OT - Boris Johnson and the Freedom of Speech

[Romanis]

Just a quick comment on your Facebook feedback thingy Andrew.

I think whilst Facebook and whatever data gleaned from it, or even targeted articles, posts and ads there, can and does influence voters, raises one's profiles and opinions of certain segments of society, its impact is over-rated.

Primarily because such topics are the ones that will only attract the types of people who are interested in the matter. Therefore you'll get like as you say, 80% of comments supporting or opposing as the case maybe. So you'll go away thinking hey, this is the majority view but in reality it isn't and even if it does by only small margins and that too only for some aspects of the subject in question.

For example I've noticed in certain elections out here in Asia, if you go by Facebook alone, you'll think there's a groundswell of votes against the ruling party and they'll be surely defeated. Then come election day, you find they retained power rather handily. Why is this so? Because Facebook is generally the one place where govts have no control over and hence becomes the 'rendezvous' of opposition supporters.

So while you may have a point or maybe in this instance, it might be correct, I would caution in taking any feedback from Facebook as a given.

[MadAmster]

If your son married a muslim girl and they had a daughter, would it bother you if your granddaughter was wearing a burka?

Yes. Because I was born into an open society where the face tells you a lot about others with whom you interact. Your words can lie but the face often tells the truth. People moving into an open society should follow that society's custom.

The Queen, Maggie T and Mayhem. All 3 would wear a head scarf or similar when visiting Muslim countries. Adhering to the local custom. Dignatories visiting Israel always wear a keppel, respecting local custom.

Muslims move to Western countries and want to bring their Sharia Law with them and their clothing customs that go against our Western customs ane we are supposed to respect that. How about short term, long term and permanent visitors to the UK respecting UK custom and not cover their faces.

This respecting others customs looks very much like a one way street.

[ramAnag]

TOTALLY invalid argument and, in the hands of those with some degree of status or influence (such as, for instance Ruth Davidson) as potentially inflammatory as BJs original gob off. Crucifix, turbans and footy shirts are all badges of allegiance but I havent seen any hiding the wearers identity. If you value an open society you should be supporting the majority requirement for citizens to be open about who they are , not acting as an apologist for a group who seek to conceal themselves

Hardly ‘totally invalid’ Andy...the burka too is a show of ‘allegiance’ however I take your point about the others not providing an element of ‘disguise’ so...as I asked much earlier...where do you stand on hoodies, parkas, sunglasses, beards, wigs, baseball caps, flat caps, crash helmets and scarves etc?
Oh, and I’m not ‘acting as an apologist’ for anyone. I don’t like the damned things but I like witch hunts even less and while I don’t understand burka wearers I see no reason for any apologies.

[Andy_Faber]

Hardly ‘totally invalid’ Andy...the burka too is a show of ‘allegiance’ however I take your point about the others not providing an element of ‘disguise’ so...as I asked much earlier...where do you stand on hoodies, parkas, sunglasses, beards, wigs, baseball caps, flat caps, crash helmets and scarves etc?
Oh, and I’m not ‘acting as an apologist’ for anyone. I don’t like the damned things but I like witch hunts even less and while I don’t understand burka wearers I see no reason for any apologies.

The hoodies etc argument is a weak one, there will always be those with ill intent who use such disguise BUT, ask someone with no ill intent to remove a crash helmet or glasses to identify themselves and they probably will, do the same with a burka wearer and the lily allen brigade will be all over you like a rash. My issue isn’t even about the burka or its wearers it’s about the unfathomable ring of apologists that suddenly appear to defend ‘rights’

[Andy_Faber]

Just a quick comment on your Facebook feedback thingy Andrew.

.

Rom, first and to use a colloquialism ‘I’m not thick’, I do understand the way facebook can skew things. Second, I refer back to it regularly because it gives me a window on the world that I don’t see in my ‘were upper middle class and non of this really affects us’ social bubble. Mainstream media is no longer the place to go to get a feel for the way the country and the world is leaning IMO, nor the words of those in positions of authority

[Romanis]

Rom, first and to use a colloquialism ‘I’m not thick’, I do understand the way facebook can skew things. Second, I refer back to it regularly because it gives me a window on the world that I don’t see in my ‘were upper middle class and non of this really affects us’ social bubble. Mainstream media is no longer the place to go to get a feel for the way the country and the world is leaning IMO, nor the words of those in positions of authority

Sorry I wasn't really suggesting or attempting to suggest you didn't realise, more a general post and a 'for your information' type of post. But yeah, I can see it coming off as that by the way I posted.
Mainstream media can sometimes be the direct opposite to what people post on social media. Anyone reading either, might come away believing that's really case when in reality, the ordinary folk, don't even bother with either.. So yeah it's hard to pin down what's really is the reality if we just read 1 or the other. 1 really needs to read varying number of sites, to get the accurate reading.

Even the good ol' BBC, once the last bastion of unfiltered and unbiased news reporting, can no longer be entrusted with the barometer of public perception. Everyone seems to have an agenda.

[StensonRam]

Who gives a toss about politics especially on a football forum, boring!

[Romanis]

Who gives a toss about politics especially on a football forum, boring!

I think after today's result, a change of topic, even boring political ones ain't a bad idea.

[StensonRam]

Never, poor result granted but politics is ****, I would much rather discuss how bad we were

[ramAnag]

Who gives a toss about politics especially on a football forum, boring!

Leave it out Stenny. When you and Andy bang on about F1 or MA and Andy indulge in a bit of Northern Soul chat others don’t complain.
At least politics, sadly, impacts upon us all...if you’re not interested just ignore it...plenty do seem to contribute.

As for why we lost...we looked like a leaderless group (no Davis) who’d just met and were playing the best side in the Championship on current, two match, form...and that’s about what happened.