Match Thread - Barnsley (FA Cup)

[Acido]

Hey County lads, do you want to discuss this with us a bit more on our Tykes board as well ?.
(and don't worry, I don't think we all bite that much, after all. )

Ive not looked at the Lg Two table tonight so I don't know where the County Club are etc, and I think most of your lot did expect to lose this tie today didn't you ?.

[macse15]

Barnsley fan in peace .

To be fair to your club you came to play football and a willingness to try and win the game .

A tad unlucky not to have gone in front early on when the free kick went straight in untouched and was disallowed .

In all fairness once we got in front in the second half it was tough for County , you had to push on once you conceded and unfortunately the counter attack is what we are all about and it played straight in to our hands .

County heads did drop and the second half was very one sided but don't be too hard on your lads and bear in mind we fielded a very strong side costing around £9m to put together .

We've hammered a few teams in our own league this season so don't read too much in to it .

Best of luck for the remainder of the season and I sincerely hope you are playing league two football next season .

Thanks for the objective overview... not what many of the drama queens want to hear (even though it was only 1 goal worse than they predicted) . The manager has had over 10 games in charge and we’re not top of the league.... and we lost to a team in a higher league in the FA Cup...it’s totally unacceptable.! 😉

[jacobncfc]

The problem is, we've appointed experienced managers, rookie managers, random foreign managers, pretty much every type of manager you can think of, and the result has always been the same - meltdown.

Meanwhile, other clubs seem to just get it right. Look at Lincoln - they appointed a couple of brothers in their mid-30s with no playing or managerial career to speak of, and they're looking like making it two promotions in three seasons, plus all the amazing cup runs.

There’s is one kind of manager we haven’t tried - someone doing a really good job at a smaller club. Kewell is the closest, but not really.

You say that Cowley had no real managerial career to speak of, but anyone interested in non-league football knee that he was destined for bigger things with the job he’d done at Concord Rangers and then Braintree. It is the obvious way to appoint a manager, IMO, but one we haven’t tried for a long time.

[animallittle3]

Thanks for the objective overview... not what many of the drama queens want to hear (even though it was only 1 goal worse than they predicted) . The manager has had over 10 games in charge and we’re not top of the league.... and we lost to a team in a higher league in the FA Cup...it’s totally unacceptable.! 😉

We hammered Peterborough 4-0 on their patch too playing a similar counter attacking game .

If County had put ten men behind the ball and played for a replay we would have struggled , that's why we aren't top of the league despite possibly having the best squad in league one .

You didn't need a replay and we certainly didn't so I can of get Kewell's tactics .

Without wanting to sound like Billy Big Time any team in league one coming to Oakwell and taking us on is risking a right thumping , make it difficult for us and you can come away with something .

[slack_pie]

There’s is one kind of manager we haven’t tried - someone doing a really good job at a smaller club. Kewell is the closest, but not really.

You say that Cowley had no real managerial career to speak of, but anyone interested in non-league football knee that he was destined for bigger things with the job he’d done at Concord Rangers and then Braintree. It is the obvious way to appoint a manager, IMO, but one we haven’t tried for a long time.

I agree with your first point, which is why I would have gone for Paul Hurst a couple of years ago when he was at Grimsby.

Can't agree with your second point though. Winning a few games in non-league may suggest that there's a good manager there, but there's no way anyone knew that Cowley was destined for better things. Look at Gary Mills - he won plenty of games at Grantham, King's Lynn and Tamworth - was he destined to go on to bigger things? Lincoln took a punt, pure and simple. It turned out they were right, but it was a punt all the same.

Imagine the uproar if Notts had signed Cowley at the time!

[i961pie]

There’s is one kind of manager we haven’t tried - someone doing a really good job at a smaller club. Kewell is the closest, but not really.

You say that Cowley had no real managerial career to speak of, but anyone interested in non-league football knee that he was destined for bigger things with the job he’d done at Concord Rangers and then Braintree. It is the obvious way to appoint a manager, IMO, but one we haven’t tried for a long time.

Can you imagine the outcry from the Notts fans if we did that, whoever you sign experienced or not it is a gamble.
We thought Nolan was the man until after Xmas last year. Most fans were happy when Sheridan was appointed and look how that went.
Fans blame AH for appointing these guys but it is a risk. whoever he gives the job to.

[i961pie]

Any chance of you guys landing Flitcroft from Mansfield , you are a bigger club with far more potential than the stags .

He's decent at this level and did a remarkable job keeping my club in the championship one year when we really were dead and buried at xmas .

Just been on your board mate, blimey you have your own language on there thou knows

[MAD_MAGPIE]

The problem is, we've appointed experienced managers, rookie managers, random foreign managers, pretty much every type of manager you can think of, and the result has always been the same - meltdown.

Meanwhile, other clubs seem to just get it right. Look at Lincoln - they appointed a couple of brothers in their mid-30s with no playing or managerial career to speak of, and they're looking like making it two promotions in three seasons, plus all the amazing cup runs.

So what are we to do? We've been through most of the lower-league managers already, soon we'll have to go back to the top of the list and start again. Paul Ince anyone? I'd take Keith Curle back at this point.

Seriously though, this isn't HK's team. The disastrous summer transfer window has totally derailed the club, and it might take a couple of years to get back to where we were last season - for any manager. So far, HK has improved our results compared with Nolan's start to the season. The question is whether this squad is capable of more or not. Is the manager underachieving, is the squad actually better than this, or is this the very best that we can get out of this group of players. If the latter, why change manager?

