The Alternative

[thefutureistangerine4]

We are fortunate to have some intelligent people who post on this board so i will ask them the question.

What exactly, specifically is the alternative to ST right now?

This message board is chock full of comments saying he should leave immediately. So lets assume that is exactly what he did. He walks out the door tomorrow giving up his shares for nothing and thats it - he's gone. What is the immediate and medium term future?

Who is waiting in the wings to step in and what exactly do they offer?

I am not on here to defend ST it is abundantly clear that the last 2.7 years (since Feb 2014) he has presided over a disaster. Prior to that point he was doing a pretty decent job and I suspect was held in pretty high esteem by most within football for bringing down a crippling debt whilst putting a good team on the park. he made some judgement calls after that which have proved to be mistakes and have no doubt led us to where we are today. I don't hate him the way many on here seem to. i believe that he genuinely cares about the club and it must be horrific to feel responsible for the decline of a club he clearly cares about.

I think he has tried hard to support his managers. when he appointed RM the vast majority on here were supportive of the decision (although to read the forum now it appears most of you have forgotten that you supported that decision). He has provided RM with funds this year to put a decent team on the park and he has also secured funding to keep the club operating even though it is losing money. If he had just walked away who would have done that?

I believe that ST needs to go. BUT anyone coming in needs to have sufficient funds to cover any losses indefinitely and underwrite a transitional period to take us back to where a club of our fanbase and stature should be (realistically mid table SPL). I ask my fellow posters who is that person? I am hoping that some of you that are calling for ST to go have some information that I don't and are aware of who is ready to step into the breach. If there is nobody credible in the wings then calls for ST to go are pointless and we would be better supporting him to get us out of this mess until a suitable alternative can be identified.

thats my tuppenceworth - cue the bile.......

[TangerineDream]

Interesting post. I agree with much of that.

We need someone to step up here so Thompson can leave, soon hopefully.

[PortugueseFrank]

No matter who comes in they will need access to funds to cover loses while the ship is righted.

And no one in their right mind is going to come in and invest money in any form other than loans.

If we are lucky the loans will be interest free but I think it’s most likely there will be some interest accruing loans.

Either way we need to be prepared for the short and medium term debts to increase.

Why do I labour that point? Because we need to be prepared for the fact that no matter who is in charge the debt will go up.

This fact could end the honeymoon period for any new owner quite quickly. And if they can’t break down the operating loses pronto the debt will have to increase or sales will have to be made to cover the loses.

In an ideal world we need a full time, hands on, qualified Chief Exec as well as the current staffing structure.

It’s ***** the executive leadership knows what they are doing, how things need to be done and is properly motivated to deliver it. Something we have simply not had in ST.

No matter who comes in or doesn’t we need to be prepared for some debt to increase.

And any buyer needs to not only have the cash to buy out ST and Justine Mitchell, they will also need working capital to invest (most likely in form of loans) to cover loses.

The wrong owner (as we have seen) and it could get a lot worse before it gets better.

Only thing we fans can do is pray someone with the financial means and the business acumen decides they fancy a football club or get organised, united and try to mobilise some kind of significant fan presence in the running of the club.

[Charlie arab]

Agree with your post future, hope some posters can supply answers as there is plenty hints that there are people waiting in the wings with the money to get us back where we belong. Personally I'm not too sure there is anyone , hope I'm wrong.

[SmedDUm]

I think the manager's position is due for assessment at Christmas & the chairman's ownership will be resolved come May.
The manager wants to right things by Christmas & the owner by the end of the season.
I can't see us having either at the helm if we fail to get promoted this season.

So no pressure!

[USArab]

It's all about the money. Finding someone who is willing to invest gazillions in the club, the management staff and the players is probably nowhere on the horizon anytime soon.

The reality is we are where we are and nothing is going to change unless the above happens.

Not holding my breath!

[arab_plumber]

It's all about the money. Finding someone who is willing to invest gazillions in the club, the management staff and the players is probably nowhere on the horizon anytime soon.

The reality is we are where we are and nothing is going to change unless the above happens.

