The Terrace:

[countygump]

Was on FaceAche earlier if anyone fancies a listen:

https://www.facebook.com/BBCNottinghamSport/videos/1349194995249940/?notif_id=1575656176036367&notif_t=live_video_explicit

[Glad2BeAPie]

He's happy with the defence and midfield, that statement says it all

[HAPPYMAGPIEHAPPY]

He's happy with the defence and midfield, that statement says it all

And apparently under no pressure from the owners, no wonder he sits on the bench with his hands in his pockets !

[Freeman25]

Said basically the exact same thing Steve Chettle did to Alan Hardy about Sam Osbourne too, it's almost like people that watch him train all week might be a better judge of talent than people that don't...

[KCNotts]

Said basically the exact same thing Steve Chettle did to Alan Hardy about Sam Osbourne too, it's almost like people that watch him train all week might be a better judge of talent than people that don't...

Maybe...but all I can go on is what I've seen of him play. And in those few appearances he has shown enough heart, drive and creativity to merit more game time. Is he a worse option than Shields?

[countygump]

Ardley also said 'We're too far behind the leaders now and auto promotion is becoming unlikely'.'Best we can hope for is P/O's'.

Did we know that anyway? Or is it too early in the season to be writing us off? Are we even bothered anymore?

[TSANHO]

It is becoming increasingly frustrating to hear the manager not acknowledging the clear problems in his own tactics and style of play. Of course, behind closed doors it may be another matter as he has a responsibility to back his players in public. To suggest making automatic promotion is too defeatist in my opinion, it gives the players an excuse almost....as if it doesn't appear they are too mentally fragile already.

On Osbourne, sure, he showed glimpses of what he may one day be able to produce consistently but the games I've seen him in he has looked far too lightweight and ineffective. However, as a substitute he should be getting much more opportunities than he is getting.

I said give the manager at least until Christmas, but I'm getting increasingly bored and dismayed by his lack of drive, tactical nous and stubbornness.

[freemuzzy]

Have to love his dismissal of the fact our record without Doyle in the team is far superior to when he is (over a point more on average gained).

Seems the stats only matter when it suits!

[freemuzzy]

Said basically the exact same thing Steve Chettle did to Alan Hardy about Sam Osbourne too, it's almost like people that watch him train all week might be a better judge of talent than people that don't...

He hardly said anything ground-breaking, just said he’s young and felt Enzio, Shields, Booty and OB were better options. Again, the stats would dispute this. He showed in his apps earlier this year he’s direct, skilful and always willing to have a shot from long range.

At the very least, he could provide a spark in the last 10/15 mins of games like today when it’s incredibly static (switching Booty inside). But that’d mean subbing Rose or Doyle off and switching from the subs everyone can see coming before kick-off...

[gozzie321]

We have become to predictable, and Ardley seems to stubborn to alter his style of play. Not anti Ardley but we all know we play the same way. Pass the ball backwards and sideways and by the time we go forwards we have 2 players facing 5 defenders.

[Warnocks Legends]

Every team in this league has worked us out. Then again it isn't difficult, same 11 no matter how poor they play, same sub who never gets to start. All our promising youngsters left to rot in reserves. Same post match drivel about tactics and training. Same excuses about them not following said tactics. Same boring, negative sideways , backwards passing. Some dinosaurs wading through deep treacle in midfield. I could go on and on... Much like Ardley...although personally I wish he wouldn't go on!!! Get rid before another 1,000 is wiped off the dwindling dis-engaged crowds.

[Freeman25]

He hardly said anything ground-breaking, just said he’s young and felt Enzio, Shields, Booty and OB were better options. Again, the stats would dispute this. He showed in his apps earlier this year he’s direct, skilful and always willing to have a shot from long range.

At the very least, he could provide a spark in the last 10/15 mins of games like today when it’s incredibly static (switching Booty inside). But that’d mean subbing Rose or Doyle off and switching from the subs everyone can see coming before kick-off...

