

Lye has become a mainly Asian enclave over the last 35 years to the point where their younger element feel like they own it in my opinion.

It was up until recent maybe 70/30 in favour of Asians but throwing in the Romanians has blown the whole thing up.

I’m amazed your local friends don’t know of this,I think if you asked them directly you’d get a different story.

As I said,go on line and read the Stourbridge News.

[WBA53]

[QUOTE=WBA123;38917514]Where to start...
Originally from Rowley Regis. Moved away from there nearly 15 years ago and now I have a place in London and an apartment in Birmingham City Centre and I divide my time between the two. I still have family and friends where I grew up and go back to see them regularly, never heard of any issues with Europeans. I work and live alongside Europeans right now, never had an issue. I don't know Lye, so I can't comment on it, but I have friends in Halesowen and Stourbridge and they've never mentioned anything to me.

In terms of the problems you describe. An EU population growth of 100k per year over 100 years is a pop growth of 10 million. Would I accept that if our economy was stable and continued to grow...I would answer yes to that. Population growth is not just a UK problem, its a global issue.

Out of 100,000 people coming into the UK. There will be rotten apples, its a given. Just like what we had with the commonwealth influx a few decades ago. But you seem to be directing your anger towards the EU for it, why? The EU has a written law that penniless beggars (burden on the state) or criminals that are EU nationals can be deported. Why aren't you angry with the police or UK Govt for not enforcing this?

The reason I want to remain is the economical benefits. If you look at respected economist forecasts such as the IFS, the CBI or even the Govt's very own Brexit impact report - they make for seriously grave reading. The Governor of the BoE has advised every household is £900 per year down since the referendum and we haven't even left yet. The 2nd worst affected area of the UK (According to the Govt's Brexit dept) will be the West Midlands. The economic damage we are doing to ourselves is enormous, it is actually scary. I speak to many businesses through my line of work, nationally and internationally. Many have held off making key investment decisions in the UK until the uncertainty of Brexit is cleared up. We are putting up trading barriers with our largest trading partner and the largest trading bloc in the world. And why? Because people have been fed lies and misleading reports.

Any rational argument for remaining is being discredited by slogans and soundbites with absolutely no substance behind it. "Project Fear" "Unelected Beaurocrats" "Leave means Leave" "Will of the People".
All created by the Daily Mail and The Sun...what do these sayings actually mean. Want real answers, check out the leaked report from the Govt's Brexit impact report. A body which assumes we will make the FTA's that we intend to without any issue.

I don't think leave voters are thick or racist, half of my family and friends voted to leave. I just can't work out one single benefit of leaving the EU. Not one...

But there are quite a few things you've both stated I can't get my head around...here's a couple of them..

Minn...
"Did you hear the story of the white English lady who wanted to open a shop up Lye high street and was rounded on and threatened by a group of Asian men who threatened her to drop the idea or else?"
What does this have to do with leaving the EU? How many Asian people do you know that are from predominantly EU countries?

Mickd
"Irish border who gives a flying feck!"
The Irish border issue is a real problem, we've had peace since the GFA of the mid 90's...why risk peace?


Anyway, I like to debate and not argue so I'm with you on that one Mickd. We both want the same thing, which is a safe, prosperous country to work and live in and to bring our kids up in. Just how we go about it is where we differ...[/QUOT
If you think the population will only grow by 10 million over a hundred years your a crackpot,it'll see that rise in my restricted lifetime,sorry but the immigrants are out breeding us at a very fast rate.get real

[mickd1961]

Correct 53.

Like I keep saying....fans of unregulated immigration won’t ever answer the question as to how many they think we should stop at in future when island is full.....5 trillion?

[WBA123]

It will grow at 10 million EU migrants if last years net immigration is repeated for the next 100 years, those are the factual figures. But we're not talking about just EU migration. Immigrants from outside the EU are coming here in double the numbers of EU nationals and contributing less. And we have more legal rights to deport EU nationals than we do non EU.

The line seems to be blurring with this. And that's quite important to know that when people talk about voting leave because of Asian gangs. This has absolutely nothing to do with the EU.

Brexit has absolutely no bearing on Non EU immigration. Only EU migrants, who's net benefit to the country is a lot of income...

Check the study by researchers at University College London (UCL) which concluded European immigrants had boosted Britain’s public finances by more than 20 billion pounds between 2001 and 2011.

[baggieal]

It will grow at 10 million EU migrants if last years net immigration is repeated for the next 100 years, those are the factual figures. But we're not talking about just EU migration. Immigrants from outside the EU are coming here in double the numbers of EU nationals and contributing less. And we have more legal rights to deport EU nationals than we do non EU.

The line seems to be blurring with this. And that's quite important to know that when people talk about voting leave because of Asian gangs. This has absolutely nothing to do with the EU.

Brexit has absolutely no bearing on Non EU immigration. Only EU migrants, who's net benefit to the country is a lot of income...

Check the study by researchers at University College London (UCL) which concluded European immigrants had boosted Britain’s public finances by more than 20 billion pounds between 2001 and 2011.

Yes but, if those EU countries stopped all the immigrants coming in then, there would be less issues. Once in - there is free movement across all the EU countries to - yes you have guessed it - to the good old UK. Italy had the balls yesterday to say NO to that boat load of 600 immigrants but good old Spain, have said they will take them in! So where will they come - Spain to the UK without much restriction. We are all humane so the EU country who first takes in immigrants should give them all a good meal, clothing and medicine, and send them back! It's like flies on **** - the more you help, the bigger the problem encouraging others to come on over. Lets get into a EU country and head towards the land of benefits and free NHS and Housing.

