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Thread: Holtby

  1. #11
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    Mar 2013
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    There is a transition in place
    The quality not deemed good enough is being taken out,slowly not harshly.
    Smallwood and gladwin will be sounded out for new clubs and the youngsters on the fringes will more than likely be loaned out in the next window
    Buckley,Rankin Costello ect ect
    This club is forming into a nearly ran/possible play off team.
    Next season I am guessing more of the old guard will be thinned out and replaced with players who can really push us on.
    This is not me saying the ones taken out are rubbish but they have their limitations and we need to show progression.

  2. #12
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    Mar 2009
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    Champs - I think you're confusing two things with your comments about Buckley. In the second half against WBA, he looked our best player. Against Millwall, he was OK, but no more. Those are comments on specific performances. I don't KNOW yet if he is ready to be a regular starter. What I'm saying is that with the arrival of Holtby, he's much less likely to get that starting-place, anyway.
    Incidentally, I still reckon you're being excessively lukewarm about Downing. I really don't think you can classify him as just another Travis/Johnson. He is a far better passer than either of them, for a start. Unless he shows signs of weariness when we get into the three-matches-a-week periods, I imagine he will always be among the first names on the Mowbray team-sheet.
    That being the case, and with Holtby presumably destined to be selected after about a fortnight or so, I just can't see that Buckley and R-C will get much of a look-in as starters.
    It strikes me (as Robin implies) that TM has decided experience gives us the best shot of a play-off spot this season, and (whether we like them all or not!), the following look to be automatic choices:
    Walton, Lenihan, Williams, Cunningham, Bennett, Downing, Holtby, Dack and one from Travis/Johnson.
    That probably leaves only two places (one, if LT and BJ both play). One of those will go to either Gallagher or Graham.
    At most, therefore, we have one vacancy! TM seems to favour three forwards, so we are probably also looking at either Armstrong or Rothwell in the starting XI. (And, obviously, we also have Chapman and Tosin to be considered!)
    Of course, he may decide to play Holtby centrally, between a front two and a midfield three.
    Whatever, the formation, I'm simply saying that it is much more likely now that Buckley and R-C will only be on the bench, and that is probably the case, even if we go for 3-5-2 or 3-4-3.
    I don't think Cunningham looks much like a wing-back personally, but I can't see him being dropped very easily. Even if he was, I'd guess that Bell or Downing would be selected as the left wing-back ahead of R-C. If Bennett gets hurt, I imagine Nyambe would be first replacement on the other side as the wing-back. (Tosin??).
    As you say, injuries will play a part at some point, and the likes of R-C, Buckley, Davenport, Chapman, Samuel, Hart, (etc.) provide us with far better options to draft in than we've had for years.
    All the same, my guess (and that's all it is) would be that R-C and Buckley will not become regulars until next season.
    (I am leaving Brereton out of all equations at the moment).
    Last edited by AucklandRover; 19-09-2019 at 10:59 PM.