He also said "in training he gets a lot more wrong than the other players" which is almost exactly what Chettle told Alan Hardy when I was sat in front of them at an Ilkeston game last season so clearly multiple managers haven't rated him based on how he trains and whilst looking like he wasn't afraid to take a shot on and having some attempts at taking on defenders with mixed success he didn't exactly light up the league when he had a short stint in the team early in the season and he looked awful at Dover (fairly sure, could have been a different away game).

I do agree having him as an option off the bench would at least be useful but Ardley's substitutions seem to be scripted. The fact he won't even put Crawford on the bench when he only really has two central midfielders in the team says all you need to know about him but he likewise must be awful in training

[Disturbed]

He also said "in training he gets a lot more wrong than the other players" which is almost exactly what Chettle told Alan Hardy when I was sat in front of them at an Ilkeston game last season so clearly multiple managers haven't rated him based on how he trains and whilst looking like he wasn't afraid to take a shot on and having some attempts at taking on defenders with mixed success he didn't exactly light up the league when he had a short stint in the team early in the season and he looked awful at Dover (fairly sure, could have been a different away game).

I do agree having him as an option off the bench would at least be useful but Ardley's substitutions seem to be scripted. The fact he won't even put Crawford on the bench when he only really has two central midfielders in the team says all you need to know about him but he likewise must be awful in training

Maybe he gets more wrong in training as he tries twice as more things than others? Just putting that theory out there.

And again, putting across another angle, just maybe the players that are not selected simply can not be arsed to try in training as they know that there is no chance of being selected at all and even if there was a place up for grabs, then Ardley would get a loan player in to cover, so what is the point? Might as well take the money, not put yourself at risk of injury and wait till the contract is up and then move on.

[freemuzzy]

Maybe he gets more wrong in training as he tries twice as more things than others? Just putting that theory out there.

And again, putting across another angle, just maybe the players that are not selected simply can not be arsed to try in training as they know that there is no chance of being selected at all and even if there was a place up for grabs, then Ardley would get a loan player in to cover, so what is the point? Might as well take the money, not put yourself at risk of injury and wait till the contract is up and then move on.

Yeah, can’t be great for morale when there’s such a clear divide between those who’ll play no matter what (as we’ve now emphatically seen) and those who’ll never be given a proper shot.

Stall said on radio pre-game that for Osborne it’ll take an injury/suspension etc to get his chance and when that comes he’s got to take it. Well, to my mind he did that when he scored a brilliant winner at Boreham Wood. But Doyle came back from his self-enforced ban, walked back in and lo and behold the results have nosedived. Osborne’s not even been on the pitch since early October.

Likewise, bit of an elephant in the room but our defence was statistically much more solid when Turner was out, with Bakayogo at LB and McCrory centre back. Results picked up.

Another example is Dennis vs Thomas. Dennis had to score back to back goals off the bench to finally get a start, then the first game he didn’t score, he was dropped next time around. Thomas goes a run of four without scoring, missed an open goal at Northampton, Dennis scores in his usual 10 minute cameo but Thomas keeps his place. So frustrating as for a man who’s supposedly so big on stats, Ardley’s ignoring what’s statistically proven to get his favourites in. He landed on a good team and has chosen to ignore it. And it’ll cost us any shot of promotion and, hopefully, his job.

[Disturbed]

Yeah, can’t be great for morale when there’s such a clear divide between those who’ll play no matter what (as we’ve now emphatically seen) and those who’ll never be given a proper shot.

Stall said on radio pre-game that for Osborne it’ll take an injury/suspension etc to get his chance and when that comes he’s got to take it. Well, to my mind he did that when he scored a brilliant winner at Boreham Wood. But Doyle came back from his self-enforced ban, walked back in and lo and behold the results have nosedived. Osborne’s not even been on the pitch since early October.

Likewise, bit of an elephant in the room but our defence was statistically much more solid when Turner was out, with Bakayogo at LB and McCrory centre back. Results picked up.