This is an excellent post. While we continue in this loop whereby the manager we appoint is stuck with the players from the previous manager (and maybe the one before) and does not have time to build his own squad we will never be successful.

I’d agree that a lot of our managers hands have been tied because they’ve had to work with the left overs from the previous regime, but then what happens is the ones they bring in usually end up costing them their jobs and so if becomes a case or rinse and repeat.

The problem is with managers it’s the same as the players. We never appoint managers who are on their way up either. Since the Munto season the only managers who have gone on to manage at a higher level than the club were when they left are Steve Cotteril and arguably Martin Allen who took Gillingham to League One.

Clubs like Lincoln, Luton, Accrington for example and those who have climbed the lower leagues in recent years have had managers in place for some time whom have had numerous transfer windows to build squads. They’ve also stuck to an identity of what kind of team they are and have developed that and become good at what they do.

It’s our recruitment that we have a club have failed at, and not just marginally, but massively since the Munto season. As I pointed out on another thread there have only been 12 players in the past 9 years who have gone on or played at a higher level since leaving the club. This is out of what must be a couple of hundred so as an estimate we are talking 5%. That means that the other 95% have either gone to teams at our level or below, and in the past three years below is non league. It’s shocking really that a club of our history with our 6,000 and the facilities we have cannot field a decent league two side with eleven quality league two players.

I am sick and tired of the amount of mediocre and below average player we bring to the club for the level we are at. Time and time again and season after season it’s always the same in that respect that we go for quantity over quality. For three average players you could get one quality player. It’s not a complicated concept to grasp.

It’s got to change quickly before it’s too late and it costs us our league status. The problem is at this level all it takes is one bad season and you can slip into the non league abyss. Look at Leyton Orient, lost the league one playoffs and dropped like a stone and they are gone out of the football league.

The alarm bells are ringing and the warning signs are there. The January transfer is massive for the direction of this club and the players we bring have got to be right to get us out of the mess we are in. Likewise the manager has got to be right to steer us to 50 points. That’s another 36 points from 19 games. I’m not bothered how many points are up for grabs as that is meaningless because on current form we’ve only got 14 points from 17 games so at this rate we will be lucky to finish the season with 40 points.

[Pies4u]

Some fair comment the - but - fortunately, the are 29 gams remaining to achieve that points target.

You are right that something has to change, and quickly. I made a similar point in another thread. Some fans seem to think it is ok to get stuffed without a whimper, consistently capitulate and fail to compete against "better/stronger" teams. That is disturbing, in respect of why we can't make a fight of such games and why fans can just sleep walk, ignore the evidence in front of them and just pretend that it is alright & we'll be fine because they trust the manager & owner!

[slack_pie]

This is an excellent post. While we continue in this loop whereby the manager we appoint is stuck with the players from the previous manager (and maybe the one before) and does not have time to build his own squad we will never be successful.

I’d agree that a lot of our managers hands have been tied because they’ve had to work with the left overs from the previous regime, but then what happens is the ones they bring in usually end up costing them their jobs and so if becomes a case or rinse and repeat.

The problem is with managers it’s the same as the players. We never appoint managers who are on their way up either. Since the Munto season the only managers who have gone on to manage at a higher level than the club were when they left are Steve Cotteril and arguably Martin Allen who took Gillingham to League One.

Clubs like Lincoln, Luton, Accrington for example and those who have climbed the lower leagues in recent years have had managers in place for some time whom have had numerous transfer windows to build squads. They’ve also stuck to an identity of what kind of team they are and have developed that and become good at what they do.

It’s our recruitment that we have a club have failed at, and not just marginally, but massively since the Munto season. As I pointed out on another thread there have only been 12 players in the past 9 years who have gone on or played at a higher level since leaving the club. This is out of what must be a couple of hundred so as an estimate we are talking 5%. That means that the other 95% have either gone to teams at our level or below, and in the past three years below is non league. It’s shocking really that a club of our history with our 6,000 and the facilities we have cannot field a decent league two side with eleven quality league two players.

I am sick and tired of the amount of mediocre and below average player we bring to the club for the level we are at. Time and time again and season after season it’s always the same in that respect that we go for quantity over quality. For three average players you could get one quality player. It’s not a complicated concept to grasp.

It’s got to change quickly before it’s too late and it costs us our league status. The problem is at this level all it takes is one bad season and you can slip into the non league abyss. Look at Leyton Orient, lost the league one playoffs and dropped like a stone and they are gone out of the football league.

The alarm bells are ringing and the warning signs are there. The January transfer is massive for the direction of this club and the players we bring have got to be right to get us out of the mess we are in. Likewise the manager has got to be right to steer us to 50 points. That’s another 36 points from 19 games. I’m not bothered how many points are up for grabs as that is meaningless because on current form we’ve only got 14 points from 17 games so at this rate we will be lucky to finish the season with 40 points.

Totally agree about awful recruitment being our downfall. As you say, this has been a constant since the Munto season, starting with Craig Short and the signing of John Spicer and Ben Burgess. Decent teams add two or three quality players to their squad each summer, but we sign countless below-average players. And it doesn't seem to matter who our owner or manager is either. Even our marquee signings turn out to be crap.