O/T UKIP

[Multi2]

UKIP like them or not? Looks like they're going to dint the labour stronghold

[Tangerine_Miller]

Labour have got alot of work to do to reconnect with the electorate locally and nationally.

How can UKIP succeed when we are in the largest cost of living crisis for a generation, this should be Labour bread and butter stuff. Where is the fight? Labour have made nothing but a wimper in fighting the Tory cuts, faceless and anonymous in the town nationally and locally.


I heard nothing from any of the main parties in the run up to polling day, where were the labour activists telling me what my local councillor (who ever he/she is/was) was doing to fight in my?

For too long it seems labour has taken the north for granted, according to a source I found Ukip polled 44% of the vote here in Rotherham, 4% higher than labour. They need to get back to basics and reconnect with the electorate. They need to work damn hard to get alot of ordinary working people back onside.

[smithythemiller]

How can labour fight the cuts? It was labour that got us in this mess, then sit back and watch us all suffer because more was going out than coming in. One things for sure I guarantee none of the politicians are suffering!

[millmoormagic]

Labour have got alot of work to do to reconnect with the electorate locally and nationally.

How can UKIP succeed when we are in the largest cost of living crisis for a generation, this should be Labour bread and butter stuff. Where is the fight? Labour have made nothing but a wimper in fighting the Tory cuts, faceless and anonymous in the town nationally and locally.


I heard nothing from any of the main parties in the run up to polling day, where were the labour activists telling me what my local councillor (who ever he/she is/was) was doing to fight in my?

For too long it seems labour has taken the north for granted, according to a source I found Ukip polled 44% of the vote here in Rotherham, 4% higher than labour. They need to get back to basics and reconnect with the electorate. They need to work damn hard to get alot of ordinary working people back onside.

Absolutely bang on mate, Labour have gone miles away fr

[millmoormagic]

How can labour fight the cuts? It was labour that got us in this mess, then sit back and watch us all suffer because more was going out than coming in. One things for sure I guarantee none of the politicians are suffering!

Quite simply rubbish that mate, that's just not the reason we are in this mess, have you forgotten about the banking crisis then? shafted by global banking systems is a more realistic answer, though labour couldv'e/shouldve done something about the banks much earlier in their tenure.

[smithythemiller]

Have a google of the facts. Labour are known for spending beyond there means. In 1997 they took on a budget that was in balance. In little over 10 years they left the country in A£170 BIllion in debt. People don't think there needs to be cuts? I'm no fan of the torys but they have brought this debt down rapidly.

[loyalmiller]

That's always been the way Smithy.

In laymans terms, Labour overspend the country gets into debt people are unhappy about it and vote them out. Tories come in and slash all spending to pay off some of the debt so the people start to hate them and vote them out.

Vicious circle because there's never been a genuine 3rd option. I don't think UKIP are the 3rd option but it might make the two major parties sit up and think..

[smithythemiller]

I agree loyal. Which ones the safer option? My view not the ones that spend spend spend, Then ridicule the others when they cut things to pay there mess off. Things will get better with this government I believe but put labour back in and your kids and grand kids and great grand kids will suffer like this again. While the people that run the party are sat laughing and have no idea the price or value of things and have probably never worked longer than an 8 hour shift.

[stevemiller]

How can labour fight the cuts? It was labour that got us in this mess, then sit back and watch us all suffer because more was going out than coming in. One things for sure I guarantee none of the politicians are suffering!

Quite simply rubbish that mate, that's just not the reason we are in this mess, have you forgotten about the banking crisis then? shafted by global banking systems is a more realistic answer, though labour couldv'e/shouldve done something about the banks much earlier in their tenure.[/quote]

Labour pushed borrowing too high. A country runs on tax income. The banking crisis and property crash took away chunks of that tax income leaving a fragile government exposed.

What you're saying is like you borrowing against your income, like we all do with mortgages and credit cards, then you lose you job and it all comes crashing down.
Is that your fault for borrow

[millavanilla]

There is no labour government anymore and i doubt there ever will be...they are just a milder version of the tory party...one lets you buy your council house and then takes your job away, the other taxes you to death to pay for more immigrants..nothing special or anything significant ever happens when either party are in power..
While ever we stay old fashioned in voting for either of these two partys, nothing will ever change..and now surely its time for a proper change...how can ukip , make a worse job than these two sets of clowns?

[stevemiller]

There is no labour government anymore and i doubt there ever will be...they are just a milder version of the tory party...one lets you buy your council house and then takes your job away, the other taxes you to death to pay for more immigrants..nothing special or anything significant ever happens when either party are in power..
While ever we stay old fashioned in voting for either of these two partys, nothing will ever change..and now surely its time for a proper change...how can ukip , make a worse job than these two sets of clowns?