Another example is Dennis vs Thomas. Dennis had to score back to back goals off the bench to finally get a start, then the first game he didn’t score, he was dropped next time around. Thomas goes a run of four without scoring, missed an open goal at Northampton, Dennis scores in his usual 10 minute cameo but Thomas keeps his place. So frustrating as for a man who’s supposedly so big on stats, Ardley’s ignoring what’s statistically proven to get his favourites in. He landed on a good team and has chosen to ignore it. And it’ll cost us any shot of promotion and, hopefully, his job.

There is no argument in any of what you have said, 100% correct.

Ardley has lost the plot big time and you hear it in his interviews that there is no way he will change anything, so he has to go and go now as an early Christmas present. If he does go there will be no shortage of takers for the position as this squad is the strongest in the division
All it will take for this team to compete is for the manager to have some back bone and drop players when they are not playing well and this will in turn make competition for places hot up as everyone knows they will not be safe if they mess up and the replacements will keep their place if they play well.

[kill_the_drum]

With next weeks cup fixture Ardley has the perfect opportunity to mix things up.
Even if he believes the team that normally start are his best players, do it to prove a point to the fans, the players, whoever.
Injuries aside you already knew there was only ever going to be two changes yesterday. Booty for Shields and Dennis for Thomas.
What annoyed me yesterday was Dennis was instantly sent on when they equalised. Well at 1-0 we still needed another goal as you could see what was coming, so why wait?!
I don’t necessarily think Ardley is wrong in the players he’s choosing apart from leaving Dennis out. But these players are both complacent and badly lacking in confidence. Let’s drop a load of them to try and snap them out of the rut they’re in.

[Disturbed]

With next weeks cup fixture Ardley has the perfect opportunity to mix things up.
Even if he believes the team that normally start are his best players, do it to prove a point to the fans, the players, whoever.
Injuries aside you already knew there was only ever going to be two changes yesterday. Booty for Shields and Dennis for Thomas.
What annoyed me yesterday was Dennis was instantly sent on when they equalised. Well at 1-0 we still needed another goal as you could see what was coming, so why wait?!
I don’t necessarily think Ardley is wrong in the players he’s choosing apart from leaving Dennis out. But these players are both complacent and badly lacking in confidence. Let’s drop a load of them to try and snap them out of the rut they’re in.

The problem is if you do make these wholesale changes for this game, then if that team loses it will be a case of "Told you so, the back-up players are not good enough".
The team requires 1 or 2 changes in midfield, and maybe 1 in defence (IMHO) and see how we go from there. For now I would bring Ozzy in for Shields and put Booty alongside Doyle in the center. When JOB is fit, then I would replace Doyle for him. The change in defence would be at left back and I would like to see Bird recalled and played in this position. This would leave Rose and Doyle on the bench and give them the kick up the backside they need and sends a message out to the squad that if you play poorly, then you will be dropped.

[ncfcog]

With next weeks cup fixture Ardley has the perfect opportunity to mix things up.
Even if he believes the team that normally start are his best players, do it to prove a point to the fans, the players, whoever.
Injuries aside you already knew there was only ever going to be two changes yesterday. Booty for Shields and Dennis for Thomas.
What annoyed me yesterday was Dennis was instantly sent on when they equalised. Well at 1-0 we still needed another goal as you could see what was coming, so why wait?!
I don’t necessarily think Ardley is wrong in the players he’s choosing apart from leaving Dennis out. But these players are both complacent and badly lacking in confidence. Let’s drop a load of them to try and snap them out of the rut they’re in.

The concerning thing was he did a straight swap with Thomas. How would that affect the game? Personally I’d have brought him on earlier for Enzio, and either put Thomas out on the right wing or even better changed to a 433.

I have a feeling Ardley will still be here at the start of next season. I think they will stick with him, give him everything he needs over this summer and then see where we are after 15-20 games of the new season. If there is no improvement by then then they can honestly say hand on heart they gave him every opportunity.