Not holding my breath!
Absolute nonsense that anyone taking over needs gazillions, this is kind of pish frustrates me beyond belief

Stephen Thompson has not pumped millions into dundee united quite the opposite is true

Anyone taking over needs to be more astute than Thompson mind you that's not difficult tbf and not take a six figure salary and employing someone else on a huge salary to do their job.

If Thompson had any clue he'd have Ray in for a meeting just now laying down the law and demanding a huge turn around in form to stop the crowds dwindling,.

[TerryTheTerror]

It needs someone with enough money to buy Thompson out though?

[PortugueseFrank]

It needs someone with enough money to buy Thompson out though?

And enough money, or access to funds, to cover operating losses in the event of no transfer sales. Be that 50k or 300k.

You’d have to expect they’d have business interests outside football and they’d therefore have to hire a competent CEO to run things full time.

[shedboy71]

If Thompson had any clue he'd have Ray in for a meeting just now laying down the law and demanding a huge turn around in form to stop the crowds dwindling,.

Has been told he has 3 games to improve things. Wether that means the sack if not or a performance improvement plan i dont know

[RAM1971]

I don't think we really know what Thompson's true position on the matter is?

At our current level (Championship), our value is considerably less than if we were our normal Top 6 Premiership side. Therefore it must be highly desirous for us to return to our former status before Thompson will sell? He will not be offered anything like what he wants until we are back where we once were. Of course, returning to that position has to be done as cheaply as possible.

Does ST really want to sell? In our current mess it is not a good sign for what Daddy left us. What would be next for ST? Where would he get his 150 grand or whatever per year, to keep him in the lifestyle he is accustomed to? The current rumours about his personal life, if true, and let's be very guarded about that, could siphon away a lot of his 'wealth' and assets?

Overall I have my doubts that ST really wants to sell, or at least not in the foreseeable future. Dundee United just might be his cash cow and he needs to have his hands on the udders meantime?

Again, a fair amount of speculation on my part, but either we have someone who doesn't really want to sell (at least as yet), or there genuinely isn't anyone prepared to take us on as we are?

[PortugueseFrank]

All points of merit, Ram.

Put yourself in the position for a moment.

We’d all prefer to sell our assets, whatever they may be for as high a price as possible. So Prem status os highly desirable.

It is also desirable for the increased income which could service debt and help keep asking price high.

And with no other business interests to speak of, I can understand why he wouldn’t be in a hurry to walk away from his only income. Who would?

Nobody is stepping forward to buy now. So it will be either through success or further failure that a buyer becomes interested imo.

Fan pressure has so far failed to increase the likelihood of an exit for ST and a new regime.

So I can’t see much movement in the ownership front for 3 years at least.

[LSArab]

It needs someone with enough money to buy Thompson out though?

The point is this and ST himself are the stumbling block.

Dundee United run within its means will be better than any championship side. They get a couple of thousand supporters at most. We get 6k+ even when we are doing as badly as now

Asking for lots of money when the club has been brought to its knees is what is potentially putting off interested parties.

There are plenty of united supporters who would be capable of coming in and running the club - as happens with most other clubs in Scottish football.

If you went in to the exec boxes on a Saturday and asked around I suspect you'd immediately find a few individuals more than capable of putting together a better business plan for the club than ST.

[LSArab]

I don't know if anyone has an inside line on here. I don't know if ST has genuinely looked for any offers or what ball park figure he is looking at????

[arab_plumber]

Ram has got it right ST won't sell until we're back up in the SPL for obvious financial reasons, he's already knocked back what I'd describe as very generous offers already but he'll never admit that as it suits his game plan to play the nobody wants the club card.

Every month that goes by the further the club falls from where it should be

[shedboy71]

Ram has got it right ST won't sell until we're back up in the SPL for obvious financial reasons, he's already knocked back what I'd describe as very generous offers already but he'll never admit that as it suits his game plan to play the nobody wants the club card.

Every month that goes by the further the club falls from where it should be

Interesting that AP - wonder if he regrets that now?

[PortugueseFrank]

Interesting that AP - wonder if he regrets that now?

Surely depends on what AP considers “very generous offers”.

[Charlie arab]

What were the offers ?Who made them?

