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Thread: O/T The meaningful vote.

  1. #221
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  2. #222
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    Well done Labour , now you've turned practically every Pro Brexit Labour stronghold in to a marginal seat .



    https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ond-referendum

  3. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by yorkshireborn View Post
    Enjoyed that YB

  4. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by animallittle3 View Post
    Well done Labour , now you've turned practically every Pro Brexit Labour stronghold in to a marginal seat .



    https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ond-referendum
    Any idea on what they think the result of a 2nd referendum would be?
    If you don't know the answer fear not for our visitor from just down the M1 will be along soon to tell us all what we should think
    It must be the London bubble effect

  5. #225
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exiletyke View Post
    Any idea on what they think the result of a 2nd referendum would be?
    If you don't know the answer fear not for our visitor from just down the M1 will be along soon to tell us all what we should think
    It must be the London bubble effect
    Interesting the London thing exile , take their vote out of referendum and Leave would have won by 11% and not 4 .

    A poll yesterday said 58% of people are against a second referendum so I find this latest Labour tactic a bit flawed in all honesty exile .

    Maybe Dianne is in charge of the data .
    Last edited by animallittle3; 22-01-2019 at 10:06 AM.

  6. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exiletyke View Post
    Yes I know but how do we then proceed if the result was the same or are you assuming like Cameron did that we will vote to remain?
    Following the same result we would Brexit. I don't make any assumptions on the result.

  7. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by KerrAvon View Post
    I think your post is cobblers in two ways.

    Firstly, you may say that you think that the results of a further referendum should be final and you might even believe it, but, I think there would be plenty of people on both sides of the debate who would not accept the outcome if it didn’t go their way.

    Secondly, I think it nonsense to suggest that people have an understanding of the issues. I have heard people say they want the Norway model – as favoured by many Labour MPs – but who, upon questioning, have no understanding of what it means (basically it involves taking the worst parts of being in and adding them to the worst parts of being out and putting them together). Labour supporters bang on about remaining in the customs union (presumably having checked in with Momentum to find out what they are supposed to think), but, again, when asked, can’t explain the implications of that.

    As for Canada ++ - as favoured by some Tories - I have met only one person who can explain what that means (not bad, but probably difficult to negotiate).
    I said people who were interested would have a better understanding after listening for two years to the debate. Lets face it half the self styled European Research Group have tunnel vision and only understand their extreme right wing dogma. They have little idea and or interest in how most of the electorate live.

  8. #228
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    They have little idea and or interest in how most of the electorate live. [/quote]

    And you're telling Kerr this?

  9. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by KINDERSCOUT View Post
    I said people who were interested would have a better understanding after listening for two years to the debate. Lets face it half the self styled European Research Group have tunnel vision and only understand their extreme right wing dogma. They have little idea and or interest in how most of the electorate live.
    Trouble is nobody still knows what will happen, lots of this could or might, but nothing certain

  10. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exiletyke View Post
    Let me tell you what I think rather than you telling me what I think If you can't see what his intentions were then you're not reading the article so don't try & make his actions virtuous
    We voted over two years ago to leave & what I support is honouring that decision

    I do not support anyone who opposes that decision regardless of who they are & that includes you now that you have decided where you stand after two years of fence sitting

    Good news about Portugal eh?
    You’ve told me and other users of this and other boards what you think on numerous occasions and in different ways. The trouble seems to start when you are asked why you think what you do and upon what evidence your views are based. It all tends to get a bit flaky at that point...

    How about explaining what you are cross with Cameron about? Whatever his motivation, he - backed by 75% or so of Parliament - gave Eurosceptics such as yourself what you wanted. With that being the case, it makes no sense for you to be upset with him. It’s your chum Corbett and his Remainer High Priest and beloved of animal, Keir Starmer, who have aligned themselves to the Tory right to block the process.

    Where have I opposed the decision delivered by the referendum, out of interest? I can't recall doing so.
    Last edited by KerrAvon; 22-01-2019 at 09:14 PM. Reason: Removing a spelling mistake to avoid upsetting Exille even more

  11. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by animallittle3 View Post
    Well done Labour , now you've turned practically every Pro Brexit Labour stronghold in to a marginal seat .



    https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ond-referendum
    Lol, Don’t say you weren’t warned. Then again, you probably won’t anyway given that you are following the Corbett line and refusing to engage with people who hold different views to you.

    I’ve watched QT now to see what the fuss is about. It’s fairly clear that Abbott got the humpty on because she was embarrassed at having to defend the ‘La La La – I can’t hear you’ approach of her leader and the ridicule from the audience that flowed from it. I did feel for her a bit.

  12. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by KINDERSCOUT View Post
    Following the same result we would Brexit. I don't make any assumptions on the result.
    So following the same result we would be exactly where we are – leaving but unable to agree upon how to do it. In other words, you want another referendum just to try to get the outcome you would like, not to move things on in any way.

  13. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by KINDERSCOUT View Post
    I said people who were interested would have a better understanding after listening for two years to the debate. Lets face it half the self styled European Research Group have tunnel vision and only understand their extreme right wing dogma. They have little idea and or interest in how most of the electorate live.
    The people I am talking about are people who take an interest in politics. Unfortunately, politics is a bit like football where people pick a team – often simply following their parent’s example or that from their community – and blindly follow it, acting irrationally at times when doing so. For that reason, I’ve seen Labour supporters adopting the lunacy of the Norway model or blindly following the ‘customs union’ policy with little regard for what they actually mean.

