General News Chat

[Aldo1983]

Labour are a middle class party. Nothing necessarily wrong with that but when they are the best hope to take on the Tories then we are doomed.

[donsdaft]

They are doomed.

We can get out of it.

[Red Zone]

Yet still miles behind the hapless corrupt psychotic arseholes in the polls. His plan? Let’s pander to them to try and win back the red wall. The Labour Party would be as well calling it a day if they lose Hartlepool

The strategy is right as let's face it they are not going to win any blue seats ending in the word "shire". I wouldn't pay too much attention to opinion polls at the moment as they artificially inflate the Tories on the back of the vaccination roll out (and the EU roll-out being sh1t so playing to red wall voters) and lifting of lockdown restrictions. Lot's to play out before the next election that will bring down the Tory vote and people will naturally switch to Labour as no other realistic option

1. Public Inquiry into how much of a shambles the approach to covid was will be a disaster for Tories.
2. Tax rises for most people over the coming years with limited scope for pre election giveaways
3. It won't be called austerity but austerity like policies to cut deficit - more things like the miserable 1% pay offer to nurses
4. Boris will naturally shoot himself in the foot multiple times over the coming years because he is lazy and speaks/acts before he thinks
5. Plus the big ticket item of Brexit that I suspect will be much worse than anyone realises it will be because the French etc will make sure it is to stop anyone else leaving the EU so economy will be worse, unemployment higher etc than the last election.
6. The vaccination roll-out will be a distant memory by then as will the Brexit vote

I agree that Starmer is very underwhelming and much worse than I expected him to be but a steady safe pair of hands might well be enough against Johnson by 2024. Remember elections are not won by the core vote that will always vote Labour/Tory but by the 30% or so in the middle that are willing to swap sides in the 100 or so constituencies that can change hands.

[donsdaft]

They’ll just tell bigger and bigger lies, and that 30% will believe them.

[Aldo1983]

The strategy is right as let's face it they are not going to win any blue seats ending in the word "shire". I wouldn't pay too much attention to opinion polls at the moment as they artificially inflate the Tories on the back of the vaccination roll out (and the EU roll-out being sh1t so playing to red wall voters) and lifting of lockdown restrictions. Lot's to play out before the next election that will bring down the Tory vote and people will naturally switch to Labour as no other realistic option

1. Public Inquiry into how much of a shambles the approach to covid was will be a disaster for Tories.
2. Tax rises for most people over the coming years with limited scope for pre election giveaways
3. It won't be called austerity but austerity like policies to cut deficit - more things like the miserable 1% pay offer to nurses
4. Boris will naturally shoot himself in the foot multiple times over the coming years because he is lazy and speaks/acts before he thinks
5. Plus the big ticket item of Brexit that I suspect will be much worse than anyone realises it will be because the French etc will make sure it is to stop anyone else leaving the EU so economy will be worse, unemployment higher etc than the last election.
6. The vaccination roll-out will be a distant memory by then as will the Brexit vote

I agree that Starmer is very underwhelming and much worse than I expected him to be but a steady safe pair of hands might well be enough against Johnson by 2024. Remember elections are not won by the core vote that will always vote Labour/Tory but by the 30% or so in the middle that are willing to swap sides in the 100 or so constituencies that can change hands.

1. They'll get off with it and people will forget even if they don't because so many people don't really have the attention span.

2. They'll spin it and then see above.

3. Austerity hasn't cost them at all during their time in power.

4. Boris has been acting that way since he first became an MP. I can't see why it'll make a difference now.

5. Brexit means less foreigners so that's all that matters to a lot of people down there. Europe will have the same issues as anyone else so they'll spin it to make us look better.

6. They'll be something else shiny.

7. Labour are ****.

2024 is a long way off and the hope that labour will get a massive swing in their favour isn't something I'm going to put money on.

Get the referendum fired up.

[The Red Max]

Any vote for independence has got to be predicated on an anti-austerity, republican basis underpinned by a mass working class movement (and proceeding with a referendum regardless of Section 30), that the neo-liberal SNP will baulk at, otherwise what's the point?

Low corporate taxation, race to the bottom freeports and the bosses charter of the Strategic Growth Commission, staying in NATO, re-joining the bosses club of the EU etc etc indicate saltire waving just for the sake of it and the usual status quo dressed up in different clobber.

Tommy Sheridan's Solidarity approach of getting independence over the line first without a corresponding socially democratic perspective is a total sell out.

Independence has to be more than just wha's like us, damn few etc.

[Mason89]

You’ll never get those things without independence first. If those options were available already, there would be no need for independence. Sheridan is a sell out arsehole but he’s right here

[donsdaft]

Let’s just get independence done.
Sound familiar?

Then you can be as right or left wing as you want.

[The Red Max]

Aye it sounds like a familiar Tory Party slogan that has served a load of incompetent parasitic criminals well, aided and abetted by a disgrace of an enabling Blairite Labour Party. And I'll be as left wing as I want now, if its alright with you, chief.

Sorry, you don't get one without the other, a total fallacy. Like it or lump it, SNP will not push any envelopes on this and the Tories will not budge.

The SNP will not hold an 'illegal' referendum and will be sh1te scared of getting behind a mass movement pushing for its democratic rights to self-determination as they have one eye on how the EU came down like a ton of bricks on the Catalan independence movement for exactly the same thing.

And Tommy is a one time good guy but now sell oot,full stop. A Galloway-esque political opportunist of the first rank. I'm sure He knows full well that its complete false consciousness that independence will automatically precede and lead to a socially progressive nation unencumbered by corporate interests especially when that nation is looking to incentivise their influence through Celtic Tiger-style miniscule corporate taxation.

[The Red Max]

Labour are a middle class party. Nothing necessarily wrong with that but when they are the best hope to take on the Tories then we are doomed.

Sadly, 100% correct.