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Thread: O/T The Price Of Coal 1977 BBC Drama

  1. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by KerrAvon View Post
    You asked what had happened to the Notts miners, I answered by pointing out that they had moved on. How you get to that being a slur on you is beyond me.

    Of course the government prepared for the strike. The behaviour of the TUs had made it impossible for there not to be a confrontation. In 1974, Heath had run an election upon the question of 'who runs the country'. In the miner's strike, Thatcher asked it again.

    How many miners turned up for a polite word with the workers at Orgreave?
    The behaviour of the TU's cost us, not the state... Heath called an election, and lost, Thatcher chose to put in place a plan to actively attack a legitimate trade union, in the name of 'economics' she chose to attack her own people with a plan using the might of the state, interesting you say she "asked the country, no she didn't, maybe she should've called an election instead eh?

    Once again, your sheer ignorance of all things 'miners' is clear for all to see, how many police turned up, with cavalry, with riot gear, how strange it was that they actively encouraged everyone into the field, even helping with parking, remember for the weeks before that we were engaged in cat and mouse with the coppers at every road junction leading to Nottinghamshire, all of a sudden we were welcome..., one more thing, we were at Orgreave to stop the lorries, nothing to do with the workers there....



    Once again your ignorance is staggering, verging on idiocy,

  2. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by millmoormagic View Post
    The behaviour of the TU's cost us, not the state... Heath called an election, and lost, Thatcher chose to put in place a plan to actively attack a legitimate trade union, in the name of 'economics' she chose to attack her own people with a plan using the might of the state, interesting you say she "asked the country, no she didn't, maybe she should've called an election instead eh?

    Once again, your sheer ignorance of all things 'miners' is clear for all to see, how many police turned up, with cavalry, with riot gear, how strange it was that they actively encouraged everyone into the field, even helping with parking, remember for the weeks before that we were engaged in cat and mouse with the coppers at every road junction leading to Nottinghamshire, all of a sudden we were welcome..., one more thing, we were at Orgreave to stop the lorries, nothing to do with the workers there....



    Once again your ignorance is staggering, verging on idiocy,
    95 miners were arrested and charged in relation to Orgreave .

    All 95 cases collapsed because the evidence presented did not stack up on a number of levels , police fabrication was a key reason .

    Compensation was paid out to the miners who were arrested and charged .


    According to the information I have , there are almost 800 files from a number of police constabularies that weren't presented to then home secretary Amber Rudd when she announced there wouldn't be an official inquiry into the Battle Of Orgreave .

    Based on the collapse of the trials relating to the 95 miners and the reasons offered up and compensated for it is a rather unusual stand not to look at those 800 files in some detail .

    There seems to be a lack of enthusiasm from the government to take a step back in time and perhaps let the cat out of the bag .

    What are they and who are they seeking to protect ?

    A paramilitary style police force backed by the government to violently nullify a trade union perhaps ?

    The BBC instructed to show a misleading version of events that occured that day and favoured the government .

    Surely this only happens in South American banana republics and North Korea or China and not a democratically elected government in the UK .

    Personally they can shove their inquiry up their ring piece for me but I respect those that do want to see this happen .

    I suspect only a change of government with Corbyn as PM will be the only likely way any inquiry will be held .

    The Tory government will play for time of course , much like they did with the Hillsborough disaster .

  3. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by animallittle3 View Post
    95 miners were arrested and charged in relation to Orgreave .

    All 95 cases collapsed because the evidence presented did not stack up on a number of levels , police fabrication was a key reason .

    Compensation was paid out to the miners who were arrested and charged .


    According to the information I have , there are almost 800 files from a number of police constabularies that weren't presented to then home secretary Amber Rudd when she announced there wouldn't be an official inquiry into the Battle Of Orgreave .

    Based on the collapse of the trials relating to the 95 miners and the reasons offered up and compensated for it is a rather unusual stand not to look at those 800 files in some detail .

    There seems to be a lack of enthusiasm from the government to take a step back in time and perhaps let the cat out of the bag .

    What are they and who are they seeking to protect ?

    A paramilitary style police force backed by the government to violently nullify a trade union perhaps ?

    The BBC instructed to show a misleading version of events that occured that day and favoured the government .

    Surely this only happens in South American banana republics and North Korea or China and not a democratically elected government in the UK .

    Personally they can shove their inquiry up their ring piece for me but I respect those that do want to see this happen .

    I suspect only a change of government with Corbyn as PM will be the only likely way any inquiry will be held .

    The Tory government will play for time of course , much like they did with the Hillsborough disaster .
    Indeed Animal,

    I personally know one of those charged with riot, he's a Rotherham lad, and Silverwood miner, to add, we(as a family, i was only 18) put up one during the trial, from South Wales, a bloke in his fifties and the gentleist fella you'd wish to meet, charged with riot.....

    I actually attended much of the trial sitting in the public gallery, on one particular day(s) the copper in charge was giving evidence (Tony Clements) the defending barrister was Michael Mansfield, quite well known now, and he basically proved that Clements was lying through his teeth, most of the time, i've never seen someone with such a high position made to squirm so much, he didn't enjoy being called, quietly, a C**t on his way out either....as we know the trial collapsed, jumped up evidence of which we were to see later at Hillsborough, shame on you SYP, SHAME ON YOU.

  4. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by millmoormagic View Post
    Indeed Animal,

    I personally know one of those charged with riot, he's a Rotherham lad, and Silverwood miner, to add, we(as a family, i was only 18) put up one during the trial, from South Wales, a bloke in his fifties and the gentleist fella you'd wish to meet, charged with riot.....

