OT: Bozo's embarrassment is Britain's

[sidders]

So no one can prove that the poison used on the Skripals was manufactured by the Russian government (according to Porton Down). Jeremy Corbyn was right to say that we should hold our horses until definitive proof emerged.
All the cast-iron assurances given by May that this was a Russian State initiative (largely on Bozo's say-so) are now melted plastic. This has got to be the most embarrassing international incident since the turn of the century and Britain's word is not worth a premium bond. Watch the climb down to come in the weeks ahead by the participant countries.
Putin is a bad egg and he needs to be opposed but when you make false claims that he can so easily reject, his position is strengthened at home and abroad.
Bozo Johnson is Britain's Trump, loose gob, crazy hair and all. Does he have some secret photos of Theresa May's past as a ****star?

[Trickytreesreds]

So no one can prove that the poison used on the Skripals was manufactured by the Russian government (according to Porton Down). Jeremy Corbyn was right to say that we should hold our horses until definitive proof emerged.
All the cast-iron assurances given by May that this was a Russian State initiative (largely on Bozo's say-so) are now melted plastic. This has got to be the most embarrassing international incident since the turn of the century and Britain's word is not worth a premium bond. Watch the climb down to come in the weeks ahead by the participant countries.
Putin is a bad egg and he needs to be opposed but when you make false claims that he can so easily reject, his position is strengthened at home and abroad.
Bozo Johnson is Britain's Trump, loose gob, crazy hair and all. Does he have some secret photos of Theresa May's past as a ****star?

I hope he's got some of Corbyn in bed with Putin, Fernandez, Chavez, Adams, Haniya, Khamenai.
Got to be better than his claim to fame, in bed with Abbott (puke)

[sidders]

I hope he's got some of Corbyn in bed with Putin, Fernandez, Chavez, Adams, Haniya, Khamenai.
Got to be better than his claim to fame, in bed with Abbott (puke)

So good to see that your comments are about the real substance of the fred, Tricky. If you were playing darts, your arrows would have landed in the urinals next door.

[upthemaggies]

Until now, I've been a supporter of the BBC. It's always had its' faults, of course, but their news coverage over the past month has been nothing short of disgraceful. "Newsnight" didn't even mention the Porton Down interview last night. You expect the tabloids to be partizan, but for the BBC to be such a blatant tool of propaganda is frightening.

[Old_pie]

Now Sidders, what Porton Down have said is that they cannot find any atoms stamped with сделано в россии for a product invented by and only made in Russia.

Please read the reports more carefully then you might be considered for an apprentice role of Dr Watson but then whilst spelling and grammar have been your strong points I'm afraid logic isn't.

Look at the evidence (means), look at the motives, look at the opportunities.

[JoePass]

So no one can prove that the poison used on the Skripals was manufactured by the Russian government (according to Porton Down). Jeremy Corbyn was right to say that we should hold our horses until definitive proof emerged.
All the cast-iron assurances given by May that this was a Russian State initiative (largely on Bozo's say-so) are now melted plastic. This has got to be the most embarrassing international incident since the turn of the century and Britain's word is not worth a premium bond. Watch the climb down to come in the weeks ahead by the participant countries.
Putin is a bad egg and he needs to be opposed but when you make false claims that he can so easily reject, his position is strengthened at home and abroad.
Bozo Johnson is Britain's Trump, loose gob, crazy hair and all. Does he have some secret photos of Theresa May's past as a ****star?

I am sure Eddie Izzard will sort it all out. The heat is off Jew hating Labour Party for a couple of hours.

[BigFatPie]

Russia almost certainly did it, but Johnson shouldn’t have said this was confirmed when it clearly wasn’t.

The man is a clown and a liar, I thought this may be one issue we could support this bunch of incompetent buffoons on but clearly not.

[Trickytreesreds]

So good to see that your comments are about the real substance of the fred, Tricky. If you were playing darts, your arrows would have landed in the urinals next door.