[RAM1971]

In all my many years of football interest I have never known a situation where a professional football club in Scotland could be offered for sale for such a long time without there being any (supposedly) genuine interested parties. Something is not right?

[PortugueseFrank]

What were the offers ?Who made them?

Michael W. Gregory, MD met with ST in London but it never led to much more.

That’s the only enquiry/tentative bid I’m aware of.

Of course if there are others I’m sure people in the know will divulge.

They’ve no reason not to after all.

[duke_the_arab]

St Mirren were up for sale for a long time. Gilmour couldn't get rid even after they won the League Cup.

[PortugueseFrank]

In all my many years of football interest I have never known a situation where a professional football club in Scotland could be offered for sale for such a long time without there being any (supposedly) genuine interested parties. Something is not right?

Then surely “genuine interested parties” that are knocked back would go public with their interest to increase pressure to sell?

They don’t have to say they had discussions previously as they may be beholding to Non Disclosure Agreements but they can certainly state their intentions to buy in future.

Much in the same way ET did.

I’m yet to experience a wholly private takeover bid in the history of football.

[Charlie arab]

Michael W. Gregory, MD met with ST in London but it never led to much more.

That’s the only enquiry/tentative bid I’m aware of.

Of course if there are others I’m sure people in the know will divulge.

They’ve no reason not to after all.

Agree , any details AP?

[thefutureistangerine4]

Agree , any details AP?

So the answer to my question from all the enlightened ones is that right none of you know if there is a serious credible alternative. And yet you all continually beat the 'ST must go!' Drum.

Until there is an alternative I would prefer he does not do a runner. Bad job or not we are still trading and we still have a club to support.

[PortugueseFrank]

Begs an interesting question:

With a properly qualified and talented CEO, could the fans do a better job steering the ship?

Look at Dunfermline for example.

One fan group runs the club but employs the staff to do it.

One very talented general manager/ceo delivering on the fan owner’s vision.

Michael Mlotkiewicz at Dunfermline has done a tremendous job there.

A candidate such as him could be all we need to right the ship under the fan’s ownership.

A theory. An option. Worst considering.

[shedboy71]

I will probably get shot for this but i have genuine sympathy for ST (in parts). He is so out of his depth and now wants out has hatred and bile posted about him and to his face and is public enemy no1. He is an arab though and must be hurting as much as we do. He has a 100% no win situation. Then my sympathy begins to dissapear when i hear the price he wants (allegedly) and i think there is some truth in it. Now slowly watching the team being mismamnaged again is quite tough to take.

I want him out and Franks proposal above is sound. BUT we have to get rid of the monty python factions all over the place - One body with one goal. Some may say that was FU but not seeing it just now.

[LSArab]

Ram has got it right ST won't sell until we're back up in the SPL for obvious financial reasons, he's already knocked back what I'd describe as very generous offers already but he'll never admit that as it suits his game plan to play the nobody wants the club card.

Every month that goes by the further the club falls from where it should be

This to me goes to heart of it. If true ST has offers but won't sell.

Agree totally with how Future has brought this up.

Those of who oppose ST need to think how best someone or a fans group can have the opportunity to take over and as soon as possible.

Seems to me that a fans group appointing staff is the best model. - as with Dunfermline

If loans or finance is needed a well organised CEO with full backing of enfranchised fans would be better IMO than supposed business guru ST

[RAM1971]

Then surely “genuine interested parties” that are knocked back would go public with their interest to increase pressure to sell?

They don’t have to say they had discussions previously as they may be beholding to Non Disclosure Agreements but they can certainly state their intentions to buy in future.

Much in the same way ET did.

I’m yet to experience a wholly private takeover bid in the history of football.


I reckon it all depends upon how far talks may have progressed to, along with other influencing factors.

[TangerineDream]

Have to say it .................. Fan ownership gives me the absolute FEAR.

Just consider all the infighting, bickering , egos, public arguments and statements over the past 2/3 years from the various groups and factions. FFS it could be a complete disaster , again.

There would have to be a lot of consideration, reigning in of loose cannons and generaly more appropriate and professional behaviour. Although employing the correct and experienced people is an interesting concept.

What I would say is remember the state the Funsters got into with their SS brigade. That was a complete disaster mess.