My concern is this season is still there for the taking. The owners may feel that by holding onto Ardley they are providing the stability everyone keeps talking about when it comes to managers by trying to hold onto him for a respectable period of time. However they need to understand Ardley was not an appointment they made, they inherited him. If a manager dumps a player because he wasn’t one of his signings everyone accepts that, the same should be the case in this situation.

Ive been an advocate of sticking with Ardley, he comes across as a genuinely decent bloke and I do think he has an eye for a player but he just hasn’t shown anything over the last few weeks to make me think he can deliver what is needed over the course of a season to challenge even the play off spots. Again if he stays I desperately hope he proves me and every other one of his doubters wrong, I’m just not convinced he will.

[St Kitts Magpie]

The problem is if you do make these wholesale changes for this game, then if that team loses it will be a case of "Told you so, the back-up players are not good enough".
The team requires 1 or 2 changes in midfield, and maybe 1 in defence (IMHO) and see how we go from there. For now I would bring Ozzy in for Shields and put Booty alongside Doyle in the center. When JOB is fit, then I would replace Doyle for him. The change in defence would be at left back and I would like to see Bird recalled and played in this position. This would leave Rose and Doyle on the bench and give them the kick up the backside they need and sends a message out to the squad that if you play poorly, then you will be dropped.

Thats exactly the problem , the outcasts would get one game , not show much and then it give him the chance to go back to the chosen 10.

The chesterfield match is the perfect chance for him. Then for the league game back to same old same old

[St Kitts Magpie]

Yeah, can’t be great for morale when there’s such a clear divide between those who’ll play no matter what (as we’ve now emphatically seen) and those who’ll never be given a proper shot.

Stall said on radio pre-game that for Osborne it’ll take an injury/suspension etc to get his chance and when that comes he’s got to take it. Well, to my mind he did that when he scored a brilliant winner at Boreham Wood. But Doyle came back from his self-enforced ban, walked back in and lo and behold the results have nosedived. Osborne’s not even been on the pitch since early October.

Likewise, bit of an elephant in the room but our defence was statistically much more solid when Turner was out, with Bakayogo at LB and McCrory centre back. Results picked up.

Another example is Dennis vs Thomas. Dennis had to score back to back goals off the bench to finally get a start, then the first game he didn’t score, he was dropped next time around. Thomas goes a run of four without scoring, missed an open goal at Northampton, Dennis scores in his usual 10 minute cameo but Thomas keeps his place. So frustrating as for a man who’s supposedly so big on stats, Ardley’s ignoring what’s statistically proven to get his favourites in. He landed on a good team and has chosen to ignore it. And it’ll cost us any shot of promotion and, hopefully, his job.

We know the only stat that matters.

[Elite_Pie]

I'm pretty sure I heard Ardley say on the radio something along the lines that the Chesterfield offers a chance to give some of the fringe players a game, so that those left out are ready for the busy Christmas schedule. If Sam Osborne is part of the starting eleven, and rips Chesterfield apart and scores a hat trick it will leave Ardley with a bit of a dilemma.

For the next game, does he put him on the bench or leave him out of the matchday squad altogether?

[durhampie]

I'm pretty sure I heard Ardley say on the radio something along the lines that the Chesterfield offers a chance to give some of the fringe players a game, so that those left out are ready for the busy Christmas schedule. If Sam Osborne is part of the starting eleven, and rips Chesterfield apart and scores a hat trick it will leave Ardley with a bit of a dilemma.

For the next game, does he put him on the bench or leave him out of the matchday squad altogether?

He is more likely to take him off after scoring two goals denying him an hat trick and drop him for the next game..

[freemuzzy]

I'm pretty sure I heard Ardley say on the radio something along the lines that the Chesterfield offers a chance to give some of the fringe players a game, so that those left out are ready for the busy Christmas schedule. If Sam Osborne is part of the starting eleven, and rips Chesterfield apart and scores a hat trick it will leave Ardley with a bit of a dilemma.

For the next game, does he put him on the bench or leave him out of the matchday squad altogether?

