Match Thread vs. Dover Athletic 18.01.20

[Elite_Pie]

I didn't want Ardley appointed & I have never been a fan of some of his negative tactics but unlike many I am prepared to give him credit when it's due & so far his results this season have been ok as have most of his signings. It is very easy to say that any decent manager would piss this league with our squad & budget but the difficulty seems to be attracting this mythical "decent" manager, we have not managed it since the days of the Munto money & it is very interesting to note that most of the anti Ardley posters are the same ones who seem to believe we can still attract the top class managers that we have had in the past.

Fair point, and I realise that good managers aren't easy to find at this level. For me it boils down to whether the bloke in charge is getting the best from his squad, and the last time I really thought it was McParland in the Munto season. I am convinced Ardley didn't do it last season, and I don't think he's doing it this season even though I accept it wouldn't make sense to get rid at this point. It seems he's here for the foreseeable, so let's hope he proves me wrong.

[navypie]

Goes without saying that we all want Ardley to succeed , we are all Notts fans after all. An added benifit might be that after a period of I told you so from Laddo, he might go back to playing on his Xbox.

[LaxtonLad]

I've been more than impressed with his signings this season, his tactics I haven't.

I'd like to know how much input there has been from the Reedtz brothers concerning this season's signings and their opinion of how Ardley is handling them. So far he has signed some decent (for this level) players but he seems unable to get them out of looking as if they were in second gear. The slow, careful build up from out of our own half has not really been effective nor will it be given the ability of our non-league footballers. You can coach players day after day but you won't be able to improve a skill that isn't there in the first place. These players know their ability, they know you can't make a silk ear out of a sow's purse. I'm sure each one of them knows the team would be achieving better results if they had better teamwork, and who's responsibility is it to get the players functioning properly and playing together as a team with a plan?

[laddo]

Ok you are getting a little obsessed now Navy. Try and go 24 hours without a name check

I've never owned an X box, a little too old for them chap. I was a playstation guy anyway.

Back on topic, who did get the best out of the players last season? Nobody. Nolan certainly didn't during that totally shocking and disastrous start. In fact the complete opposite to getting the best out of that expensively assembled squad. Sacked.

Kewell? Did well for 3 or 4 games but again nope not even close and not given enough time. Sacked.

Ardley? Nope again not even close. Bang average at best, underperformed almost throughout albeit under almost untenable conditions at the club. Not sacked.

The thing is last season were any of the managers in a position to get the best out of the squad? With the complete sh!tshow that was NCFC off field last season? Which got more and more embarrassing and harder to be the manager as the season progressed. Ended up as we all know as an embarrassing circus. I don't any of them had a chance, at best Nolan did but he screwed it up before his premature sacking.

Ancient makes a great point, a decent manager would do this, do that. We saw that excellent thread showing the lengthy list of Notts managers in recent times.
The discussion ended up being who should and shouldn't of been appointed,? Who was sacked too early? Etc
The other more pertinent question was how many were a decent manager? How many have proved since their spell at Meadow Lane that they were in fact decent?

Where are they all now?

Our strike rate in appointing a decent manager in the past 15-20 appointments is shockingly low. Yet people seem to expect the next one to be decent and to change our fortunes around quickly. History tells us otherwise. It's tough to find a gem

[Elite_Pie]

Back on topic, who did get the best out of the players last season? Nobody. Nolan certainly didn't during that totally shocking and disastrous start. In fact the complete opposite to getting the best out of that expensively assembled squad. Sacked.

Kewell? Did well for 3 or 4 games but again nope not even close and not given enough time. Sacked.

Ardley? Nope again not even close. Bang average at best, underperformed almost throughout albeit under almost untenable conditions at the club. Not sacked.

Even though it's only tiny steps, we seem to be making progress here. You admit that no manager got the best out of the players, and I would agree wholeheartedly. So when we are playing the blame game for last season's debacle, it seems that you accept the managers (all of them) must bear some responsibility. So let's move on to the second step - do you think the players are blameles and gave 100% every game, or do you think they are also culpable?

