O/T DDay for Brexit..well sort of...

[Exiletyke]

No. We now have Theresa May's deal, a specific outcome that people can choose or reject with their eyes open rather than a blind unknown entity as last time.

John the deal is over 500 pages long
Would you expect the electorate to read it from front to back
I don't think you would
So where does that leave us
Back to relying on opinions from Politicians /experts/Civil Servants/the BBC /Ex Prime Ministers
Given the level of incompetence of this illustrious group I think we would be no better informed than before
Perhaps the Gov't could issue a leaflet to every household explaining the deal [in an unbiased way of course]

[Shark27]

I'm backing up my argument with evidence, yes. I know you're probably not used to that in the leave world.

Evidence? Hahahaha
Real World? Enjoy your YouTube clips John

I bet if you tried you could probably mix one up of Farage saying he's in love with Juncker

[KerrAvon]

I think you're reading the situation wrong.

Parliament isn't fighting a battle that is already over, it is paralysed by constitutional crisis because there is no parliamentary consensus on what leave actually meant. An oversight of the referendum was that a parliamentary democracy is incapable of delivering on such an ambiguous outcome. The plebiscite as asked is incompatible with parliament.

The only way to break the impasse and establish the current will of the people and is to ask them again in full possession of facts about the reality of what a future relationship might look like with the EU, and then act on it, be it no deal, May's deal or remain. Then we can all move on confident that the outcome truly reflects the people.

I don’t accept that the situation in Parliament is as a result of a lack parliamentary consensus on what leave actually meant. That is certainly a factor, but the greater problem is that many MPs don’t care what it meant and are interested only in pursuing their own ends, either through seeking the Brexit that they personally want or by playing political games with a view to trying to secure either advancement within their own parties or a General Election.

It probably won’t come as a surprise to you to learn that I voted remain in 2016. The country voted leave, however, and as Farage said a few days ago, the Brexit genie is now out of the bottle and isn’t going back in. A further referendum that resulted in a remain majority would not end the arguments as the Leave faction would press for best out of three, with the argument dominating British politics until they got one.

As for the notion that the public would be better informed if here were a further vote, I agree that they would have an idea of what May’s withdrawal looks like, albeit they would hear numerous different interpretations of what it means from politicians and the media; but why should a referendum be on a May deal/Remain basis? Aren’t the Hard Brexiteers and the Norway - Brexit in Name Only factions allowed to have their choices put before the people? Perhaps several months/years of Parliamentary time can be spent arguing over what the referendum question(s) should be, all while the EU waits patiently and grants the necessary extensions?

[KerrAvon]

I wouldn't get to obsessed with focus trading. It was an autocorrect on my phone.

My view is pretty much the same as the majority of mps across the house, there's nothing bizarre. Simply rip it up and start again to find an actual consensus. Because there isn't one. As a result of May's most recent dreadful leadership decision, entrenching mps even further away from supporting her deal, you and the hard right are going to lose everything. Sequence of events

1. May deal rejected again
2. May announces resignation and gets vote from mps on extension of no deal
3. Requests extension
4. Eu convey emergency meeting, grant on condition of new approach, either consensus, referendum or election.

And we start again. Could have been avoided with good leadership. Whether Corbyn could have done any better is amute point, he wasn't in charge. Only one person responsible. Your person.

Ah, I did wonder what you meant by focus trading. I assumed that it was some trendy management speak from within the public sector. You know the sort of thing – a phrase used to say something when you have nothing to say

What did you mean to say?

If you believe that your sequence of events is likely why are you the CBI and TUC getting so agitated? Surely you can put your feet up whilst it plays out in the way you envisage. Provided the EU allows it to...

[great_fire]

Labour spokeswoman just on Newsnight only talked about MPs and what they want, nothing about the electorate and what they want.

[the_idiotb_stardson]

All this liberal nonsense is coming to an end soon.

all the middle classes sh itting their pants because they are going to lose a few quid
.

[great_fire]

Poor people are crying into their quinoa.

[animallittle3]

Now a question of who in parliament stands by what they believe in or is prepared to be railroaded by May and the EU .

The stakes are pretty high , lets see the colour of your money Parliament .

The wonders of the modern world can now tell us who voted one way once , twice and who capitulated .

Interesting week coming up .

[ragingpup]

Ah, I did wonder what you meant by focus trading. I assumed that it was some trendy management speak from within the public sector. You know the sort of thing – a phrase used to say something when you have nothing to say

What did you mean to say?

If you believe that your sequence of events is likely why are you the CBI and TUC getting so agitated? Surely you can put your feet up whilst it plays out in the way you envisage. Provided the EU allows it to...

The EU have already provided time for an alternative way forward if May's deal goes down:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...of-brexit-date


After her deal fails, MPs will have to vote on way forward and they won't vote for no deal. What other alternatives do you envisage?

[animallittle3]

The EU have already provided time for an alternative way forward if May's deal goes down:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...of-brexit-date


After her deal fails, MPs will have to vote on way forward and they won't vote for no deal. What other alternatives do you envisage?

I believe things will change next week when MV3 is voted down and the tories kick May out of number 10 .

This seems to me to be the way this deadlock will be broken and the only currency we have at this moment in time .

May will have to take the fall in the national interest as she is often quoted as saying .

Whilst the country is leaderless although you could make a case that we've not had a leader for 3 years then clearly this changes the narrative on both sides of this debacle .

Who becomes PM after May's departure is anyone's guess .