He did, and I think he will make wholesale changes next weekend...but revert to the usual 10 for the league.

Weird motivational language that isn’t it, not ‘they’ve got an opportunity to stake a claim for more regular inclusion’. Simply saying he’s resting his favourites who aren’t currently getting results for the league. He said the same during the injury crisis in October (which sparked our best form of the season) - ‘the lads coming in have got to keep the points ticking over for when the other boys are available again.’ Is he thick?! What sort of a message does that send out?

[legs77]

The concerning thing was he did a straight swap with Thomas. How would that affect the game? Personally I’d have brought him on earlier for Enzio, and either put Thomas out on the right wing or even better changed to a 433.

I have a feeling Ardley will still be here at the start of next season. I think they will stick with him, give him everything he needs over this summer and then see where we are after 15-20 games of the new season. If there is no improvement by then then they can honestly say hand on heart they gave him every opportunity.

My concern is this season is still there for the taking. The owners may feel that by holding onto Ardley they are providing the stability everyone keeps talking about when it comes to managers by trying to hold onto him for a respectable period of time. However they need to understand Ardley was not an appointment they made, they inherited him. If a manager dumps a player because he wasn’t one of his signings everyone accepts that, the same should be the case in this situation.

Ive been an advocate of sticking with Ardley, he comes across as a genuinely decent bloke and I do think he has an eye for a player but he just hasn’t shown anything over the last few weeks to make me think he can deliver what is needed over the course of a season to challenge even the play off spots. Again if he stays I desperately hope he proves me and every other one of his doubters wrong, I’m just not convinced he will.

I am starting to feel he is safe for a while and to be honest it’s disgusting he is still here.

If he is still here next season then these new owners must enjoy watching rubbish losing football and whilst we are at it watching the crowds drop by at least 1k which will have a bearing on funds for next season.

It’s looking highly unlikely we will get near the play offs so the best case scenario for us is if we finish 16-18th as that is not acceptable at all not with the money he has spent.

He is annoying me as much as Fullarton did and that takes some doing.

[Disturbed]

He did, and I think he will make wholesale changes next weekend...but revert to the usual 10 for the league.

Weird motivational language that isn’t it, not ‘they’ve got an opportunity to stake a claim for more regular inclusion’. Simply saying he’s resting his favourites who aren’t currently getting results for the league. He said the same during the injury crisis in October (which sparked our best form of the season) - ‘the lads coming in have got to keep the points ticking over for when the other boys are available again.’ Is he thick?! What sort of a message does that send out?

And then he complains that there are players with attitude problems. You can see why there are problems within the squad with his team selection and substitutions every week.

[durhampie]

its what they they do during the match that matters, and all of those that get constantly selected are not doing it when it matters..

[queenslandpie]

Ive long backed Ardley but there is still plenty of time to salvage this season. I dont think Ardley can do it. He has given me more reasons to think he cant than to think he can and stability for the sake of stability is frankly instability. Its an out from me from now on. However before he goes we need someone lined up immediately.

[LaxtonLad]

Thats exactly the problem , the outcasts would get one game , not show much and then it give him the chance to go back to the chosen 10.

The chesterfield match is the perfect chance for him. Then for the league game back to same old same old

If Ardley makes changes like those asked for on here he's on a win/win situation. If we win then it won't be because his previous team selection was bad, it will be because he knew how to combat Chesterfield. If we lose it'll be as Disturbed says "Told you so".

[ncfcog]

If Ardley makes changes like those asked for on here he's on a win/win situation. If we win then it won't be because his previous team selection was bad, it will be because he knew how to combat Chesterfield. If we lose it'll be as Disturbed says "Told you so".

I don't think it's a case of him needing to make wholesale changes, he just needs to get more from the players he is putting his faith in.

[DelroyFacey22]

And again, putting across another angle, just maybe the players that are not selected simply can not be arsed to try in training as they know that there is no chance of being selected at all and even if there was a place up for grabs, then Ardley would get a loan player in to cover, so what is the point?