We would have to tread warily with this approach.

[shedboy71]

Have to say it .................. Fan ownership gives me the absolute FEAR.

Just consider all the infighting, bickering , egos, public arguments and statements over the past 2/3 years from the various groups and factions. FFS it could be a complete disaster , again.

There would have to be a lot of consideration, reigning in of loose cannons and generaly more appropriate and professional behaviour. Although employing the correct and experienced people is an interesting concept.

What I would say is remember the state the Funsters got into with their SS brigade. That was a complete disaster mess.

We would have to tread warily with this approach.

With our fans just now - I totally 100% agree with you.

[PortugueseFrank]

As do I. But I suspect our current “fan reps”, of all groups, if asked to step aside for the greater good of Dundee United would say no.

Theron lies an issue.

All successful fan movements have been thorough ONE group. Not 7.

[shedka]

So the answer to my question from all the enlightened ones is that right none of you know if there is a serious credible alternative. And yet you all continually beat the 'ST must go!' Drum.

Until there is an alternative I would prefer he does not do a runner. Bad job or not we are still trading and we still have a club to support.

This




Have to say it .................. Fan ownership gives me the absolute FEAR.

Just consider all the infighting, bickering , egos, public arguments and statements over the past 2/3 years from the various groups and factions. FFS it could be a complete disaster , again.

There would have to be a lot of consideration, reigning in of loose cannons and generaly more appropriate and professional behaviour. Although employing the correct and experienced people is an interesting concept.

What I would say is remember the state the Funsters got into with their SS brigade. That was a complete disaster mess.

We would have to tread warily with this approach.


And this

Until there is a proper replacement lined up then I certainly don't want ST out, the alternative could be much much worse, fan ownership being one

[shedboy71]

As do I. But I suspect our current “fan reps”, of all groups, if asked to step aside for the greater good of Dundee United would say no.

Theron lies an issue.

All successful fan movements have been thorough ONE group. Not 7.

been like that for years though Frank to be honest. And your last sentence is spot on. Too many egos

[seenitab4]

Would be easier to break it down to who can afford to buy the club and also has the passion as a fan not many of them going about for sure. Guy from CA engineering FAV, Lorr Kelly and Brian Taylor ( partnership),Brian Cox (well afford it), how about Ricky Ross without the blue? Sham 69? Thon wumin that won £9m ( easy come easy go!) All arabs btw FACT. Oh except john gotti! He can afford it but thats ah!

[PortugueseFrank]

been like that for years though Frank to be honest. And your last sentence is spot on. Too many egos

There are posters from each fan group on here.

Question for each as an individual.

Would you surrender your place and your organisation if it meant the greater good of Dundee United?

I’ll be honest, I’m expecting zero responses.

[shedboy71]

There is math a poster for each fan group on here.

Question for each as an individual.

Would you surrender your place and your organisation if it meant the greater good of Dundee United?

I’ll be honest, I’m expecting zero responses.

Thats why no fans group will own or part of utd - but yes i would but then i am a successful businessman so easy for me to say. Maybe the heads of all these factions that is their life that is their aspiration. and fair play but too many factions voices and not enough focus.

FYI - i have previously enquired about ownership and investment into utd. I was treated like a leper and wont be back. You probably know who I am given some of your insight and comments.

[PortugueseFrank]

Thats why no fans group will own or part of utd - but yes i would but then i am a successful businessman so easy for me to say. Maybe the heads of all these factions that is their life that is their aspiration. and fair play but too many factions voices and not enough focus.

FYI - i have previously enquired about ownership and investment into utd. I was treated like a leper and wont be back. You probably know who I am given some of your insight and comments.

Not much of a clue considering United treat everyone including paying customers like lepers on a day to day basis.

Off topic but I know many people at other clubs and United have a bad reputation for arrogance, poor preparation and lack of professionalism throughout the dealings. Wether transfers, media department (in particular) or operations.

We are not a well liked club. It’s embarrassing for me when in my dealings I have people remind me of how the club’s departments have acted arrogantly and dismissively.

[Dyce_arab]

Have to say it .................. Fan ownership gives me the absolute FEAR.

