Strange one...

[aloreburn]

Lots of fitba still to play George however Harkins is not capable of giving us 90 minutes

Absolute nonsense

[jardi]

I fully agree with Papa here. Obviously we will not have anyone of the calibre of Dobbie or Harkins on the bench, - because if we did we'd be at the top of the SPL. However, - regardless of how good the aforementioned players are, - plus Dykes and Stirling who have improved exponentially, - it is absolutely impossible for these wonderful players to perform at the same explosive tempo throughout the match, - and for that reason alone, - our manager should be bringing on substitutes.

The only reason for not doing so now would be sheer bloody mindedness, - so come on sir, please prove us wrong, - bring on the subs, - like every other team does and let's see if there is a diamond or even just a roughly hewn stone that might help boost the team in the last 15 to 20 minutes.

If nothing else it will protect Dobbie who looks like he has a tweak.

[ALBERTZ_11]

Naysmith was singing the praises of Bell and Murray not long ago. Remember Bell's goal at Inverness and Murray's great goal at Palmerston last season?

[Francis_begbie_HFC]

Naysmith was singing the praises of Bell and Murray not long ago. Remember Bell's goal at Inverness and Murray's great goal at Palmerston last season?

guys from what iv seen from our manager sofar is ,he wants a team of experienced players and also a bench full of them ,he doesnt come across as a manager who rates youth a first teamers ,i really think this will be naysmiths last season at palmy as he very clearly isnt getting the squads he wants from our board ,naysmith is just starting out on his managerial career so he will defo be gunning to impress ,so thats why i cant see him manage here for much longer as soon as a team that can give him the budget he needs comes in ,he will be gone .

[jardi]

And who will give him a budget if he can't manage?

I think he has and is doing a wonderful job, - but no-one would have criticised him if he'd thrown on the subs to try and salvage a point at Firhill.

What might end up happening is that Frizell is recalled because he's not getting enough game time; - the young lad from Vancouver will be recalled because he's not getting ANY game time and young Connor will say F*** this for a game of soldiers, - I can't even get a sub appearance when we're losing!

A managers job is about assessing risk and I would have no issue if we'd been winning 3-2 at Partick and he'd refused to play inexperienced youngsters......however, I've now laboured the point and I think the message should have got through to Mr. Naysmith, - its now over to him.

[Spikefaethesouth]

And who will give him a budget if he can't manage?

I think he has and is doing a wonderful job, - but no-one would have criticised him if he'd thrown on the subs to try and salvage a point at Firhill.

What might end up happening is that Frizell is recalled because he's not getting enough game time; - the young lad from Vancouver will be recalled because he's not getting ANY game time and young Connor will say F*** this for a game of soldiers, - I can't even get a sub appearance when we're losing!

A managers job is about assessing risk and I would have no issue if we'd been winning 3-2 at Partick and he'd refused to play inexperienced youngsters......however, I've now laboured the point and I think the message should have got through to Mr. Naysmith, - its now over to him.

I hear what you say Jardi but as ever it is never as a simple as it appears. The general consensus is that the starting eleven is as good as any other in the division which the players will know so the manager will have to massage those egos that will be inevitably present amongst that group. We have already seen Harkin's express disgust at being hooked as well as THE man Dobbie and I would suspect that Sterling's fragile looking confidence could be seriously affected too if constantly taken off when the going gets tough. It is not an easy job and to say that loan players will be recalled if not given game time is ridiculous unless it was written into the deal which brought them to the club in the first place otherwise you end up playing them for that reason alone which would be an even worse situation. The inevitable injuries will give those on the fringes their opportunity to show the manager their worth and if really good enough will make selection inevitable even over more established players.

At times it is clear that some players are clearly lagging and a change will freshen the team up but all I am saying that making changes is not always as easy as it appears to the punter without fully appreciating the mental state of the players you are looking to substitute. Anyway onwards and upwards with the tough visit to Inverness and hopefully we can get a full ninety minutes from the Queens, Mon the South

[jardi]

Spike, a well written and well balanced piece, - and I particularly note what you said about Harkins not being impressed when he was subbed against Ross County.

However, - personal egos are not the issue here, - it is about what is best for the entire team. Harkins and Dobbie need to be protected too from overplaying and potential knocks and especially given their advanced years (for a footballer,) - it would make the greatest of sense to suggest to them that after an hour or so, - we may be looking to sub you, - which should be accepted by them.

Harkins was not impressed at being replaced in the Ross County game (and neither was I) because he was one of our more effective players in the second period - and that may have impacted on the manager's decision last week at Thistle.

However, - the bottom line is this and there can be no ifs or buts about it, - if the team is losing and the best eleven are not producing the goods, then the team needs freshening up right reason or none.

Who the manager chooses to replace is entirely up to him, - but I'd have thought that there are several glaring options; 1) the player (s) who are not as effective because of the opposition or illness or a plethora of other possibilities and 2) the player (s) who is fading simply because he has given his all and he can't do any more.

Dykes was a prime candidate for substitution against Ross County because the boy was knackered and he'd been battered by the Ross County defence, but surprisingly Harkins was hooked?