That's nonsense, Bird played a lot of games last season when Ardley came in and he showed nothing in that run of games that led me to believe he was a better option than Rawlinson, Turner or McCrory, we're yet to see Lacey kick a ball but his resumé would leave you to believe there's a good chance he will probably be a better, more experienced option than him too (but that's just a guess). Bird was alright but nothing special, always looked slow and prone to making a mistake though and sent the ball out of play attempting long passes at least twice a game.

If there attitude was that if they don't think they'll play they might as well not give it their all in training then they don't deserve a chance in the team but even that excuse wouldn't explain Nolan and Kewell also not picking Osborne. People would go mad at other Notts players if they didn't think they were giving it their all in training but I don't think it's that, it's just that he isn't as good as some fans seem to think, if he was he'd be playing, Ardley has said time and time again that if he thought he'd be an improvement he'd be in the team as he's trying to win games and playing your best players tends to help you do that.


Stall said on radio pre-game that for Osborne it’ll take an injury/suspension etc to get his chance and when that comes he’s got to take it. Well, to my mind he did that when he scored a brilliant winner at Boreham Wood. But Doyle came back from his self-enforced ban, walked back in and lo and behold the results have nosedived. Osborne’s not even been on the pitch since early October.

Also complete nonsense. He scored against Boreham Wood then played poorly in his next two games, he was awful at Dover, Shields did more in his 15 minutes than he'd done in the first 75 then after he was dropped the form didn't "nosedive" at all, we won 3, drew 1 and lost 1, not conceding a goal in any of the three wins


The concerning thing was he did a straight swap with Thomas. How would that affect the game? Personally I’d have brought him on earlier for Enzio, and either put Thomas out on the right wing or even better changed to a 433.

Before that "straight swap" he'd changed it to 4-5-1 with Thomas already out on the wing then put Dennis on to go 4-3-3 with Enzio, Dennis and Wootton upfront. Thomas had an awful game even with his tap in so I had no complaints with that sub at all, it was the defensive Booty for Shields (although he was injured) sub that cost us but presumably Ardley thought we'd have more chance hanging on to a 1-0 lead by doing that than a like for like winger for winger (Osborne) when he can't trust Osborne defensively.

[ncfcog]

Before that "straight swap" he'd changed it to 4-5-1 with Thomas already out on the wing then put Dennis on to go 4-3-3 with Enzio, Dennis and Wootton upfront. Thomas had an awful game even with his tap in so I had no complaints with that sub at all, it was the defensive Booty for Shields (although he was injured) sub that cost us but presumably Ardley thought we'd have more chance hanging on to a 1-0 lead by doing that than a like for like winger for winger (Osborne) when he can't trust Osborne defensively.

I would agree that Shields injury actually made matters worse for us on saturday, for me he was the best of a bad bunch. Regarding the change to 451, I'm not convinced that happened and if it did I don't think it was necessarily intentional. Thomas has a tendency to drift out wide, mainly because he is hoping for better service out there. Equally Shields has a tendency to drift inside so the two compliment each other when that happens. Also, why go to a 5 man midfield when you are leading 1-0 at home? That is a very negative tactic. If we had been more assertive in our approach Sutton would never have got a look in. Just my opinion of course.

[Disturbed]

[QUOTE=DelroyFacey22;39379418]That's nonsense, Bird played a lot of games last season when Ardley came in and he showed nothing in that run of games that led me to believe he was a better option than Rawlinson, Turner or McCrory, we're yet to see Lacey kick a ball but his resumé would leave you to believe there's a good chance he will probably be a better, more experienced option than him too (but that's just a guess). Bird was alright but nothing special, always looked slow and prone to making a mistake though and sent the ball out of play attempting long passes at least twice a game.

