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Thread: Mistakes and Judgement

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by sinkov View Post
    No I'm not misunderstanding at all FTD, this type of argument/discussion has been rumbling on here since we arrived in the PL, and in particular in the couple of days leading up to the game. It's my opinion that it didn't matter how we set up, how we played, which tactics or players we used in whatever position, the overwhelming likelihood was that City would cope with it, and we'd get turned over and be well beaten.

    Then we get the old 'we have no plan B', but Pep has exactly the same plan B as Dyche, he plays 11 world class players and if it's not working, he sends on three different world class players, and sometimes the difference is remarkable, Dyche plays 11 journeymen and if it's not working he sends on three different journeymen, who rarely make any difference at all. But what else is he supposed to do ? He can change the formation, send another man up front, tell them to keep it on the deck a bit more, but the idea that any such tinkering will enable us to turn things round, outplay and beat teams like City is laughable. The problem at our club, if indeed there is one, lies in the Boardroom, not the manager's office.
    Strongly agree, sinkov, it still amazes me how many of our fans just do not understand that any manager uses the tools at his disposal in order to try to get results and Sean Dyche and his management team have shown what can be achieved. Sometimes it doesn't work and, no matter what, City were well up for that game last night. Pep made four changes to the team that messed up at Newcastle and we were holding our own until Jesus scored an excellent opening goal.

    Look at Everton tonight, they went out to give it a go and failed miserably because, although Liverpool had less shots on goals, they had 5 on target ---alll were goals!
    Any fan expecting us to change the way that we set up will be disappointed because we do not have the players to do so. Compare us to Everton, who have spent a fortune on players, and no matter what the results are at the weekend we will still be above them.

    Lots of fans think that they can do a better job than the manager, however, they do not have his insight into any niggling injuries, any personal problems which may be affecting a player etc. It is not a computer game, which is emotionless, it is very much a matter of man management and using your tools at your disposal in the best way to try to achieve a result.
    We have not remained in the PL because SD does not know what he is doing!

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Supersub6 View Post
    Strongly agree, sinkov, it still amazes me how many of our fans just do not understand that any manager uses the tools at his disposal in order to try to get results and Sean Dyche and his management team have shown what can be achieved. Sometimes it doesn't work and, no matter what, City were well up for that game last night. Pep made four changes to the team that messed up at Newcastle and we were holding our own until Jesus scored an excellent opening goal.

    Look at Everton tonight, they went out to give it a go and failed miserably because, although Liverpool had less shots on goals, they had 5 on target ---alll were goals!
    Any fan expecting us to change the way that we set up will be disappointed because we do not have the players to do so. Compare us to Everton, who have spent a fortune on players, and no matter what the results are at the weekend we will still be above them.

    Lots of fans think that they can do a better job than the manager, however, they do not have his insight into any niggling injuries, any personal problems which may be affecting a player etc. It is not a computer game, which is emotionless, it is very much a matter of man management and using your tools at your disposal in the best way to try to achieve a result.
    We have not remained in the PL because SD does not know what he is doing!
    We didnt even play that way in our first promotional season, I have never seen such a negative formation at home. From the get go setup to loose, explain to me how 5 at the back, 2 wingers playing in the middle of the park, two defencive midfielders both lacking pace, one striker with zero support.. just explain how that game plan was ever going to work... as far as I see it the game was lost before kick off and was played as a damage limitation.
    I have never seen such a negative approach to a home game.

    There is a big difference in counter attacking, to our setup of hoof it up too woods.. the hopeful long ball, no support.. just being in the game hoping for some luck, a pen etc...

  3. #23
    Join Date
    May 2016
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    .

    ....and look at our defensive performance - look at the players postures, their positioning, as static as statues....no closing them down, City had all the time in the world...it was a Pathetic display....and their supporters having fits about it being their best game all season - it's a fantasy - laughable....reminds me of the 5-0 leaving present we gave the Arse Wenker !






  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by FromTheDarkness View Post
    I strongly disagree,
    Good, no problem with that FTD, we all see things differently and it's reading and discussing those differences that make it worthwhile posting on this msgboard. That surely is what it's for.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by FromTheDarkness View Post
    We didnt even play that way in our first promotional season, I have never seen such a negative formation at home. From the get go setup to loose, explain to me how 5 at the back, 2 wingers playing in the middle of the park, two defencive midfielders both lacking pace, one striker with zero support.. just explain how that game plan was ever going to work... as far as I see it the game was lost before kick off and was played as a damage limitation.
    I have never seen such a negative approach to a home game.

    There is a big difference in counter attacking, to our setup of hoof it up too woods.. the hopeful long ball, no support.. just being in the game hoping for some luck, a pen etc...
    Aye, time for Sean to go as he obviously has no idea how we should be approaching games. We need to get someone in who will change our style and improve us, similar to what Stoke and West Brom did over the last few years, at the behest of their fans.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
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    21,844
    Some interesting comments from City fans,

    "Burnley’s battering rams should enjoy themselves against our mighty central defence. It’s down to whether we can match them at the other end."