Probably quite easily.

[Georgetown]

So pleased UKIP have sent this Labour council a message that they can't ignore. Everything I read and heard about Labour in the run up to the election was why not to vote UKIP. Talk about running scared. Never did they mention the negative effect that unbalanced immigration has had on he town probably due to having their heads buried in the sand.

To top it all, on Radio Sheffield this morning we have Toby Foster and Labour saying that local councils have absolutely no control over immigration into their town so to punish them by voting UKIP is unfair. This couldn't be further from the truth.

Rotherham's labour council have been the main instigator of the unsustained immigration into the town. Far from being blameless, they volunteered Roherham to be a dispersal town since 1999 to ease pressure on the south east. This meant we took far more immigrants than other towns in return for short term cash injections from central government. This policy has failed spectacularly. The people

[RedAnt]

That's always been the way Smithy.

In laymans terms, Labour overspend the country gets into debt people are unhappy about it and vote them out. Tories come in and slash all spending to pay off some of the debt so the people start to hate them and vote them out.

Vicious circle because there's never been a genuine 3rd option. I don't think UKIP are the 3rd option but it might make the two major parties sit up and think..

It's more to do with where the money is spent rather than how much. Spending and borrowing from left to right hardly wavers. The Tories have historically sold everything off to the point where there's nothing left that is publicly (or British) owned, which means borrowing has become inevitable to sustain the things that we take for granted.

They are now realising that since everything has been privatised and taken over by the US, China, India, Germany and Russia, taxation and plugging tax loopholes, and aidin

[michaeldc]

Have a google of the facts. Labour are known for spending beyond there means. In 1997 they took on a budget that was in balance. In little over 10 years they left the country in Ai170 BIllion in debt. People don't think there needs to be cuts? I'm no fan of the torys but they have brought this debt down rapidly.

The sad thing here is that if the tories keep saying they are bringing down the debt, people believe them blindly without any fact checking at all. I would love to see some evidence that our national debt has been reduced or indeed that our rate of borrowing has come down.

While taxes increase for the poorest as part of 'austerity', the tories implement huge corporate tax cuts year on year (about 20% each year in fact) and the corporate directors of the country continue to gain huge (and I mean HUGE) increases in wages. MPs received a wallet busting 11% rise in pay while the rest of public servants received an effec

[stevemiller]

Have a google of the facts. Labour are known for spending beyond there means. In 1997 they took on a budget that was in balance. In little over 10 years they left the country in Ai170 BIllion in debt. People don't think there needs to be cuts? I'm no fan of the torys but they have brought this debt down rapidly.

You want: an EU referendum? to renationalise the rail & eneergy infrastructure? monetary reform? Then do your research and vote for a genuine alternative party who would actually change the way we do things. One such party exists and it's not bloody UKIP.[/quote]

How many people research before voting?
People drink in any bull 'their' party puts out.
They ridicule anything the other parties put out, even when sometimes it's the SAME policy.
They use council elections to lodge a 'protest vote' before returning to the fold for general elections.
A party calling itself Gre

[fivetide]

"The fact is that George Osborne has already borrowed more money in under four years than New Labour did in the preceding 13. Another fact is that by 2015 Osborne will have racked up a mind boggling A?207 billion more in debt than he projected he was going to back in 2010."

It's always the same under the tories, the poor pay for the mistakes of the rich.
.

While if we take the socialist tinted glasses off we'll remember that Labour enjoyed a decade of economic growth, led by the credit that banks where giving out right up to point the whole house of cards came down.

We'll also note that while the economy was growing, Labour still managed to rack up massive debts rather than paying off what we had already or even, gasp, running a surplus. Billions flushed down the bog. congrats.

We'll also note that when the new government came in there was a note in the treasury from the Labour lot saying "good luck there is nothing left"

T

[tanksandy]

"The fact is that George Osborne has already borrowed more money in under four years than New Labour did in the preceding 13. Another fact is that by 2015 Osborne will have racked up a mind boggling A?207 billion more in debt than he projected he was going to back in 2010."

It's always the same under the tories, the poor pay for the mistakes of the rich.
.

hahaha what nonsense that is.

what about the money Alistair darling borrowed to bail out the banks?? you taken that into account.

I would never vote labour in a general or local election because they do nothing other than borrow and spend beyond their means.


the state of Rotherham council sums labour up. spending millions of pounds on a roundabout in kimberworth to put in yellow poles that supposedly represent wheat and harvesting.

spending millions of pound on building a state of the art mosque.

im using these 2 as exa

[Dr_Spinn]

There's a world of difference between national and local politics. Of course, what's going on nationally is bound to have an impact locally. But personally I can't help but see the UKIP vote as a postive thing for the town.