Just consider all the infighting, bickering , egos, public arguments and statements over the past 2/3 years from the various groups and factions. FFS it could be a complete disaster , again.

There would have to be a lot of consideration, reigning in of loose cannons and generaly more appropriate and professional behaviour. Although employing the correct and experienced people is an interesting concept.

What I would say is remember the state the Funsters got into with their SS brigade. That was a complete disaster mess.

We would have to tread warily with this approach.

Agree min can ye imagine kunts like Mike Barile having a say? ST is a dick and i do want him oot but nae at the expense of a fans group

[Dyce_arab]

There are posters from each fan group on here.

Question for each as an individual.

Would you surrender your place and your organisation if it meant the greater good of Dundee United?

I’ll be honest, I’m expecting zero responses.

Fair question Porto min lets see what they say

[shedboy71]

Not much of a clue considering United treat everyone including paying customers like lepers on a day to day basis.

Off topic but I know many people at other clubs and United have a bad reputation for arrogance, poor preparation and lack of professionalism throughout the dealings. Wether transfers, media department (in particular) or operations.

We are not a well liked club. It’s embarrassing for me when in my dealings I have people remind me of how the club’s departments have acted arrogantly and dismissively.

Agree and you are not who i thought you were. i would say arrogance and ignorance is a leadership style i could associate with the club. Unfortunately more through ignorance than any self belief or historic delivery

[PortugueseFrank]

Agree min can ye imagine kunts like Mike Barile having a say? ST is a dick and i do want him oot but nae at the expense of a fans group

Not the only fan group member that will think like that. Guaranteed.

[shedboy71]

Spence kept sanity and just plain humanity together at the club in so many ways. Derek too.

[LSArab]

Thats why no fans group will own or part of utd - but yes i would but then i am a successful businessman so easy for me to say. Maybe the heads of all these factions that is their life that is their aspiration. and fair play but too many factions voices and not enough focus.

FYI - i have previously enquired about ownership and investment into utd. I was treated like a leper and wont be back. You probably know who I am given some of your insight and comments.

Wow. This is an interesting thread.

Says a lot. Potential investors are shunned. Running of the club elsewhere in thread is said to be toxic.

No wonder we can't find a buyer if this is true. The longer ST involved the more it seems the lose chance of good potential owners / investors being interested

[PortugueseFrank]

Agree and you are not who i thought you were. i would say arrogance and ignorance is a leadership style i could associate with the club. Unfortunately more through ignorance than any self belief or historic delivery

Leadership comes from the top.

It seeps into every area.

I wish the club’s staff that interact with other clubs or media folk would learn a little humility.

That would be a start.

[shedboy71]

Wow. This is an interesting thread.

Says a lot. Potential investors are shunned. Running of the club elsewhere in thread is said to be toxic.

No wonder we can't find a buyer if this is true. The longer ST involved the more it seems the lose chance of good potential owners / investors being interested

Not sure if others have been. Some points made are that its is difficult to deal with utd in anything just now. We arent the family club we built are name on to be honest. Most clubs chairmen despise us now - even ICT. did you know Yogi was illegally approached and had signed a contract only for ICT to see right through it. I posted he was coming here well before press got onto it. A total shambles.

Anyhoo we are still gelling ;)

[seenitab4]

What a load oh jobbies

[shedboy71]

Leadership comes from the top.

It seeps into every area.

I wish the club’s staff that interact with other clubs or media folk would learn a little humility.

That would be a start.


Agree - my best mate is editor of a tabloid he has sympathy for utd mainly because of rangers (he hates both the twisted sisters) but cant abide utd and their comms. Bizarrely there are posters on here who work for him and are arabs 100%

what is the starting position then what now?

[shedboy71]

What a load oh jobbies


do you have pictures? ;) just a few middle aged guys talking sh!te so you are right enough

[LSArab]

Not sure if others have been. Some points made are that its is difficult to deal with utd in anything just now. We arent the family club we built are name on to be honest. Most clubs chairmen despise us now - even ICT. did you know Yogi was illegally approached and had signed a contract only for ICT to see right through it. I posted he was coming here well before press got onto it. A total shambles.