1. do you live in a pub? Dart room/urinals? Weird to say the least.
2. In relation your thread. Your assassination attempt on anyone, when your hero is a snake in the grass is very laughable.
Still, we can look forward to Corbyns Labour party annual event soon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0ZJY5I-c2c

Has many problems- economics/social/and jew

[BigFatPie]

1. do you live in a pub? Dart room/urinals? Weird to say the least.
2. In relation your thread. Your assassination attempt on anyone, when your hero is a snake in the grass is very laughable.
Still, we can look forward to Corbyns Labour party annual event soon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0ZJY5I-c2c

Has many problems- economics/social/and jew

You do realise that most of this Corbyn hating Jews stuff is being dredged up by people and newspapers who do have an actual genuine history of supporting Nazis and hating Jews?

[Trickytreesreds]

You do realise that most of this Corbyn hating Jews stuff is being dredged up by people and newspapers who do have an actual genuine history of supporting Nazis and hating Jews?

Oh BFP, I know that no politician is innocent, nor party.
Yet I piss my pants at Labours denials. Corbyn is a big friend of HAMAS and Iran. In case you haven't noticed, they are Israels mortal enemies. Is it any surprise that the Labour party is riddled with antisemitism?
Are you denying it isn't going on, or do the quotes have to fly out?
Same as the race hatred. How can you have a shadow home secretary, or is so obviously a white hating racist unchallenged?

Funny as **** how Labour supporters deny everything, r do an ostrich impression. Read the Daily Mirrors letters pages. It's hilarious.

[Elite_Pie]

2. In relation your thread. Your assassination attempt on anyone, when your hero is a snake in the grass is very laughable.
Still, we can look forward to Corbyns Labour party annual event soon.


"In relation to your thread"??? What a load of cr@p. Your replies have absolutely no relevance to the thread at all. What the f**k has Corbyn or the Labour party got to do with Boris Johnson's handling of this issue?

[BigFatPie]

Oh BFP, I know that no politician is innocent, nor party.
Yet I piss my pants at Labours denials. Corbyn is a big friend of HAMAS and Iran. In case you haven't noticed, they are Israels mortal enemies. Is it any surprise that the Labour party is riddled with antisemitism?
Are you denying it isn't going on, or do the quotes have to fly out?
Same as the race hatred. How can you have a shadow home secretary, or is so obviously a white hating racist unchallenged?

Funny as **** how Labour supporters deny everything, r do an ostrich impression. Read the Daily Mirrors letters pages. It's hilarious.

Of course the Left has a problem with anti-semitism. Many on that side wrongly see Jews as powerful and rich and through Israel, as oppressors of the powerless and poor.

Only a complete arsehole refuses to admit though that vested interests on the Right are using this as an excuse for a pop at Corbyn when the reality is they couldn’t give a monkeys about anti semitism or any other sort of racism.

Anyway, your opinion on Johnson and Russia wouid be most welcome.

[sidders]

Now Sidders, what Porton Down have said is that they cannot find any atoms stamped with сделано в россии for a product invented by and only made in Russia.

Please read the reports more carefully then you might be considered for an apprentice role of Dr Watson but then whilst spelling and grammar have been your strong points I'm afraid logic isn't.

Look at the evidence (means), look at the motives, look at the opportunities.

Nothing whatever wrong with my logic. Motives and opportunities had Russians a-plenty, I'll give you that. Evidence? no? Apparently, it is far from established that the nerve agent could only have been formed in Russia with the state's blessing.
Johnson should have seen that definite proof would never be forthcoming.
A teacher's wallet was stolen from the jacket he left on his chair. The boy who sat on the front row had twice been up on theft charges. To his protestations he was searched, but no wallet was found. The boy was sent home and told he can never return to school unless he appears with the wallet and admits the crime.
Later that day, the teacher found the wallet in his car. He had put it in his jacket pocket when getting out of the car but then it dropped out behind the seat as he left the car. This is a true story and a perfect parable.

[sidders]

Until now, I've been a supporter of the BBC. It's always had its' faults, of course, but their news coverage over the past month has been nothing short of disgraceful. "Newsnight" didn't even mention the Porton Down interview last night. You expect the tabloids to be partizan, but for the BBC to be such a blatant tool of propaganda is frightening.

Press releases have to be sanctioned and then prepared by a production team when a serious legal challenge might result. In what way is the BBC guilty on this occasion of 'blatant propaganda', UTM?