    "Burnley will be lumping the ball into the box at every opportunity, knowing we are defensively frail."

    They're obviously fearful of our tactics, knowing they are likely to be successful against them, but some of our fans didn't want to see these tactics employed, they wanted Dyche to change an approach that even City fans knew was likely to work against them. Ah well. But in the event one of our 'battering rams' wasn't fit enough to play and City were off the hook, but just what Dyche is supposed to do then, with his threadbare squad god knows, I don't, but whatever he did it wasn't very likely to work.

    "Burnley will play with two giants up front because that’s all their dinosaurs manager knows."

    Here we go, ignorance is bliss. But then you can hear the same thing from plenty of our fans, he's tactically inept, naive, no Plan B, clueless as to when to make substitutions, etc. etc, and all of it complete and utter bollox. This is a manager who's like a boxer being sent into the ring with one hand tied behind his back, he has a squad of players who, with 2/3 possible exceptions, would not be of the least interest to any average PL team should they become available.

    But cast your mind back to the last time he did have a squad of players that could compete on a level playing field with the rest of the division, 2015/16 in the Championship, and what was the result ? We were joint top scorers in the division, no team scored more goals than Sean Dyche's Burnley, 2nd most away goals scored, more AWAY WINS than any other team, lost just 5 out of 46 games, and of course finished as Champions. Clueless, negative, obsessed with defence, a dinosaur ? Really ?

    And as for tactically naive and inept, look at the managers he was up against, Chris Hughton, Steve Bruce, Paul Clement, Mick McCarthy, Ian Holloway, Paul Lambert, Simon Grayson, Gary Rowett, Kenny Jackett, David Wagner. Neil Lennon, maybe not the elite you get at the top of the PL, but vastly experienced managers who know the time of day and know how to get teams promoted, you don't get the better of that lot if you're tactically naive, inept and a dinosaur, but some of our fans believe that's what we've got. Those with short memories anyway, and an inabilty to take into account the tremendous disparity in the quality of our players compared to most other teams in this division. Sean Dyche is not a dinosaur, he's a miracle worker.
    Last edited by sinkov; 05-12-2019 at 09:47 AM.

  7. #27
    Good post sinkov, well thought out and eloquently written.

    Problem is we are playing against EPL coaching staff and managers. Roy Hodgson skinned us alive on Saturday, simply because he knew how to nullify Barnes and Wood.

    4-5-1 at home? Nah!

  8. #28
    Join Date
    May 2016
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    .

    eye - is always interesting how we can all See the same thing, differently....study it, pass it though our mental filters and arrive at differing ends.....for myself - I sincerely hope, with the least personal interference or bias - it obviously doesn't necessarily mean that whats included in the sum, is always within view....and, If the complete image has reflection....how we identify, remember or re-build it, will also affect our balance of judgment....then there's the unknown, the External pollution of premeditated collusion - one so organized in its extent and undivided in arrangement - its influence dominates every element of the sport.
    Of course, looking at the game (like anythng) with the most primitive simplicity, will reveal the least impurity...the balance of the scales being trusted to settle to any old fuzzy "near enough" evenness, regardless of the many levels of reckoning.
    For myself (I'm sad to say).....I think the game a joke, and as crooked as a barrel of snakes, but hey....at least it gives me plenty of amusement !



  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Norder View Post
    .

    eye - is always interesting how we can all See the same thing, differently....study it, pass it though our mental filters and arrive at differing ends.....for myself - I sincerely hope, with the least personal interference or bias - it obviously doesn't necessarily mean that whats included in the sum, is always within view....and, If the complete image has reflection....how we identify, remember or re-build it, will also affect our balance of judgment....then there's the unknown, the External pollution of premeditated collusion - one so organized in its extent and undivided in arrangement - its influence dominates every element of the sport.
    Of course, looking at the game (like anythng) with the most primitive simplicity, will reveal the least impurity...the balance of the scales being trusted to settle to any old fuzzy "near enough" evenness, regardless of the many levels of reckoning.
    For myself (I'm sad to say).....I think the game a joke, and as crooked as a barrel of snakes, but hey....at least it gives me plenty of amusement !


    I really need to keep up Norder.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    34,432
    There is No amusement supporting Burnley at the moment Norder (as well you know).

    Yes its good having different opinions, IMO I'm with Darkness, we set up before K.O. with no intent, we began the game with No intent and we finished with no intent.

    I can see an argument of "time for Sean to go as he obviously has no idea how we should be approaching games" but for me its clutching at straws as it was obvious we did not want to try and win the game at any point, and its also fine for folk to say we would have lost anyway because they are a Billionaire Club with talent, but we will never know now will we, but we've competed with the top Clubs before and got better results, yet had obviously surrendered in training the day before this one, which is sad and unfair for Claret fans.

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