Anyhoo we are still gelling ;)

It's a real mess and so much that needs to change. It is top to bottom job needed.

I don't think fans have done enough to indicate unhappiness with how club run. Fine coming on here and posting but rarely hear anything chanted etc against Thompson at tannadice.

There does need to be one organised group like in United for Change times

[PortugueseFrank]

It's a real mess and so much that needs to change. It is top to bottom job needed.

I don't think fans have done enough to indicate unhappiness with how club run. Fine coming on here and posting but rarely hear anything chanted etc against Thompson at tannadice.

There does need to be one organised group like in United for Change times

Most useful thing would be for fans groups to sacrifice their own personal egos for the greater good.

Organise and get one focus.

Get control of the trust board and get publicity as third biggest shareholder, resign board position if desired, call club EGM with 5% of shareholding.

But that won’t happen.

I’ve zero confidence in any fan group.

[shedboy71]

Most useful thing would be for fans groups to sacrifice their own personal egos for the greater good.

Organise and get one focus.

Get control of the trust board and get publicity as third biggest shareholder, resign board position if desired, call club EGM with 5% of shareholding.

But that won’t happen.

I’ve zero confidence in any fan group.

shame because we have some tangerine blood members of every group. Egos and arrogance are an issue

[PortugueseFrank]

shame because we have some tangerine blood members of every group. Egos and arrogance are an issue

We no doubt have big Arabs involved but most are bigger fans of themselves than United.

How many would actually sacrifce their position for the greater good?

The few that have in past are often the ones painted as the bad ones when they actually are not.

I know of one former trust chair painted as an ST apologist who spent his chairmanship trying to put together a package to get ST to walk away.

But that’s not what the egos in charge want you to know. Because it’s all about the groups and members in place and not United.

The egos are hurting United. Inside the club and amongst the fan groups.

[offshore_arab83]

We no doubt have big Arabs involved but most are bigger fans of themselves than United



Name and shame Frank, another good thread this which is all leading back to the AT thread. Good stuff!

[PortugueseFrank]

Name and shame Frank, another good thread this which is all leading back to the AT thread. Good stuff!

Id say they all are.

In particular the new groups that needlessly set themselves up at significant cost when they could easily have taken over the Trust.

No?

[shedboy71]

We no doubt have big Arabs involved but most are bigger fans of themselves than United.

How many would actually sacrifce their position for the greater good?

The few that have in past are often the ones painted as the bad ones when they actually are not.

I know of one former trust chair painted as an ST apologist who spent his chairmanship trying to put together a package to get ST to walk away.

But that’s not what the egos in charge want you to know. Because it’s all about the groups and members in place and not United.

The egos are hurting United. Inside the club and amongst the fan groups.

i know exactly the person and issue you are talking about (i think - maybe been more than one tbf :) )

[offshore_arab83]

Id say they all are.

In particular the new groups that needlessly set themselves up at significant cost when they could easily have taken over the Trust.

No?

Totally agree, fwiw i dont buy into the foundation or fans united

[PortugueseFrank]

i know exactly the person and issue you are talking about (i think - maybe been more than one tbf :) )

The other fan groups didn’t want the truth of what he tried to do to get out because it didn’t suit their narrative that the Trust were always up STs arse. But the moves were confidential so he couldn’t betray trusts of those he approached by defending himself.

So he had to sacrifice himself and take the flak by those who bought the BS. Such a shame.

I’ve zero confidence in any of the groups. Trust, Fed, DUSF, FU. None of them.

Until they merge and get organised properly there will be no progress from a fan rep perspective.

We don’t need 4 or 5 groups.

But who will say “it’s acruskky about United and not me or my group”?

Never going to happen.

WASC.

[shedboy71]

some interesting points that make sense - hope it doesnt take 7 years of this to get some better unity amongst fan groups

[PortugueseFrank]

some interesting points that make sense - hope it doesnt take 7 years of this to get some better unity amongst fan groups

It’ll never happen.

Ever. Too many egos.

Frightening stuff.

[shedboy71]

It’ll never happen.

Ever. Too many egos.

Frightening stuff.