There hasn't been any strong opposition to the labour party for as long as I can remember, and if the UKIP councillors can provide the scrutiny of local policies and contribute towards positive change in the town, then that can only be a good thing.

Better decisions by the councillors should be made, and for the first time ever in Rotherham, it feels as if every vote counts - Remember Labour held onto ward by just THREE votes!

Hopefully, we'll start seeing a few changes for the better in the town hall.

There are actually very few wards where Labour wins outright, but because often independents, the BNP, the socialists etc. All stand candidates and as a result of the general 'anything but labour' feeling, Labour councillors slip through the net, despite often

[ColinRUFC]

Not a UKIP voter myself, but just take a look at the candidates and it's fairly obvious UKIP were the only serious opposition to Labour.

Cons only stood candidates in 15 wards
Greens in 2
Lib Dems in 1.

In 2 wards it was a 2 horse race Lab/UKIP
In another 2 wards it was 3 way Lab/UKIP/Independent.

Only in one ward did someone other than Lab or UKIP finish in the top two.

[tanksandy]

[quote="Dr_Spinn"]There's a world of difference between national and local politics. Of course, what's going on nationally is bound to have an impact locally. But personally I can't help but see the UKIP vote as a postive thing for the town.

There hasn't been any strong opposition to the labour party for as long as I can remember, and if the UKIP councillors can provide the scrutiny of local policies and contribute towards positive change in the town, then that can only be a good thing.

Better decisions by the councillors should be made, and for the first time ever in Rotherham, it feels as if every vote counts - Remember Labour held onto ward by just THREE votes!

Hopefully, we'll start seeing a few changes for the better in the town hall.

There are actually very few wards where Labour wins outright, but because often independents, the BNP, the socialists etc. All stand candidates and as a result of the general 'anything but labour' feeling, Labour c

[Rothbiz]

Three of the new UKIP councillors are ex-Tory candidates.

[Dr_Spinn]

@Rothbiz... I rest my case!

[John2]

Have a google of the facts. Labour are known for spending beyond there means. In 1997 they took on a budget that was in balance. In little over 10 years they left the country in Ai170 BIllion in debt. People don't think there needs to be cuts? I'm no fan of the torys but they have brought this debt down rapidly.

What facts did you Google? A quick search reveals national debt in 2010 was £0.76 trillion and in 2013 was £1.16 trillion, an increase of £0.4 trillion - how is that a rapid reduction?



Far from being blameless, they volunteered Roherham to be a dispersal town since 1999 to ease pressure on the south east. This meant we took far more immigrants than other towns in return for short term cash injections from central government.

This is not true, you're confusing immigration with asylum. Two very different things, even at its peak there have ne

[Rothbiz]

The results are a massive wake up call for Labour and it's about time they listened.

They've lost key posts too including the deputy leader and chair of planning.

[Multi2]

Locally, I just don't know how you could vote for Labour though unless you're stupid or stuck in you ways. I'm not saying you should vote for UKIP either.

But Labour has held Rotherham since 1931 and if you go across the country and ask them about Rotherham they will call it a shi*hole. This is my point exactly if Labour did well then wouldn't we be talking about a bright well looked after town that everyone else wants to live in?

Also the scandal of Dennis McShane and the covering up of the grooming, *** abuse scandals are other reasons why you shouldn't vote Labour. My vote did not go to Labour and I don't know why people give theirs to them. But feel free to waste your vote voting Labour as it's a democracy and everyone is entitled to their opinion

[brassgnat]

Locally, I just don't know how you could vote for Labour though unless you're stupid or stuck in you ways. I'm not saying you should vote for UKIP either.

But Labour has held Rotherham since 1931 and if you go across the country and ask them about Rotherham they will call it a shi*hole. This is my point exactly if Labour did well then wouldn't we be talking about a bright well looked after town that everyone else wants to live in?

Also the scandal of Dennis McShane and the covering up of the grooming, *** abuse scandals are other reasons why you shouldn't vote Labour. My vote did not go to Labour and I don't know why people give theirs to them. But feel free to waste your vote voting Labour as it's a democracy and everyone is entitled to their opinion

No excuse to vote for scabs and racists though.
Who exactly covered up what as regards the grooming scandal?

[Rothbiz]

Apathy was the big winner again. The turnout was around 34%

[jolly_roger]

What gets me though is how dim the major parties are.