[sidders]

Oh BFP, I know that no politician is innocent, nor party.
Yet I piss my pants at Labours denials. Corbyn is a big friend of HAMAS and Iran. In case you haven't noticed, they are Israels mortal enemies. Is it any surprise that the Labour party is riddled with antisemitism?
Are you denying it isn't going on, or do the quotes have to fly out?
Same as the race hatred. How can you have a shadow home secretary, or is so obviously a white hating racist unchallenged?

Funny as **** how Labour supporters deny everything, r do an ostrich impression. Read the Daily Mirrors letters pages. It's hilarious.

In case you didn't notice, they have admitted there is a problem. The problem is that people conflate Labour's slating of Israeli policy against Palestine with anti-semitism when it is quite separate. Naom Chomsky, one of the world's leading Jewish intellectuals, says of Corbyn that he is the least racist politician he knows.
I am no Corbyn fan and dearly wish he wasn't the Labour leader, but on sincerity and conscience he is way ahead of anything the Tories have on offer.

[Bohinen]

Until now, I've been a supporter of the BBC. It's always had its' faults, of course, but their news coverage over the past month has been nothing short of disgraceful. "Newsnight" didn't even mention the Porton Down interview last night. You expect the tabloids to be partizan, but for the BBC to be such a blatant tool of propaganda is frightening.

They are a government news agency, utm. They always back the government of the day, be it Labour or Conservative. Blair got a very easy ride, especially on Iraq but things seem to have got worse. They treat Jeremy Corbyn with the same contempt Soccerman would.

[Bohinen]

I am no Corbyn fan and dearly wish he wasn't the Labour leader

Sid and Soccerman find some common ground, at last.

[i961pie]

"In relation to your thread"??? What a load of cr@p. Your replies have absolutely no relevance to the thread at all. What the f**k has Corbyn or the Labour party got to do with Boris Johnson's handling of this issue?

I think you will find EP that if a thread started about how crap Corbyn and the Labour party were on some issue there would be many replies having a go at May and the goverment. That is how these threads always go, so the same question could be asked.

[i961pie]

I am no Corbyn fan and dearly wish he wasn't the Labour leader, but on sincerity and conscience he is way ahead of anything the Tories have on offer.

Sincerity and conscience?? you my friend are 'avin a laff'. Is this the same Jeremy Corbyn who as slated and wanted to leave the EU all of his political life but now sees an opportunity for himself so now he cosies up to them?

[seriouspie]

Russia almost certainly did it, but Johnson shouldn’t have said this was confirmed when it clearly wasn’t.

The man is a clown and a liar, I thought this may be one issue we could support this bunch of incompetent buffoons on but clearly not.

Well wait until the UN Security Council meet today, you just might just have to change your mind again. It appears M16 even know which laboratory in Russia ( and can forensically prove it) this obnoxious poison was produced. However then again, indicative of the slobs that now run the Labour party and their motley band of disciples, you have little idea of much at all except slagging off the Conservative party, very often (like now) without careful considerations.

[Old_pie]

Well wait until the UN Security Council meet today, you just might just have to change your mind again. It appears M16 even know which laboratory in Russia ( and can forensically prove it) this obnoxious poison was produced. However then again, indicative of the slobs that now run the Labour party and their motley band of disciples, you have little idea of much at all except slagging off the Conservative party, very often (like now) without careful considerations.

We really should play fair and give all the information to Russia for their comment. Of course we'll have to divulge how we know what we know. And of course their embassy staff should have the right to interview Yulia, in private to hear her side of the story. Whilst we're at it they should have a tour around Porton Down and MI6. I'm sure British fairness would prevail and they will confess fully once the facts are out there. That'll please Sidders et alia.

Meanwhile the Norks are within months of blasting Britain into oblivion. Hope the Polaris subs are all at the ready.

[BigFatPie]

Well wait until the UN Security Council meet today, you just might just have to change your mind again. It appears M16 even know which laboratory in Russia ( and can forensically prove it) this obnoxious poison was produced. However then again, indicative of the slobs that now run the Labour party and their motley band of disciples, you have little idea of much at all except slagging off the Conservative party, very often (like now) without careful considerations.

Which bit of “Russia almost certainly did it” did your nurse not read to you?

The point is Johnson lied about Porton Down confirming that Russia was behind it when they had made it clear they were in no position to do so.