    I actually attended much of the trial sitting in the public gallery, on one particular day(s) the copper in charge was giving evidence (Tony Clements) the defending barrister was Michael Mansfield, quite well known now, and he basically proved that Clements was lying through his teeth, most of the time, i've never seen someone with such a high position made to squirm so much, he didn't enjoy being called, quietly, a C**t on his way out either....as we know the trial collapsed, jumped up evidence of which we were to see later at Hillsborough, shame on you SYP, SHAME ON YOU.
    My own personal experience that day was to see clusters of police officers many on horseback indiscriminately dishing out beatings to miners trying to flee the scene .

    Anything thrown back towards the police was done to try and defend yourself against the tirade of violence we received .

    As I remember the day started peacefully with both miners and police in good spirits .

    That soon changed and we were set up to receive a good hiding and put us in our place , no doubt the tory goverment hiding away in oak paneled offices were kept in touch by their paramilitary forces at the scene and lapping it up .

    An interesting day on many levels , I had a fair turn of pace at 22 years old and was fit as the proverbial butcher's dog , I was lucky , many were not .

    How nobody died that day is beyond me given a single blow to the head can kill you quite easily .

    Not that it would have made any difference , if you can cover up the deaths of 96 football fans with rolling tv cameras and broad daylight then a few striking miners wouldn't be a problem I wouldn't have thought .

    The crime was to carry on working put food on the table , raise our families and pay the bills .

    When you strip it down to the bare bones that was our crime .

    Remarkable .

    I saw more violence from poll tax protesters dished out to the Met in London and they abolished that shortly afterwards and got rid of Thatcher too .

    Even more remarkable .

  5. #215
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    Kerr, you accused me of spoiling a thread and said you wanted to go wah wah to the mods to get me banned. I believe it was on a thread started by ibs which I didn't want to get involved in. Froggy will remember it because he was pissed off with us both for not getting on. Then again you do remember this don't you. Why do you get a kick out of offending decent posters on here showing not one ounce of sympathy for what happened to them. It's shocking really.

  6. #216
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    Tried not to comment on this thread. I come from a mining family father, uncles grand dad etc. The whole thing was traumatic as young 19 year old and became an angry young man for many years. The whole thing was orchestrated to destroy the most powerful union in the country. Thatcher was a bitch.

  7. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by ragingpup View Post
    Welcome back

    I haven't slavishly followed a political party - I voted Green in the later Blair years.

    I would say that at least I am supporting a party that at least has some ideas for tackling some of the ills that you as well as I accept that there are in the world around us.

    I ask again, which party do you think offers the best solutions? What policies would you like to see put in place that would help solve some of the challenges we face?

    Bump - come on Kerr - you were supposed to be getting back to me on this but seem only to be replying to others?

    Whilst your at it, please could you counter your rejection of Labour's "10% plan" with your own ideas of how you would solve the UK "productivity puzzle" that makes our workforce output (outside London and South East) amongst the worst in Europe?

    https://www.cam.ac.uk/research/featu...ctivity-puzzle


    (I'm beginning to think that to ask you what you would do, what policies you would support, to solve political problems is like the Cross to Dracula! I.e. I can spout any old gibberish on here as long as I finish with "what policies would you actually support on this issue Kerr" and you wouldn't come near me!).

  8. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by sickly_child View Post
    Tried not to comment on this thread. I come from a mining family father, uncles grand dad etc. The whole thing was traumatic as young 19 year old and became an angry young man for many years. The whole thing was orchestrated to destroy the most powerful union in the country. Thatcher was a bitch.
    I think 'destroy' is overstating the position. There was certainly an intention to end the strike culture that had held back and disrupted the UK economy for a couple of decades. That the NUM destroyed itself with it's tactics is probably something that she welcomed.

    I suspect that Thatcher was probably not a nice person to know, but in the final analysis she had won two General Elections and had won the right to govern the country. She went on to win another one after the strike.

    I think the strike was a terrible thing for all directly involved, whether working or not (although my sympathy is limited for those who took part in mass picketing or other forms of intimidation or violence). One particularly sad aspect is that, as animal points out, it was allowed to continue for some time after it was clear that had been lost.

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by ragingpup View Post
    Bump - come on Kerr - you were supposed to be getting back to me on this but seem only to be replying to others?

    Whilst your at it, please could you counter your rejection of Labour's "10% plan" with your own ideas of how you would solve the UK "productivity puzzle" that makes our workforce output (outside London and South East) amongst the worst in Europe?

    https://www.cam.ac.uk/research/featu...ctivity-puzzle


    (I'm beginning to think that to ask you what you would do, what policies you would support, to solve political problems is like the Cross to Dracula! I.e. I can spout any old gibberish on here as long as I finish with "what policies would you actually support on this issue Kerr" and you wouldn't come near me!).
    I told you when I was going to be getting back to you. Perhaps you missed that bit?

    I am not certain that any party offers the 'best solutions'. I'm not sure that the Tories are offering any at all at the moment given their preoccupation with Brexit. I was at a loss to decide who to vote for last year and would be again if there were an election tomorrow.

  10. #220
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    @MMM. You side stepped my question about how many of you turned up at Orgreave. If your intention was to stop lorries (all of which would have a working man driving it) entering the site, it would only have taken half a dozen of you to stand by the road, flag the lorries down and invite any drivers who did stop to turn around in the interests of solidarity.

    Given that several thousand of you did turn up suggests that the plan was not one of flag down and persuade.

    If you gathered in a mob several thousand strong it was inevitable that the police would also be present in strength to keep the road into the plant open. The manner in which some of the police then behaved does not retrospectively excuse the decision to mass picket.

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