The indicators have been there for months if not years that the UK has a problem with immigration.

But the Labour, Cons and Divs all choose to stick their collective fingers in their ears and chant "la la la we're not listening" regardless of public opinion.

Also the googling Guardian readers (see posts above) try to preach to us that there isn't a problem and that to suggest so is racist (how naive can you get?)

The message is there for the main parties, sort out the immigration issue locally and nationally or UKIP will get even stronger.

[tanksandy]

it wont be surprising to see other right wing national parties from other countries gain seats in the European elections.

hopefully that powers that be in each country will realise not everybody is a fan of the EU. yes it has some benefits but the disadvantages outweigh the advantages by far and too much power is now in Brussels instead of your home country.

with the EU laws that pass, Westminster is getting weaker by the day in terms of policies.


our status of our stance in the EU needs quickly reevaluating.



with regards to immigration, UKIP and Farage don't want to stop immigration completely, they want it to be controlled, and there solution is basically saying if you want to live here you are going to have to obtain a work permit thus resulting in immigrants contributing to our economy instead of coming here to claim benefits.

[michaeldc]

[quote="fivetide"

Then we'll apply a touch of logic and realise that to service a deby mountain like that and try to get to grips with things then the interest alone is going to mean even more borrowing so what you've quoted as a negative is actually no surprise at all and the fault of the previous government.

Sadly the fact unemployment is down and the economy is actually growing again seems to have passed you by...

Still lets play UKIP Top Trumps shall we? Lovely bunch they are too[/quote]

I'll try to address your points by paragraph, ignoring the first two which just sound like tory spin without really saying anything.

1. Byrne said the message was meant in jest. "My letter was a joke, from one chief secretary to another," he said. "I do hope David Laws's sense of humour wasn't another casualty of the coal

[brassgnat]

Three of the new UKIP councillors are ex-Tory candidates.

It would be a sad irony if they have won in the ex-mining areas like Silverwood.
Ex miners voting in Thatcherite racist scabs :blue:

I voted Labour, without illusions, to try and keep UKIP out, locally and Green in the Euros.

Was there a 'Jewish' problem in Germany in the 1930's, or were they scapegoats for the economic and social crisis at the time?

[Multi2]

People moan about Rotherham being a shi*hole but still vote Labour every time.

I voted Conservative and UKIP

I'd rather cut my balls off and make meatballs than vote labour

[jolly_roger]

Vote Green?

Excellent manifesto is theirs

1. We don't like that
2. We don't like that either
3. We certainly don't like that
4. Not in my back yard
5. We are still opposed to that

etc etc etc

[fivetide]

I'll try to address your points by paragraph, ignoring the first two which just sound like tory spin without really saying anything.

Then you've missed the point entirely. Did Labour or did they not enjoy a decade of growth? Was that or was it not led by a huge rise in the service sector, during which a UK bank, RBS, one of the main leaders of the whole collapse became the biggest bank in the world.

Who let them spank A?49bn on ABM Amro in 2007 - was it the tories? No, it was Labour who then bailed them out to the tune of A?45bn!!!!

Here's a good bit of chat on Labour at the time and the role played by them, something you seem to be sadly overlooking:

"However, Darling cannot be separated from the decisions that led to the crisis. He was Labour spokesman on Treasury Affairs and then Chief Secretary to the Treasury across the period of 1992-1998. Alongside Gordon Brown, Tony Blair and Ed Balls, he was an architect of a?? if n

[Redshank]

Vote Green?

Excellent manifesto is theirs

1. We don't like that
2. We don't like that either
3. We certainly don't like that
4. Not in my back yard
5. We are still opposed to that

etc etc etc


I take it you voted Green then Jolly?

Sounds right up your street that manifesto! XD

[millmoorlane]

Rotherham - you should be careful what you wish for.

A protest vote is fine but giving control of a major council to a party with no record in being able to administer anything and, at best, flaky populist policies is a dangerous mix.

I suspect Rotherham will become a much nastier place to live with a far less competent administration than it had been for a while.

Labour deserve everything they get with how they've worked on a local level but giving UKIP control of a council in a traditionally socialist area is insane.

UKIP are the least socialist of all parties. Voting Tory would be more left wing.

Good luck.