Equally against St. Johnstone, - the entire team had given 100% and if it hadn't been for the potential for penalties, (and the best takers being on the pitch) - then anyone could have been taken off, - simply to provide fresh legs.

So to conclude, I understand and accept your argument,- but the manger must take cognisance of the greater good, - which is maximising the points on the board.

Extra fans are not going to come to Palmerston because the manager is an expert at massaging egos!

[Spikefaethesouth]

Spike, a well written and well balanced piece, - and I particularly note what you said about Harkins not being impressed when he was subbed against Ross County.

However, - personal egos are not the issue here, - it is about what is best for the entire team. Harkins and Dobbie need to be protected too from overplaying and potential knocks and especially given their advanced years (for a footballer,) - it would make the greatest of sense to suggest to them that after an hour or so, - we may be looking to sub you, - which should be accepted by them.

Harkins was not impressed at being replaced in the Ross County game (and neither was I) because he was one of our more effective players in the second period - and that may have impacted on the manager's decision last week at Thistle.

However, - the bottom line is this and there can be no ifs or buts about it, - if the team is losing and the best eleven are not producing the goods, then the team needs freshening up right reason or none.

Who the manager chooses to replace is entirely up to him, - but I'd have thought that there are several glaring options; 1) the player (s) who are not as effective because of the opposition or illness or a plethora of other possibilities and 2) the player (s) who is fading simply because he has given his all and he can't do any more.

Dykes was a prime candidate for substitution against Ross County because the boy was knackered and he'd been battered by the Ross County defence, but surprisingly Harkins was hooked?

Equally against St. Johnstone, - the entire team had given 100% and if it hadn't been for the potential for penalties, (and the best takers being on the pitch) - then anyone could have been taken off, - simply to provide fresh legs.

So to conclude, I understand and accept your argument,- but the manger must take cognisance of the greater good, - which is maximising the points on the board.

Extra fans are not going to come to Palmerston because the manager is an expert at massaging egos!

Excellent response, well put as always and it is hard to disagree. My point was simply that whilst it is easy to sit in a stand seeing that changes are needed it is seldom that straight forward for the guy who has to make those decisions. Dykes has appeared to virtually out on his feet come the end of recent games and obviously is in need of a break and would be a prime candidate for being subbed however if you remove him than who wins the ball upfront especially considering his physical ability to hold off the biggest of defenders freeing up space for the Dobbie. So it is not as easy as some think but I do agree that ego's should not come into it but unfortunately that is the nature of the game these days so the manager needs to be strong with his player management otherwise the season could peter out through fatigue if he continues with selecting the same starting eleven. A reflection of the limited size/quality of the squad once again.

[jardi]

Spike an excellent response too, - and effectively we agree that the manager needs to accept that changes must be made if his first choice are not - 1) performing as well as they should; 2) have given their all; - or 3) are being beaten.

It is simply not acceptable to keep trying to batter your way through a brick wall using the same tools, - especially if you have some unused tools in your kit box.

It is also unacceptable to use the argument "the spare tools wont work" .............because how do you know if you don't try?

This is not me simply sitting in the stand and making suggestions based on 47 years of coming to Palmerston, - this is my entire 'raison d'etre' in life, - if something is not working properly it is up to the manager to do all in his power to try and fix the problem. Sitting on his hands saying to anyone who'll listen, "I don't have the players" is unacceptable, or even worse blaming the BOD for not having a bigger squad, - especially when there are unused players sitting on their arse!

No, when losing a match and the inevitable is staring you in the face, then throw on the subs and tell them "this is your opportunity to shine" - and just watch them go.

I'd have loved to have seen Frizell and Connor running at teams and causing panic in the defensive ranks with 20 minutes to go. Yes it might not turn the game around, but watching a tired set of players slowly going through the motions will definitely not!

[Spikefaethesouth]

Spike an excellent response too, - and effectively we agree that the manager needs to accept that changes must be made if his first choice are not - 1) performing as well as they should; 2) have given their all; - or 3) are being beaten.

It is simply not acceptable to keep trying to batter your way through a brick wall using the same tools, - especially if you have some unused tools in your kit box.

It is also unacceptable to use the argument "the spare tools wont work" .............because how do you know if you don't try?

This is not me simply sitting in the stand and making suggestions based on 47 years of coming to Palmerston, - this is my entire 'raison d'etre' in life, - if something is not working properly it is up to the manager to do all in his power to try and fix the problem. Sitting on his hands saying to anyone who'll listen, "I don't have the players" is unacceptable, or even worse blaming the BOD for not having a bigger squad, - especially when there are unused players sitting on their arse!

No, when losing a match and the inevitable is staring you in the face, then throw on the subs and tell them "this is your opportunity to shine" - and just watch them go.

I'd have loved to have seen Frizell and Connor running at teams and causing panic in the defensive ranks with 20 minutes to go. Yes it might not turn the game around, but watching a tired set of players slowly going through the motions will definitely not!

Nothing I can disagree with there Jardi as we are both only looking for what is best for our beloved club and the maximisation of the playing resources so that we finish as high up in the league as we possibly can. Hopefully Naysmith can achieve what we both desire.