    As for your comments about the ERG, blind prejudice is an unattractive trait wherever it comes from

  14. #234
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    Quote Originally Posted by lk311 View Post
    Trouble is nobody still knows what will happen, lots of this could or might, but nothing certain
    Which is why it was difficult for the government to ‘strategise’ to any degree. May sought to interpret what people wanted when they voted Leave and set out to work for a deal that ended freedom of movement, ended the jurisdiction of the ECJ, ended contributions to the EU budget and enabled the UK to enter into trade deals with the rest of the world. She then called a GE to seek to obtain a specific mandate from the electorate for that strategy , but the Tories then essentially failed to contest it. That’s where things really went belly up.

  15. #235
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    ������ fu****G hell just silly.

  16. #236
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    It was.

  17. #237
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    [QUOTE=KerrAvon;39123548]You’ve told me and other users of this and other boards what you think on numerous occasions and in different ways. The trouble seems to start when you are asked why you think what you do and upon what evidence your views are based. It all tends to get a bit flaky at that point...

    How about explaining what you are cross with Cameron about? Whatever his motivation, he - backed by 75% or so of Parliament - gave Eurosceptics such as yourself what you wanted. With that being the case, it makes no sense for you to be upset with him. It’s your chum Corbett and his Remainer High Priest and beloved of animal, Keir Starmer, who have aligned themselves to the Tory right to block the process.





    You wanted to know about my feelings on Cameron

    I list below just some of the reasons for disliking this piece of cowardlly spineless flotsom

    Didn't take him two minutes to jump ship when the going looked like getting a little rough & to compare himself with Churchill is just an obscene joke

    The referendum leaflet issued under his Premiership has so many biased & even untrue claims when it should have been a document offering the public honest impartial information especially as the taxpayer paid for it [£9 million they said. Double that in reality]
    There are many many more examples I could quote but that should be enough to give you a feel as to why I don't like him

    During the pre referendum debate
    He conceded that trying to control immigration has proved "very challenging" after repeated criticism from the audience and suggested that there will need to be more controls if Britain votes to stay in. In his most passionate intervention to date, the Prime Minister appeared stung by suggestions from an audience member that he is like a "21st century Neville Chamberlain".

    In a BBC Question Time debate the Prime Minister was accused by one audience member of being like a "21st century Neville Chamberlain".
    The audience member asked how Mr Cameron can make pledges based on his EU referendum deal when "a dictatorship in Europe can overrule it
    The question appeared to provoke Mr Cameron, who said: "At my office I sit two yards away from cabinet room where Winston Churchill decided in May to fight on against Hitler. The best and greatest decision perhaps anyone has made in our country. He didn't want to be alone. He wanted to be fighting with the French, the Poles and the others. But he didn't quit. He didn't quit on democracy, he didn't quit on freedom.
    "We want to fight for those things today. You can't win if you're not in the room
    The Prime Minister said that it was not worth the economic risk of leaving the EU to try to reduce net migration He said: "Is it really worth leaving the single market, damaging our economy to try and make progress with this issue? There's no silver bullet."
    Mr Cameron was pressed on why he is threatening a "massive" Budget if Britain leaves the European Union with £30billion worth of cuts and tax rises.
    He said: "You don't gain money by leaving the EU, you make your economy smaller. You have a big hole in your public finances. If that happens you have to either allow borrowing to rise, raise taxes or cut spending.
    "It's not just the remain side saying this. If we leave and if these experts are right there will be a cost, and we have to make up that cost in some way. I don't want us to go back to square one."
    He said that ignoring the experts is like getting into a faulty car with your children on a motorway. He said: "The Leave campaign says lets not listen to experts, but if we are about to get into a car and drive our children on a motorway and the mechanic says the brakes don't work, the mechanics are faulty, we wouldn't get into the car. I say listen to the experts."
    Challenged on why he had previously said Britain could prosper outside the EU, he said "Britain always find a way".
    He said: "Of course we can find a way outside the EU but it is very very clear that it would be less good."
    The Prime Minister accused the Leave campaign of lying about the prospect of Turkey joining the EU, the scale of EU contributions and a European Army.
    On Turkey, he repeated his claim that Turkey will not join the EU until the "year 3000".
    He said: "I think this is the biggest red herring in this whole referendum debate
    "I can't find a single expert who thinks that Turkey's going to join the EU."
    He added: "Just like the European Army isn't going to happen, just like the £350million [in EU contributions] . Those things which are on their leaflets are completely not true."

    The government referendum leaflet [issued under his Premiership]
    Some argue that we could
    strike a good deal quickly with
    the EU because they want to
    keep access to our market.

    But the Government’s
    judgement is that it would be
    much harder than that – less
    than 8% of EU exports come
    to the UK while 44% of UK exports go to the EU
    Millions of UK citizens travel
    to Europe each year. The EU
    has made this easier and
    cheaper.
    EU reforms in the 1990s have
    resulted in a drop in fares of
    over 40% for lower cost flights.


    So nowt to do with free market competition so beloved by the Torys
    And Corbyn is not my chum btw
    Last edited by Exiletyke; Yesterday at 09:32 AM.

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