So we need a strong rich leader with lots of money who bleeds tangerine and can turn round and say 270 fan groups i wont deal with get one and i will have on the board. easy ;)

[PortugueseFrank]

So we need a strong rich leader with lots of money who bleeds tangerine and can turn round and say 270 fan groups i wont deal with get one and i will have on the board. easy ;)

If only it was that easy!

There will be members of each fan group leaderships reading in on these threads.

I bet none of them are seriously thinking about the greater good and are more focused on how they keep their own spots.

So us ordinary fans best find other hobbies fit a Saturday just in case, as with this leadership of the club and the fan groups we will see our club diminish further and further.

[LSArab]

I personally don't care about fan reps on board as long as someone can come in and run the club well

This is the time when fans reps are important - when we need to oppose ST. Time for them to step up

[Retired Arab]

If only it was that easy!

There will be members of each fan group leaderships reading in on these threads.

I bet none of them are seriously thinking about the greater good and are more focused on how they keep their own spots.

So us ordinary fans best find other hobbies fit a Saturday just in case, as with this leadership of the club and the fan groups we will see our club diminish further and further.


Dear Franco are you saying that the new DUFC Supporters' Liaison Group is the way ahead? I don't think so. The whole situation is much more complex than you would have us all believe.

I don't buy into all this myth about individual fan egos at all. This is a complete and utter red herring that too many ordinary Arabs have swallowed hook, line and sinker. A democratic system of one member, one vote will deal with this issue very easily and matches the ArabTRUST model you propose.

It's more about the big serious players like John Bennett and Laura Conway. These people along with the likes of developers like Bruce Linton are in the background playing silly games. They're not prepared to pay the price asked by ST but are using fans to create tension so ST might panic and drop his asking price. Suits them perfectly if we're doing badly financially and head towards total chaotic state.

It's the old capitalist strategy of Divide and Rule. Both Bennett and Conway have had opportunities to improve situation at Tannadice and have failed miserably in my experience.

[eastfifearabman]

We are fortunate to have some intelligent people who post on this board so i will ask them the question.

What exactly, specifically is the alternative to ST right now?

This message board is chock full of comments saying he should leave immediately. So lets assume that is exactly what he did. He walks out the door tomorrow giving up his shares for nothing and thats it - he's gone. What is the immediate and medium term future?

Who is waiting in the wings to step in and what exactly do they offer?

I am not on here to defend ST it is abundantly clear that the last 2.7 years (since Feb 2014) he has presided over a disaster. Prior to that point he was doing a pretty decent job and I suspect was held in pretty high esteem by most within football for bringing down a crippling debt whilst putting a good team on the park. he made some judgement calls after that which have proved to be mistakes and have no doubt led us to where we are today. I don't hate him the way many on here seem to. i believe that he genuinely cares about the club and it must be horrific to feel responsible for the decline of a club he clearly cares about.

I think he has tried hard to support his managers. when he appointed RM the vast majority on here were supportive of the decision (although to read the forum now it appears most of you have forgotten that you supported that decision). He has provided RM with funds this year to put a decent team on the park and he has also secured funding to keep the club operating even though it is losing money. If he had just walked away who would have done that?

I believe that ST needs to go. BUT anyone coming in needs to have sufficient funds to cover any losses indefinitely and underwrite a transitional period to take us back to where a club of our fanbase and stature should be (realistically mid table SPL). I ask my fellow posters who is that person? I am hoping that some of you that are calling for ST to go have some information that I don't and are aware of who is ready to step into the breach. If there is nobody credible in the wings then calls for ST to go are pointless and we would be better supporting him to get us out of this mess until a suitable alternative can be identified.

thats my tuppenceworth - cue the bile.......

Careful... common sense will get you nowhere on this board. Agreed with all you are saying. But there are some that think thats enough to hang us. ST leaves tomorrow.... lights aff no United.

There needs to be a credible alternative.

[SmedDUm]

These accusations of egotism on the supporter groups are unwarranted, they smack of jealousy & only cloud issues I think.
There are a lot of well-intended Arabs within the groups, not least within the most recent DUSF.
And give ArabTrust a break, they have a lot of good people too and don't forget their excellent work for youth & community over 15 years. Don't chastise them for the lack of overthrows.