The ironic thing is that the only person who appears to have shown any “careful consideration” on this issue, (and again I am no fan of the bloke), is Corbyn.

[seriouspie]

Which bit of “Russia almost certainly did it” did your nurse not read to you?

The point is Johnson lied about Porton Down confirming that Russia was behind it when they had made it clear they were in no position to do so.

The ironic thing is that the only person who appears to have shown any “careful consideration” on this issue, (and again I am no fan of the bloke), is Corbyn.

No Ignor .... you listen.

Porton Down have said they know where the Lab is that produced that particular batch of poison.

So Boris is correct ..... the Russians made it. Who PLACED IT OVER HERE is still being investigated.

Anyway you thick berk .... you won't understand so go and draw your Giro ..... am I correct?

[upthemaggies]

No Ignor .... you listen.

Porton Down have said they know where the Lab is that produced that particular batch of poison.


They haven't said anything of the sort, that is 100% wrong.

[upthemaggies]

It is a simple truth that Russia is not the only state that could have made the nerve agent: dozens of them could. It could also have been made by many non-state actors.

Motorola sales agent Gary Aitkenhead – inexplicably since January, Chief Executive of Porton Down chemical weapons establishment – said in his Sky interview that “probably” only a state actor could create the nerve agent. That is to admit the possibility that a non state actor could. David Collum, Professor of Organo-Chemistry at Cornell University, infinitely more qualified than a Motorola salesman, has stated that his senior students could do it.
The state and corporate media has not asked Prof. Collum nor any of the Professors of Organic Chemistry in the UK. There simply is no basic investigative journalism happening around this case.

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/04/knobs-and-knockers/

He goes on to question the door knob theory.

[BigFatPie]

They haven't said anything of the sort, that is 100% wrong.

That’s the last you’ll see of him for a bit.

[seriouspie]

It is a simple truth that Russia is not the only state that could have made the nerve agent: dozens of them could. It could also have been made by many non-state actors.

Motorola sales agent Gary Aitkenhead – inexplicably since January, Chief Executive of Porton Down chemical weapons establishment – said in his Sky interview that “probably” only a state actor could create the nerve agent. That is to admit the possibility that a non state actor could. David Collum, Professor of Organo-Chemistry at Cornell University, infinitely more qualified than a Motorola salesman, has stated that his senior students could do it.
The state and corporate media has not asked Prof. Collum nor any of the Professors of Organic Chemistry in the UK. There simply is no basic investigative journalism happening around this case.

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/04/knobs-and-knockers/

He goes on to question the door knob theory.

I quoted Malcolm Rifkind on BBC News last night.

As I said to Fatboy, lets wait for the UN response. I'm sure any evidence discussed or shown at this level will be far above what amateur views you or I have on the subject. Personally if any U Turn is made ..... then I'll accept it, likewise I'll accept things if Russia are still presumed guilty of producing the stuff.

That's democracy isn't it - accepting a majority decision and being positive ...... a lesson the spineless Remainers should heed.

[adlestropred]

Oh BFP, I know that no politician is innocent, nor party.
Yet I piss my pants at Labours denials. Corbyn is a big friend of HAMAS and Iran. In case you haven't noticed, they are Israels mortal enemies. Is it any surprise that the Labour party is riddled with antisemitism?
Are you denying it isn't going on, or do the quotes have to fly out?
Same as the race hatred. How can you have a shadow home secretary, or is so obviously a white hating racist unchallenged?



Funny as **** how Labour supporters deny everything, r do an ostrich impression. Read the Daily Mirrors letters pages. It's hilarious.

Many Jews around the world do not support Israel & what it's doing to the Palestinian's. It's a painful reminder of what happened to them in the Holocaust - Apartheid & ethnic cleansing all rolled together into one.

[upthemaggies]

I quoted Malcolm Rifkind on BBC News last night..

Malcolm Rifkind is not an employee of Porton Down, he's a Tory invited onto the programme to defend Boris Johnson. If he did say what you quoted, then he is also lying.

Porton Down were put under pressure by the government to say that it was developed in Russia but refused to do this. The compromise was to say that it was "OF A TYPE developed by Russia" - as quoted by Theresa May, Boris Johnson and various other official statements, which is of course meaningless, it would be equally correct to say that it is "OF A TYPE developed by Porton Down" (who have effectively admitted to having made it) or "OF A TYPE developed by Iran" (who did successfully manufacture it under the supervision of the OPCW).

