Theresa in a mess

[1959_60]

I can see your concerns Sinkov, but SOMETHING has to be done to move this along.

Our Theresa is now "reaching out" to the rest of the MP's but that's a forlorn hope. And she practically ruled out a no deal result tonight.

I am not including you in this Sinkov, but there must be loads of people who voted Brexit who must now be realising that the Unicorn deal never actually existed and they didn't want a no deal scenario. They were sold on the idea that "We will have a better deal with the EU than we have now and we won't pay them any money" "Easiest trade deal to sort out in history" "£350M more per week to spend on the NHS" " Turkey is about to join the EU and we will be swamped by millions of Turks"etc.
Even I would have voted for Brexit if I believed that lot.
These people may well have changed their minds now that reality is hitting home. At least, ask them again eh?

There were similar claims made by the remain side too. But the difference was that they actually KNEW what being in the EU was like. No one (even today) knows what Brexit will look like.

[Norder]

I can see your concerns Sinkov, but SOMETHING has to be done to move this along.

Our Theresa is now "reaching out" to the rest of the MP's but that's a forlorn hope. And she practically ruled out a no deal result tonight.
..... ut there must be loads of people who voted Brexit who must now be realising that the Unicorn deal never actually existed and they didn't want a no deal scenario

I think - 59'60 the majority believe....that the Unicorn was kidnapped - and replaced with an old knacked pony - so if they're with it enough.....then they'll realise that they've been stitched up - and'll have (if possible) even greater determination to ditch that failing unelected autocratic club of thieves .

[Norder]

.

and if we think this is big news - then hold on to your hats folks....as there's Much Much bigger upsets to come - as this little squeak is just a catalyst that precipitates events of stellar proportion....as the powers that be are pushing us into it at full steam - just have to take a peek around the planet to see that !

[sinkov]

"These people may well have changed their minds now that reality is hitting home. At least, ask them again eh?"

There was a piece I read today 59, but I can't remember where I read it now so I can't put a link up, you'll just have to trust me on this. It was by John Curtice who comments on the polls on the BBC, he said that if there was another referendum now it would most likely be 52-48 to Remain, but he didn't think many had changed their minds, the turnaround was due to more people who preferred to stay in the EU being motivated to vote this time, a lot didn't bother last time because they thought Remain would win.

Which is borne out by our little group on here, we've been arguing Brexit for a couple of years or more now, each putting over their own point of view time and time again. We've had the non stop media onslaught in our daily lives as well, but despite all of this I don't think any one of us has budged their position by as much as an inch.

To be honest I don't think the campaign made much difference to how anyone voted, people's views on the EU have been formed over long periods, and I suspect that none of Cameron's expensive brochure telling us to vote Remain, or the Boris bus, or Osborne's Project fear made much difference at all. Most people in this country hold our politicians in contempt, they know their own minds and are very unlikely to be swayed by any of them.

[The Bedlington Terrier]

The EU have shown nothing but contempt for the people of this island ever since the vote to LEAVE was known. They are bullies and have displayed an unbelievable arrogance that confirms my original decision. LEAVE and be damned.

[The Bedlington Terrier]

In our real world living here in Bolton, we have no reliable train service, our town centre streets are full of homeless people, our disabled people are being stripped of their benefits, the local militarised Job Centre looks like an Army recruiting station, Universal Credit is being deliberately held back, consequently creating poverty not seen in this country since the 1930’s. We have a serious lack of social housing, the NHS waiting times at Royal Bolton are out of this world.
Our present Tory government are so out of touch with the voters of Great Britain it is way beyond alarming. The Tory Cabinet is just a revolving door and the barrel has been scraped so low we have a Defence Secretary Gavin Williamson (who?) suggested last week Great Britain needs to become a global superpower once more and wants new military bases in the Caribbean and South China Sea.
Our new and equally hapless Health Secretary Matt Hancock (who?) was quite literally physically shredded by Andrew Neil on live TV in the aftermath of the May humiliation. This revolving door policy of senior Cabinet Ministers begs the question, as to whom is intellectually equipped to run Great Britain’s day to day home and foreign affairs?
Brexit has consumed Theresa May to such an extent that another three months of this political moron in Downing Street and we will be reopening the Great Depression style soup ********. Alternatively, we can always nip down to our local food bank for a photo opportunity with a grinning, back slapping Tory minister. We have had almost three years to sort out Brexit and yet people still believe Jeremy Corbyn does not have the political credentials to do better than our present incumbents.
Get serious, get rid of this awful and impotent Tory government and elect a government who give a damn about the people of the United Kingdom. For the many not the few.

[Supersub6]

Sounds like Bolton is a place not to live.
Strange, that in a town that is struggling so much, the councillors took £868,191.72 out of the system during 2017/8 in allowances.
This is happening all over the country, so I am not just having a go at Bolton. It is strange that all these people who care about their community are still willing to take out at least £200 per week ----to do exactly what?

The County Council took over everything up here in Northumberland and the local councils were disbanded. Lo and behold, within a year, it was decided that local parish councils would be set up and money allocated to these. Our local council here has members of our MP's family serving and claiming and that is in addition to the amount being taken by County Councillors which was well over £1 million last year.

It used to be an honour to serve the community on the local council, however, these days, it is just another way for people to get some money out of the system.

[The Bedlington Terrier]

A bit off topic Supersub6, but it is my understanding a duly elected Borough Councillor can be drawing anything up to £30k per year plus relevant expenses. Average salary and expenses for 600 and odd MP's I believe is running at £160k each member per year. House of Lords is another shambles, MEP's salaries and expenses are running into millions and look what we have lumbered ourselves with?

Time for the uprising methinks.

[Supersub6]

A bit off topic Supersub6, but it is my understanding a duly elected Borough Councillor can be drawing anything up to £30k per year plus relevant expenses. Average salary and expenses for 600 and odd MP's I believe is running at £160k each member per year. House of Lords is another shambles, MEP's salaries and expenses are running into millions and look what we have lumbered ourselves with?

Time for the uprising methinks.

BT --I know a few Councillors up here that have been taking more than £30,000 out of the system regularly over the last few years. That is in addition to their various NCB, Armed Forces Pensions etc. They have had trips abroad at the taxpayers' expense to discuss poverty --would you believe?
A few years ago our local town council spent well over £1,500 for an overnight stay in a hotel in Gateshead, some 18 miles away, because they decided to hold a meeting there to discuss how to save money!! You couldn't make it up!!

We, the citizens of this country are being ripped off left, right and centre by our own politicians and yet, these same politicians are trying to tell us that the EU is a rip-off. Every country suffers from the same malaise and we are no better than anywhere else.

[1959_60]

One thing about last nights Government defeat we ought to remember.

Do you remember when Gina Miller took dogs abuse for pushing for a meaningful vote for parliament? She was called a traitor and an enemy of the people by many.

Well, if she hadn't stuck to her guns then Theresa's deal would now have been enacted without any scrutiny at all.

In retrospect, do you now think that Gina Millers actions have done the nation a big favour?