[laddo]

We are indeed , slowly but surely. Clearly players (to varying degrees) , managers (again to varying degrees) and the chairman all have some blame attached to them. It's the proportion where I think you are living in bananaland. The chairman was the only constant throughout the season , players and managers changed as we know. He was the man who sacked two (prematurely) and appointed two. He was after all in charge of the club, the top man has the top responsibility.

So how can he have equal blame to the three managers? That makes no sense to me.

And a second question, do you think any of those managers in charge with what was happening behind the scenes (which we aren't privy to) and what was happening in the media, on social media and with the sale of the club, do you think any of them were in a position to get the most out of the players?

[Elite_Pie]

And a second question, do you think any of those managers in charge with what was happening behind the scenes (which we aren't privy to) and what was happening in the media, on social media and with the sale of the club, do you think any of them were in a position to get the most out of the players?

Absolutely, definitely, 100% yes. That's what separates good managers from bad. In the face of adversity, when the going gets tough the tough get going. You create a siege mentality and get the message across to use it to your advantage.

Sol Campbell did it at Macclesfield, Ardley didn't even come close.

[MAD_MAGPIE]

To some extent it was, although Dover did enough going forward to suggest they could steal a 0-1 win against the run of play if we had switched off at any moment.

The reality is that Dover have an outstanding away record, so whilst it would have been ideal to get 3 points, it's not a game where 1 point and a clean sheet is unacceptable. Some of our promotion rivals will (or already have had a) struggle to get a win at home against these opponents, so it's a case of take what's on offer and carry on.

I thought we played some decent stuff yesterday, sometimes at quite a good tempo with one-touch passing. At other times we played additional, unnecessary passes when better forward passes were on, which has been our problem all season, but we're not overplaying as often as we were a few months ago. I think the team is more forward-thinking than before, not least because Alex Lacey can see and play a decent forward ball from defence.

The type of football we're wanting to play relies on repetition and instinct and if we keep a settled group of players it will get better and better over time, but we're already unbeaten in nine games so there's every reason to be optimistic.

Thankyou for that synopsis Jackal it’s appreciated. Personally I’m really quite happy with our defence at the moment and we really do seem quite solid with Slocombe, Rawlinson and Lacey in the “golden triangle“ so to speak.

Yesterday was our 11th clean sheet of the season, and 12th in all competitions. It was also our 4th clean sheet in the last 5 league games. For a club that was so used to conceding two goals a game, which became the standard then it’s no coincidence that our unbeaten run is down to the improvements we have made defensively. Ben Turner will struggle to get back into the first team when he’s fit. I think this is where credit must go to Neal Ardley on the recruitment side because we do have a decent keeper and three really good centre backs for this level in Lacey, Rawlinson and Turner.

Likewise scoring goals is not the issue given the service we have players who will score such as Wootton, Thomas and Dennis.

It seems then that we probably just need to be a bit braver and courageous when looking for a forward pass. There is a man chomping at the bit to get playing again who can offer us that in Jim O’Brien. Perhaps he may be the key to helping to give others the confidence to ask more questions of teams like Dover, especially when playing at home.

[laddo]

Excellent post Mad Magpie. Manager's rightly love clean sheets , and they aren't easy to come by so this achievement shouldn't go unnoticed and should be rightly praised.

Of all the many many problems of last season, our Goals Against column was IMO our biggest. You can't win regularly if you are conceding at least twice every single game.

Rawlinson has been the surprise for me regardless what Durham Pie says.

[laddo]

Absolutely, definitely, 100% yes. That's what separates good managers from bad. In the face of adversity, when the going gets tough the tough get going. You create a siege mentality and get the message across to use it to your advantage.

Sol Campbell did it at Macclesfield, Ardley didn't even come close.

Ardley was the wrong appointment at that time, he's not that sort of manager or personality.

Maybe Sol Campbell has forgotten the siege mentality since leaving Macclesfield for Southend. They are having a shocker of a season to date, 2 wins in 26. But I'm sure he's still a good manager with a bright future.

Macclesfield in L2 are fairing a little better but not much and are in yet another relegation battle.