[MagpieTony]

Surely, in a case like this, the onus of proof is on the accuser to bring substantive evidence against the accused. Russia have said they did not do it. It is up to the UK to actually PROVE otherwise or apologise regardless of who else jumps on the bandwagon. The Uk has not even followed international protocol, changes its story with regularity and is beginning to look rather desperate. It is more important to discover the truth than protect treachery, though some on here would not understand that.

[seriouspie]

Surely, in a case like this, the onus of proof is on the accuser to bring substantive evidence against the accused. Russia have said they did not do it. It is up to the UK to actually PROVE otherwise or apologise regardless of who else jumps on the bandwagon. The Uk has not even followed international protocol, changes its story with regularity and is beginning to look rather desperate. It is more important to discover the truth than protect treachery, though some on here would not understand that.

I'll accept this - but still go with the UN's decision on whatever. The evidence they see is far more detailed than I or any other bloke on here would see or hear.

[BigFatPie]

I'll accept this - but still go with the UN's decision on whatever. The evidence they see is far more detailed than I or any other bloke on here would see or hear.

So you accept Johnson shouldn’t have gone opening his fat mouth before being in all the possession of all the facts?

Just because you’re a Tory, you can criticise other Tories every now and again.

[seriouspie]

So you accept Johnson shouldn’t have gone opening his fat mouth before being in all the possession of all the facts?

Just because you’re a Tory, you can criticise other Tories every now and again.

He could have well been telling the truth to the extent of what he knew. It's just been given out on BBC News by a chemical nerve agent expert that many things have yet to come out. Yes, Boris the PM and every man jack in the Conservative party could have got it wrong but the countries backing our stance are still steadfast. If Boris is proved wrong he should apologise along with the rest of them. I would also apologise. Nothing wrong in that .... it's the honourable thing to admit a mistake.

Criticising Tories? I've done it all my adult life. Some of the very worst being "Yuppie" Cameron and the rumoured queer Ted Heath.

For the Socialists I remember John Smith being a straight sort of bloke and to be honest I voted Labour and Blair (until I rumbled him) I think Milliband was weak (Ed) and his brother would have made a better leader. The finest Commons speech I've heard was Hilary Benn stating his case for Trident which actually got applause from both sides of the house. I think nobody could have endured more flak than TM, but good luck to her for winning through. There are some good decent MP's on both sides as well but I'm sorry to say that your man Corbyn is an absolute turd - and his mates. In my opinion he's finished - just a hopeless ideologist along with McDonnell destined to always be a protester never a statesman.

[tarquinbeech]

This whole thing smacks of the same corner that Obama found himself in over the "red line" incident regarding Syria and Sarin gas.

He publicly states that the use of Sarin would mean him authorising strikes against pro~government forces, a watered~down version of Sarin was used (similar to a watered~down version of Novichok in Salisbury).....authorises battle plans to be readied before someone politely whispers in his lughole....the Brits via Porton Down....that this grade of Sarin did not match the actual Syrian grade that they had in their vaults "but was of a similar type"....ooops

Backdoor channels to Putin are used to get them to verify that Assad did not do the deed....did he or not, nobody really knows...but a major escalation is avoided .....later Turkey~backed anti~government leaders were intercepted at the border actually carrying Sarin on them!!....phew.

The truth is that nobody really knows who did it or why....it looks like a botched attempt using an inferior grade of Russian~like nerve gas and now everyone needs to calm down and take one step backwards

[tarquinbeech]

This whole thing smacks of the same corner that Obama found himself in over the "red line" incident regarding Syria and Sarin gas.

He publicly states that the use of Sarin would mean him authorising strikes against pro~government forces, a watered~down version of Sarin was used (similar to a watered~down version of Novichok in Salisbury).....authorises battle plans to be readied before someone politely whispers in his lughole....the Brits via Porton Down....that this grade of Sarin did not match the actual Syrian grade that they had in their vaults "but was of a similar type"....ooops

Backdoor channels to Putin are used to get them to verify that Assad did not do the deed....did he or not, nobody really knows...but a major escalation is avoided .....later Turkey~backed anti~government leaders were intercepted at the border actually carrying Sarin on them!!....phew.