[michaeldc]

I didn't miss the point entirely, I read those paragraphs, just didn't reply to them, that's what I meant by ignoring them (in the context of my reply, not completely).I had nothing really to add to what you wrote, you say that Labour enjoyed fantastic growth but seem to suggest they deserve no credit for it, yet they deserve blame for everything that went wrong, like when a private company makes a business decision and then fails like RBS did. If Labour opened us up to deregulation of the banks then the tories are yet fix these issues and if you believe that under the tories the world financial crisis wouldn't have happened then I'm afraid I simply don't agree. You quote... someone, saying what you think is a good bit of chat but to me at least, it doesn't ring true... maybe it's because whoever wrote it put the word 'toughera' in there, I'm not sure. Also, please stop talking down to me saying things 'sadly, you seem to be overlooking' - I don't even know what you're quoting, how can

[michaeldc]

Vote Green?

Excellent manifesto is theirs

1. We don't like that
2. We don't like that either
3. We certainly don't like that
4. Not in my back yard
5. We are still opposed to that

etc etc etc

Wow, someone who has absolutely no idea about this party at all and if you do you express it incredibly poorly.

Shockingly ignorant.

[Galant]

Greens - out of touch weirdos
Conservatives - good on economy - don't care about people.
Labour - dreadful on economy - only care about themselves and other scroungers (from here or abroad).
Liberals - laughing stock.
UKIP - one policy party - but one I agree with - control immigration so that all who live here (including foreigners already settled here)- have enough houses, schools, hospital beds and space on the road to travel around - it's simple - if we hade 3 million fewer people in the country then we would have better lifestyles than we have now - lets stop the next 3 million population rise from happening - I would vote for any party that promises that to be honest - only UKIP is offering that at the moment - although Tories re-thinking it.

[michaeldc]

Greens - out of touch weirdos
Conservatives - good on economy - don't care about people.
Labour - dreadful on economy - only care about themselves and other scroungers (from here or abroad).
Liberals - laughing stock.
UKIP - one policy party - but one I agree with - control immigration so that all who live here (including foreigners already settled here)- have enough houses, schools, hospital beds and space on the road to travel around - it's simple - if we hade 3 million fewer people in the country then we would have better lifestyles than we have now - lets stop the next 3 million population rise from happening - I would vote for any party that promises that to be honest - only UKIP is offering that at the moment - although Tories re-thinking it.

An even more ignorant post. Incredible viewpoint. So much wrong with it, I don't know where to begin.

[Amanda_Hugg_n_Kiss]

Have a google of the facts. Labour are known for spending beyond there means. In 1997 they took on a budget that was in balance. In little over 10 years they left the country in Ai170 BIllion in debt. People don't think there needs to be cuts? I'm no fan of the torys but they have brought this debt down rapidly.

You want: an EU referendum? to renationalise the rail & eneergy infrastructure? monetary reform? Then do your research and vote for a genuine alternative party who would actually change the way we do things. One such party exists and it's not bloody UKIP.[/quote]

How many people research before voting?
People drink in any bull 'their' party puts out.
They ridicule anything the other parties put out, even when sometimes it's the SAME policy.
They use council elections to lodge a 'protest vote' before returning to the fold

[millertop]

Politics has been introduced in schools already

[brassgnat]

People moan about Rotherham being a shi*hole but still vote Labour every time.

I voted Conservative and UKIP

I'd rather cut my balls off and make meatballs than vote labour

Oh for Labour only candidates in your ward then >;)

[Roscar1]

Brassgnat for your information Mr M Parker is now the proud UKIP representative of the Silverwood ward. Many ex miners will be spinning in their graves at the thought of this guy. Although he may not cause too much of an upset as I understand he dose not bother attending a lot of meetings - just when he can get some self publicity, maybe someone could ask him why he no longer stands as a Tory, how many meetings he attended last time elected and did he claim a full yearly allowance

[Munch_Magic]

I think that folk are just sick of the same old Labour/Tory playing games and bouncing off each other.

Good point above, the UKIP Manifesto may not be the best but neither are the alternatives, Labour and the Tories are not listening to the people and are constantly playing safe.

The folk have been crying out for change for years and it has fell on deaf ears, someone has come along banging a drum and the people are following.

Am loving the scare stories that we will return to slavery if UKIP get in.

The old guard must be ****ting themselves.

[brassgnat]

Brassgnat for your information Mr M Parker is now the proud UKIP representative of the Silverwood ward. Many ex miners will be spinning in their graves at the thought of this guy. Although he may not cause too much of an upset as I understand he dose not bother attending a lot of meetings - just when he can get some self publicity, maybe someone could ask him why he no longer stands as a Tory, how many meetings he attended last time elected and did he claim a full yearly allowance

Sadly I suspect there will be some who went through 84-5 will have voted for him. Post pit closures those communities can feel abandoned by Labour, but would never vote Tory, but might fall for the poison in blaming other people who have naff all, living a couple of miles away.
We do need a bigger united fightback against the cuts and privatisation.