  3. #13
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    Mar 2013
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    4,311
    I imagine lewis Holtby wont be considered until the forest game but wont be surprised to see him make the bench against Luton.
    Defensively we have become more secure recently,at the other end we have struggled.
    The signing of Lewis Holtby provides help/competition to dack,this can only be a benefit to us and maybe provide a up your game mentality to all the other attack minded players on the books.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    11,680
    Quote Originally Posted by AucklandRover View Post
    Champs - I think you're confusing two things with your comments about Buckley. In the second half against WBA, he looked our best player. Against Millwall, he was OK, but no more. Those are comments on specific performances. I don't KNOW yet if he is ready to be a regular starter. What I'm saying is that with the arrival of Holtby, he's much less likely to get that starting-place, anyway.
    Incidentally, I still reckon you're being excessively lukewarm about Downing. I really don't think you can classify him as just another Travis/Johnson. He is a far better passer than either of them, for a start. Unless he shows signs of weariness when we get into the three-matches-a-week periods, I imagine he will always be among the first names on the Mowbray team-sheet.
    That being the case, and with Holtby presumably destined to be selected after about a fortnight or so, I just can't see that Buckley and R-C will get much of a look-in as starters.
    It strikes me (as Robin implies) that TM has decided experience gives us the best shot of a play-off spot this season, and (whether we like them all or not!), the following look to be automatic choices:
    Walton, Lenihan, Williams, Cunningham, Bennett, Downing, Holtby, Dack and one from Travis/Johnson.
    That probably leaves only two places (one, if LT and BJ both play). One of those will go to either Gallagher or Graham.
    At most, therefore, we have one vacancy! TM seems to favour three forwards, so we are probably also looking at either Armstrong or Rothwell in the starting XI. (And, obviously, we also have Chapman and Tosin to be considered!)
    Of course, he may decide to play Holtby centrally, between a front two and a midfield three.
    Whatever, the formation, I'm simply saying that it is much more likely now that Buckley and R-C will only be on the bench, and that is probably the case, even if we go for 3-5-2 or 3-4-3.
    I don't think Cunningham looks much like a wing-back personally, but I can't see him being dropped very easily. Even if he was, I'd guess that Bell or Downing would be selected as the left wing-back ahead of R-C. If Bennett gets hurt, I imagine Nyambe would be first replacement on the other side as the wing-back. (Tosin??).
    As you say, injuries will play a part at some point, and the likes of R-C, Buckley, Davenport, Chapman, Samuel, Hart, (etc.) provide us with far better options to draft in than we've had for years.
    All the same, my guess (and that's all it is) would be that R-C and Buckley will not become regulars until next season.
    (I am leaving Brereton out of all equations at the moment).
    Lukewarm as in how your looming at this signing? Or as lukewarm as you where about Downing & Johnson coming in during summer? When you said you hoped it wasn't bother Murphy. That lukewarm? I said both Johnson & Downing would be good additions. I'm not fearful of every single signing we make. I don't pour over all the negatives of bringing in a decent player like Holtby in.
    Downing is a good player. He can pass the ball better than the other 2. I said it game one, it's still relevant now. All 3 do pretty much the same thing. We lack creativity. We need someone who can get our best players in the game. The manager hopes that will be Holtby. I do too. That doesn't mean Buckley is cast aside. It simply means he doesn't walk in our side while he is so raw. Which you said yourself on Sat. He will be introduced gradually. If Holtby is really good and that makes Buckley improve, Travis improve etc then that's a good thing right?
    Remember, most people where lukewarm about Mulgrew leaving. Same with Raya. I maintained we needed to push on. I'll let the manager decide the best formation, system and which players will fit. He sees them everyday and is a professional manager. I see them once a week on match day.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
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    6,297
    In general, I agree, Champs, but I would still argue that Downing is more of a creative influence than you suggest.
    It will be interesting to see if TM decides that he can accommodate Travis, Johnson, Downing and Holtby on the pitch at the same time.
    Easier with a 3-5-2 or 3-4-1-2, I'd have thought.

    I don't easily take umbrage, Champs, but I do think it's a bit rich that you are suggesting I was the negative one, earlier this season! Look back at your posts a month ago.
    The point I have consistently made is that we can't have it both ways. Either we are genuinely testing out our youth-development scheme or we're not. I am actually happy either way. However, the arrival of Walton, Tosin, Cunningham, Downing, Johnson, Gallagher and Holtby must inevitably have slowed the progress of our Academy graduates. We are looking at seven players who are likely to figure regularly in the first XI.
    As I say, I am quite content with this pragmatic route to success that TM has chosen, but it is impossible to argue that this is also the best method of bringing on the youngsters.
    Last edited by AucklandRover; 21-09-2019 at 04:16 AM.

  6. #16
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    Jul 2010
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    Champs comment raised an eyebrow here too but we all have those days

  7. #17
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    Other than Travis, which one of the academy graduates would you suggest is ready to be starting every week? I can't name one.
    I do maintain they will continue to get the same introduction they would do if it was Smallwood ahead of them. But I'm all ears. Which player? Obviously not Buckley, are everyone's comments last week. So who?

  8. #18
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    Only Nyambe for me

  9. #19
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    And I bet at least 2/3 Will be in today's squad.

  10. #20
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    Tosin is a kid. He's trusted to walk into the side. With good reason. But still a young lad.

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