How about saying - whichever EU Country lets them in, makes them citizens of that country with the same rights as its nationals - it's not gonna happen. So is it a EU problem - yes caused to a degree by borderless zones and being too soft.

Also, should there not be the same reciprocal rights in each EU Country - if a Romanian comes to the UK and can claim X, Y or Z, why can't a UK Citizen go to Romania and claim exactly the same benefits?

[Leicesterbaggie]

My main gripe regarding Brexit is these whinging remainers. The House of Lords; of course they're going to want to stay in as many of them receive very handsome subsides for land that they own. Tony Blair; what the h ell has it got to do with him? TV and film personalities; same as Tony Blair and what gives them the the right to lecture the rest of us as most of them aren't that bright anyway. I could go on, but you get my drift. If Maggie Thatcher had been PM we'd have been out by now and wouldn't have been bullied by those EU bureaucrats.

Let's face it, if we have another referendum, what's stopping the population demanding another election if the party that millions voted for in the next general election didn't get in? Same difference to my mind.

If we have another referendum on this I don't think I'll ever vote again as democracy will be 'out of the window'.

[WBA123]

My main gripe regarding Brexit is these whinging remainers. The House of Lords; of course they're going to want to stay in as many of them receive very handsome subsides for land that they own. Tony Blair; what the h ell has it got to do with him? TV and film personalities; same as Tony Blair and what gives them the the right to lecture the rest of us as most of them aren't that bright anyway. I could go on, but you get my drift. If Maggie Thatcher had been PM we'd have been out by now and wouldn't have been bullied by those EU bureaucrats.

Let's face it, if we have another referendum, what's stopping the population demanding another election if the party that millions voted for in the next general election didn't get in? Same difference to my mind.

If we have another referendum on this I don't think I'll ever vote again as democracy will be 'out of the window'.

Suppose I'm a whinging remainer then....

Tony Blair won 3 general elections in this country, he's got more of a clue than most.

My main gripe is with the press in this country. Ran by overseas moguls who only care about how deep their pockets are. The Daily Mail is registered in Bermuda to avoid paying tax, its the most hypocritical paper of the lot.

Problem is, people actually believe the sh!t they print. They ran a story about abolishing the House of Lords. Now its all of a sudden a popular choice to abolish it....? Give me strength...

The problem with Brexit is it is threatening our democratic constitution. The House of Lords have been part of our constitution for hundreds of years. The Daily Mail have attacked our civil servants, our independent judiciary, House of Lords and serving MPs. Something should be done, because they are attacking the very fabric of Britain.

This is how this country has been run for centuries, yet we have a Brexit vote 2 years ago and it changes our country. Thought we were 'Taking back control'. What's also ironic is that the Lib Dems tried to reform the HoL in 2010 and Rees-Mogg and Co voted against it. The HoL hasn't changed in the last few years....Just the opportunistic, self serving MPs jumping on the press' bandwagon.

And Maggie Thatcher by the way took us into the Single Market (Or common market as it was called then).

Also, democracy is a process, not a one-off event. So if we vote again to remain, that is democracy. If in the future after that, we vote again and the majority decide they want to leave, then that is too democracy. Democracy doesn't stand still. Its why we have a GE every 5 years. A one-off vote which doesn't change is a dictatorship.

We need a free press but ours are out of control, they need to be regulated somehow. They manipulate for their on personal gain, pity not enough people see it.

[Albionic68]

And Maggie Thatcher by the way took us into the Single Market (Or common market as it was called then).

I think Edward Heath may want a word from the grave.

[Leicesterbaggie]

Yes, Maggie Thatcher did take us into the Common Market and I was in favour of it. Don't forget, it was only six countries from Western Europe in a trading alliance. A little different to what it is now, virtually a twenty seven nation federal state wanting its own army. Some of them I'm not sure are geographically in Europe. You cannot compare the two, not in my opinion anyway.

You and I, 123, are never going agree politically but I think we at least agree on most things Albion! By the way I don't take the Daily Mail.

[WBA123]

I think Edward Heath may want a word from the grave.

Actually you're right, it was good old Maggie who started us off on our way to the Single Market in 1992 (not the common market)...one of her very few successes.

And how right she was...

Here's a transcript of a speech she made on 18th April 1988;


"We must get this right. Too often in the past Britain has missed opportunities.

How we meet the challenge of the Single Market will be a major factor, possibly the major factor, in our competitive position in European and world markets into the twenty-first century. [end p2] Getting it right needs a partnership between government and business.

The task of government is two-fold: —to negotiate in Brussels so as to get the possible results for Britain; —and then to make you the business community aware of the opportunities, so that you can make the most of them. [end p3]

It's your job, the job of business, to gear yourselves up to take the opportunities which a single market of nearly 320 million people will offer.

Just think for a moment what a prospect that is. A single market without barriers—visible or invisible—giving you direct and unhindered access to the purchasing power [end p4] of over 300 million of the world's wealthiest and most prosperous people.

Bigger than Japan. Bigger than the United States. On your doorstep. And with the Channel Tunnel to give you direct access to it.

It's not a dream. [end p5] It's not a vision. It's not some bureaucrat's plan. It's for real"