If there attitude was that if they don't think they'll play they might as well not give it their all in training then they don't deserve a chance in the team but even that excuse wouldn't explain Nolan and Kewell also not picking Osborne. People would go mad at other Notts players if they didn't think they were giving it their all in training but I don't think it's that, it's just that he isn't as good as some fans seem to think, if he was he'd be playing, Ardley has said time and time again that if he thought he'd be an improvement he'd be in the team as he's trying to win games and playing your best players tends to help you do that.



So why is it nonsense? Bird did come into a very bad team last year and was the one player that came away with any credit at the season end. This season Bird was doing fine but then was dropped for no reason and now been shipped out on loan to be replaced by a loanee. Why? So do you not think that this will have an impact on the rest of the squad who can not force their way into a team that is making mistakes week in and week out and playing some really boring stuff? Do you think that this is a good way to manage the squad?

And as for the attitude, I was saying that as Ardley has had a year now and nothing has changed, so the fringe players last year are still here and still not getting game time even though the established players are playing poorly each and every week. Of course this will lead to these players just giving up as you can only try for so long before you realize that there is zero chance of making the team, so why bother?

If these unused players are not good enough then we can write this season off, as the team Ardley puts out every week is also not good enough under his leadership, so either we accept that we are at the level we should be at or get rid of the manager.

If you think that sticking with this same set-up every week is going to get us out of this mess, then don't complain when we end up with the same result as last year when sticking to the same 11 best players each week cost us our league place.

[i961pie]

I would agree that Shields injury actually made matters worse for us on saturday, for me he was the best of a bad bunch. Regarding the change to 451, I'm not convinced that happened and if it did I don't think it was necessarily intentional. Thomas has a tendency to drift out wide, mainly because he is hoping for better service out there. Equally Shields has a tendency to drift inside so the two compliment each other when that happens. Also, why go to a 5 man midfield when you are leading 1-0 at home? That is a very negative tactic. If we had been more assertive in our approach Sutton would never have got a look in. Just my opinion of course.

Probably should go to a 5 man midfield for the last 20 mins because Rose and Doyle only last for 70 mins. That is why teams come on strong the last quarter of the game those pair are knackered and we get over run.

[LaxtonLad]

I'm pretty sure I heard Ardley say on the radio something along the lines that the Chesterfield offers a chance to give some of the fringe players a game, so that those left out are ready for the busy Christmas schedule. If Sam Osborne is part of the starting eleven, and rips Chesterfield apart and scores a hat trick it will leave Ardley with a bit of a dilemma.

For the next game, does he put him on the bench or leave him out of the matchday squad altogether?

Ardley, as the Dodo, is likely to field his regulars in the Caucus-race (see Alice in Wonderland) he sees as teamwork. He'll bring Osborne on with fif**** minutes left and 2-0 down and tell us it he knew he would let is down when we let in another goal.

[DelroyFacey22]

So why is it nonsense? Bird did come into a very bad team last year and was the one player that came away with any credit at the season end. This season Bird was doing fine but then was dropped for no reason and now been shipped out on loan to be replaced by a loanee. Why? So do you not think that this will have an impact on the rest of the squad who can not force their way into a team that is making mistakes week in and week out and playing some really boring stuff? Do you think that this is a good way to manage the squad?

And as for the attitude, I was saying that as Ardley has had a year now and nothing has changed, so the fringe players last year are still here and still not getting game time even though the established players are playing poorly each and every week. Of course this will lead to these players just giving up as you can only try for so long before you realize that there is zero chance of making the team, so why bother?

If these unused players are not good enough then we can write this season off, as the team Ardley puts out every week is also not good enough under his leadership, so either we accept that we are at the level we should be at or get rid of the manager.

If you think that sticking with this same set-up every week is going to get us out of this mess, then don't complain when we end up with the same result as last year when sticking to the same 11 best players each week cost us our league place.

Didn't say I liked the manager I just don't think his team selections are the problem, with O'Brien out injured he has 2 central midfielders and Booty (if you can consider him a centre mid). I've explained why I don't think Osborne and Bird are secretly Messi and Pique but being hidden in the reserves and I'm a bigger fan of Dennis as anyone, I was one of the few that rated him last season and was disapointed to see him go out on loan, but Wes Thomas, despite recent form, is a better option to start games than Dennis with the current tactics.