The truth is that nobody really knows who did it or why....it looks like a botched attempt using an inferior grade of Russian~like nerve gas and now everyone needs to calm down and take one step backwards

Extract ...Obama’s change of mind had its origins at Porton Down, the defence laboratory in Wiltshire. British intelligence had obtained a sample of the sarin used in the 21 August attack and analysis demonstrated that the gas used didn’t match the batches known to exist in the Syrian army’s chemical weapons arsenal.

https://www.lrb.co.uk/v36/n08/seymour-m-hersh/the-red-line-and-the-rat-line

[MagpieTony]

He could have well been telling the truth to the extent of what he knew. It's just been given out on BBC News by a chemical nerve agent expert that many things have yet to come out. Yes, Boris the PM and every man jack in the Conservative party could have got it wrong but the countries backing our stance are still steadfast. If Boris is proved wrong he should apologise along with the rest of them. I would also apologise. Nothing wrong in that .... it's the honourable thing to admit a mistake.



Many of the Countries backing Britain would still back them even if it was proved a lie, such is their desire to demonise Russia and promote it to enemy status. Certainly the EU is no friend of Russia.

[jackal2]

So no one can prove that the poison used on the Skripals was manufactured by the Russian government (according to Porton Down). Jeremy Corbyn was right to say that we should hold our horses until definitive proof emerged.
All the cast-iron assurances given by May that this was a Russian State initiative (largely on Bozo's say-so) are now melted plastic. This has got to be the most embarrassing international incident since the turn of the century and Britain's word is not worth a premium bond. Watch the climb down to come in the weeks ahead by the participant countries.
Putin is a bad egg and he needs to be opposed but when you make false claims that he can so easily reject, his position is strengthened at home and abroad.
Bozo Johnson is Britain's Trump, loose gob, crazy hair and all. Does he have some secret photos of Theresa May's past as a ****star?

Like all of us, I have no more knowledge about this incident than what I've been told by the media, but I find it bizarre to the point of borderline unbelievable that Russia would decide to kill an ex-spy who is essentially a spent force in intelligence terms, using a method akin to leaving a piece of string or muddy footprints between Salisbury and the Kremlin, three months before hosting a sporting event in which the country has invested billions for the purpose of enhancing its credibility, legitimacy and stature on the world stage.

The counter to that argument is that Russia is effectively run by gangsters who have little or no regard for international rule of law, whose top brass are perhaps addicted to their old KGB ways, and who may be engaging in some sort of double or triple bluff to increase confusion and undermine the trust of westerners in what they see and hear and are told to believe, but overall this incident surely does far more strategic damage to Russia's interests (especially now) than any potential gain in terms of intimidating defectors, assisting with elections, fermenting a propaganda war, or establishing dominance in the international power game.

[tarquinbeech]

Like all of us, I have no more knowledge about this incident than what I've been told by the media, but I find it bizarre to the point of borderline unbelievable that Russia would decide to kill an ex-spy who is essentially a spent force in intelligence terms, using a method akin to leaving a piece of string or muddy footprints between Salisbury and the Kremlin, three months before hosting a sporting event in which the country has invested billions for the purpose of enhancing its credibility, legitimacy and stature on the world stage.

The counter to that argument is that Russia is effectively run by gangsters who have little or no regard for international rule of law, whose top brass are perhaps addicted to their old KGB ways, and who may be engaging in some sort of double or triple bluff to increase confusion and undermine the trust of westerners in what they see and hear and are told to believe, but overall this incident surely does far more strategic damage to Russia's interests (especially now) than any potential gain in terms of intimidating defectors, assisting with elections, fermenting a propaganda war, or establishing dominance in the international power game.

Precisely.....over 100 members of the public "might have been in contact" with this strain of whatever.....government advice is "go home and wash your clothes".....is someone having a laugh?......the policeman has apparently fully recovered.....the daughter of Skripal that was apparently having a personal interview with the Grim Reaper has now made a "miraculous recovery thanks to a great medical team", sat up in bed using top~up phone credits to have a natter to her sister in Russia!!