Bird looked slightly above average but still slow and clumsy in a team with a defence that most fans absolutely hated so he stuck out as a positive, there are now 4 options ahead of him in the pecking order so there is no reason to keep him around sitting in the stands, he's better off playing games while he's young and hoping he improves.

[crazyfists]

He did, and I think he will make wholesale changes next weekend...but revert to the usual 10 for the league.

Weird motivational language that isn’t it, not ‘they’ve got an opportunity to stake a claim for more regular inclusion’. Simply saying he’s resting his favourites who aren’t currently getting results for the league. He said the same during the injury crisis in October (which sparked our best form of the season) - ‘the lads coming in have got to keep the points ticking over for when the other boys are available again.’ Is he thick?! What sort of a message does that send out?

That for me is bizarre! No manager ever says that, they say it's a chance for them to prove they should be in the first team. What incentive is there when he says stuff like that, he needs to go. We've got the stability, the owners and the team now with a new centre mid. We've just got the wrong manager.

[laddo]

Probably a little early to say we have stability lol

[MAD_MAGPIE]

It is becoming increasingly frustrating to hear the manager not acknowledging the clear problems in his own tactics and style of play. Of course, behind closed doors it may be another matter as he has a responsibility to back his players in public. To suggest making automatic promotion is too defeatist in my opinion, it gives the players an excuse almost....as if it doesn't appear they are too mentally fragile already.

On Osbourne, sure, he showed glimpses of what he may one day be able to produce consistently but the games I've seen him in he has looked far too lightweight and ineffective. However, as a substitute he should be getting much more opportunities than he is getting.

I said give the manager at least until Christmas, but I'm getting increasingly bored and dismayed by his lack of drive, tactical nous and stubbornness.

I’m afraid we need to realise and accept that automatic promotion has gone for us this season. August, and our late October and November poor form have put an end to that dream.

We have 22 games left and have got 33 points. If we got 2 points a game from now until the end of the season which is what every team top of the table in Championship, League One and Two and this League are all averaging that’s another 44 points meaning 77 points.

That will be not enough points and it means us displaying top of the table form from Saturday until the end of the season. I can’t see it as we were not this good during September and October.

The best we can hope for is to scrape a playoff place so long as our form goes back to what it was in September and October. If not we may stutter along around our current position and finish mid table. That seems a more likely outcome at the moment.

I’m not being defeatist here but looking at the performances in games that I’ve seen with my own eyes, current form and standing in the league and the probabilities and likelihood of what this seasons outcome will be based on that.

The Barrow game was the one that showed us all we need to do and be to get out of this league. We are not at that level.

[crazyfists]

Probably a little early to say we have stability lol

Well we do in the sense of the owners, squad ability, shouldn't be relegated etc. Now all we need to do is push on but there's no danger of that happening.

[McCullochisGod]

Maybe he gets more wrong in training as he tries twice as more things than others? Just putting that theory out there.

And again, putting across another angle, just maybe the players that are not selected simply can not be arsed to try in training as they know that there is no chance of being selected at all and even if there was a place up for grabs, then Ardley would get a loan player in to cover, so what is the point? Might as well take the money, not put yourself at risk of injury and wait till the contract is up and then move on.

There are good training players and good match day players. As Mick Channon said 'I didn't stay in the game so long by giving it all in training'.

[LaxtonLad]

I don't think it's a case of him needing to make wholesale changes, he just needs to get more from the players he is putting his faith in.

Quite right ncfcog, he does, but it seems he's getting less and less from an unchanged squad. We have a good threatening attack and it's only their goals that keep us floating but what will he do if, or when, they start misfiring? Goals from midfield and defenders are rather scarce so what happens then - another loanee? For defence or attack? Wherever it is you can be sure it won't be to replace Rose or Doyle unless they are injured or suspended.