This is either the worst attempted assassination in the history of Le Carre spy novels, leaving the maximum of clues behind to frame Putin...or someone is pulling my plonker.

Meanwhile the Guardian today is running an excellent expose on who did what, to whom, in the Ukranian elections....some serious money changed hands using offshore tax havens.....the US had a big part to play in this, trying to get Ukraine to swing closer towards NATO and the EU and away from Russia.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/apr/05/ex-trump-aide-paul-manafort-approved-black-ops-to-help-ukraine-president

These are dark and dangerous days....believe nothing, question everything

[MagpieTony]

These are dark and dangerous days....believe nothing, question everything

Our problem is that in the MSM we do not have a News source that we can trust to bring us the bare faced truth. Our News agencies are controlled by outside sources and are allowed only to present the controlled narrative they are given. Political agendas and spin are always followed to present the populous with an already contrived rendering of how events should be interpreted rather than just what actually happened. Take the shooting in America recently at the YouTube offices. Reported, but no where near the coverage of other shootings. It did not fit with the News narrative and political agenda that was being covered. The shooter was Iranian, vegan and an animal rights activist. We see this throughout the MSM and it is more about manipulation than it is reporting. Anyone who takes the MSM at face value is either extremely naive, lazy or just plain stupid. Now they are trying to control the internet too. YouTube, Twitter and Facebook trying, in conjunction with the powers that be, to shut down reporting and ideas which go against the controlled narrative. They use the broad sweeping brush of 'hate speech' or, the new kid on the block 'conspiracy theory' as justification. We are seeing this more and more. Before anyone says anything, I know the internet is used for unsavoury purposes and needs to be regulated. However, when that regulation is used to close down alternative news and opinions you are on very dodgy ground. who draws the line? I watched the fim 1984 the other day, first time I have seen it. Very insightful.

[BigFatPie]

Very amusing how all the “believe nothing” types on here are always the ones who fall for whatever bullshi!t merchant that best backs up their prejudices.

[upthemaggies]

I guess we now have proof that Russian people aren't really human like us. They can apparently function perfectly normal for up to 4 hours after exposure to this substance, whereas us proper English types - like the Great British booby - fall ill straight away but make a much faster recovery.

And then we have somebody carrying around a nerve agent "Ten times more deadly thab VX" that "could have killed half of Salisbury" who wasn't spotted driving or walking around in a protective suit in broad daylight. You've got to assume he was in a protective suit but I guess it must have doubled up as an invisibility suit because a month on there is still no manhunt, no suspect. Thousands of hours of CCTV footage and nothing, not a single frame.

[dam617]

So no one can prove that the poison used on the Skripals was manufactured by the Russian government (according to Porton Down). Jeremy Corbyn was right to say that we should hold our horses until definitive proof emerged.
All the cast-iron assurances given by May that this was a Russian State initiative (largely on Bozo's say-so) are now melted plastic. This has got to be the most embarrassing international incident since the turn of the century and Britain's word is not worth a premium bond. Watch the climb down to come in the weeks ahead by the participant countries.
Putin is a bad egg and he needs to be opposed but when you make false claims that he can so easily reject, his position is strengthened at home and abroad.
Bozo Johnson is Britain's Trump, loose gob, crazy hair and all. Does he have some secret photos of Theresa May's past as a ****star?

I agree with you.
This whole episode is as dodgy as Sepp Blatter's tax returns and 'almost certainly' ain't good enough.
Decades ago the Russians were using James Bond type covert weapons built into umbrellas and we are supposed to believe this cr@p?
Do SMERSH go with the lowest bidder now?

If the Phantom Poisoner had dropped a fag end on the floor or parked on double yellows he'd have been collared before you could say 'dodgy dossier'.

[dam617]

Well wait until the UN Security Council meet today, you just might just have to change your mind again. It appears M16 even know which laboratory in Russia ( and can forensically prove it) this obnoxious poison was produced. However then again, indicative of the slobs that now run the Labour party and their motley band of disciples, you have little idea of much at all except slagging off the Conservative party, very often (like now) without careful considerations.

'it appears' MI6 know which laboratory it came from?
Again 'it appears' ain't good enough. There are plenty of handguns in the hands of scum 'gangstas' in London and if by a fluke the police find the gun that was used in the drive-by last week - and it turns out to be a Tokarev, built in Russia - will it be them too?

[BigFatPie]

'it appears' MI6 know which laboratory it came from?
Again 'it appears' ain't good enough. There are plenty of handguns in the hands of scum 'gangstas' in London and if by a fluke the police find the gun that was used in the drive-by last week - and it turns out to be a Tokarev, built in Russia - will it be them too?

Yeah that’s a superb analogy.

Have you been drinking nerve agent again?

[MagpieTony]

Yeah that’s a superb analogy.

Have you been drinking nerve agent again?

Well if it's Russian military grade, he'll be fine.

[tarquinbeech]

Yeah that’s a superb analogy.

Have you been drinking nerve agent again?

Just out of curiosity....have you actually got anything constructive to add to this conversation?

At times you act like the annoying kid in the classroom that refuses to recite his Latin phrases with the rest, merely poking fun at everyone else whilst giggling like a demented lunatic.

Go and stand in the corner and face the wall.....again

[BigFatPie]

Just out of curiosity....have you actually got anything constructive to add to this conversation?

At times you act like the annoying kid in the classroom that refuses to recite his Latin phrases with the rest, merely poking fun at everyone else whilst giggling like a demented lunatic.

Go and stand in the corner and face the wall.....again

I could post a picture of a lump of dog **** and it would be an upgrade on some of this thread.

That gun analogy was so inane, i thought you must have written it.

[dam617]

Yeah that’s a superb analogy.

Have you been drinking nerve agent again?

I honestly don't give a **** what you think - you're the ultimate trolling account of someone else on here, I'm almost certain and I'm only replying to get my post count to 1000.
Cheers.

[Elite_Pie]

I honestly don't give a **** what you think - you're the ultimate trolling account of someone else on here, I'm almost certain and I'm only replying to get my post count to 1000.
Cheers.

From some of your previous posts, I suspect you are referring to me as the "ultimate trolling account of someone else on here". If I've got it wrong please tell me. I can only repeat what I've said many times before - I've only ever posted on here under one username, and have always found duplicate accounts both pathetic and laughable. It's up to you if you believe that, but it's the honest truth.

[tarquinbeech]

From some of your previous posts, I suspect you are referring to me as the "ultimate trolling account of someone else on here". If I've got it wrong please tell me. I can only repeat what I've said many times before - I've only ever posted on here under one username, and have always found duplicate accounts both pathetic and laughable. It's up to you if you believe that, but it's the honest truth.

Actually Snobbers, I believe you......nobody, even a secondary trolling account, speaks as much garbage as you!!

Just kidding.....you are apparently the "most popular poster on here" according to the post you addressed to Swale one night when he was slapping your wrist.....errr....maybe it was "unpopular"?......Alzeimers is kicking in again...remind us what you said please.

You do make me chuckle.

To everyone else....Elite is too much of a tight~arse to attribute any of his mindless drivel to a 2nd account, I promise you....he wants every single post on his true Snobbers account....20,870.....doff your caps and tug your forelock

[dam617]

Well if it's Russian military grade, he'll be fine.

Got to 'Soccerman LOL' at this...........

Worst
Nerve Agent
Ever.

[dam617]

From some of your previous posts, I suspect you are referring to me as the "ultimate trolling account of someone else on here". If I've got it wrong please tell me. I can only repeat what I've said many times before - I've only ever posted on here under one username, and have always found duplicate accounts both pathetic and laughable. It's up to you if you believe that, but it's the honest truth.

Can we have quiet at the back please?

[the_anticlough]

Worst
Nerve Agent
Ever.

Well, they definitely gave AH the runaround in the transfer window, lead him on big time.
It's Novijoke because now we're struggling to make it.

[Trickytreesreds]

I think Vauxhall are on to a winner here, in todays low emissions frenzy.

Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the vauxhall "Novachok" relaunch.
Much safer than a German diesel.

[BigFatPie]

Got to 'Soccerman LOL' at this...........

Worst
Nerve Agent
Ever.

Tony’s gag would be really funny if there was such a thing as “military grade”.

It’s a meaningless term so it’s not.

[Elite_Pie]

Can we have quiet at the back please?

As I suspected - happy to make sly digs, but not man enough to name names!