OT - Salisbury Poisoning

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Tbf Ram, a week of likely investigation has passed since Corbyn’s initial reluctance, but it is nice to see you so appreciative of the support offered by our European partners. Pity it appears some of the Referendum campaigners seem to have shared the same level of honesty and integrity as the Aussie cricket team. ;D

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My was relating to Corbyn's continued stance on the subject. He shows great reluctance to back down on some controversial opinions such his reluctance to criticise any of Putins actions over the years or allowing anti semetic actions within the Labour Party, even to the point of rewarding Chakrabati with an honour after her whitewash report. Then he praises the tinpot government running Venezuela into the ground.

He is far to close to becoming PM for my liking.

The picture you paint of us outside the EU, is that we would be all alone and friendless, well all of Europe knows that we're leaving but are grown up enough to appreciate that the relationship can still be a good one. It's in all our benefits to continue with a close relationship similar to what we have now.

I don’t speak as a fan of Corbyn, Ram...decent man but poor leader and far too flawed as a potential PM, imo.
Having said that, I don’t believe there is anyone in the Tory Party who isn’t equally deeply flawed and infinitely more unpleasant.
Don’t get this Labour Party love in with Russia thing though. The roots of the theory lie in Labour having alleged communist sympathies I suppose, but seeing as Russia, and Putin in particular, has far more in common with fascism than any form of communism these days then why would Corbyn be sympathetic to Putin?
I honestly think he was just suggesting...get the evidence before you start making accusations...and that seems absolutely right to me.

As regards your comments on the European reaction to our stance...I too have been pleasantly surprised and I agree totally with your last sentence. The closer the relationship with the rest of Europe the better for me...have always accepted the need for change but what we are (likely) to throw away just saddens me.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

I don’t speak as a fan of Corbyn, Ram...decent man but poor leader and far too flawed as a potential PM, imo.
Having said that, I don’t believe there is anyone in the Tory Party who isn’t equally deeply flawed and infinitely more unpleasant.
Don’t get this Labour Party love in with Russia thing though. The roots of the theory lie in Labour having alleged communist sympathies I suppose, but seeing as Russia, and Putin in particular, has far more in common with fascism than any form of communism these days then why would Corbyn be sympathetic to Putin?
I honestly think he was just suggesting...get the evidence before you start making accusations...and that seems absolutely right to me.

As regards your comments on the European reaction to our stance...I too have been pleasantly surprised and I agree totally with your last sentence. The closer the relationship with the rest of Europe the better for me...have always accepted the need for change but what we are (likely) to throw away just saddens me.

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I take your point, but it can be a positive for both sides. The EU are going to lose our contribution, but so often we are a thorn in decision making within the EU, they will now find it easier to follow the path that they wish to, without the resistance of the UK. Meanwhile, we can have the freedom to follow our chosen path. There's no rule that states that we must fall out over it and damage each other with trade restrictions and non cooperation in security and other matters.

I'm hoping that this support from the EU is a sign that common sense will prevail and that both sides can have their cake and eat it.

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Originally Posted by Ram59

I take your point, but it can be a positive for both sides. The EU are going to lose our contribution, but so often we are a thorn in decision making within the EU, they will now find it easier to follow the path that they wish to, without the resistance of the UK. Meanwhile, we can have the freedom to follow our chosen path. There's no rule that states that we must fall out over it and damage each other with trade restrictions and non cooperation in security and other matters.

I'm hopZing that this support from the EU is a sign that common sense will prevail and that both sides can have their cake and eat it.

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It would be comforting to think so...there again, are we not in the process of placing ourselves in competition with the most powerful trading organisation in the World...an organisation we have benefited from being a member of for so long?

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Originally Posted by Ram59

I take your point, but it can be a positive for both sides. The EU are going to lose our contribution, but so often we are a thorn in decision making within the EU, they will now find it easier to follow the path that they wish to, without the resistance of the UK. Meanwhile, we can have the freedom to follow our chosen path. There's no rule that states that we must fall out over it and damage each other with trade restrictions and non cooperation in security and other matters.

I'm hoping that this support from the EU is a sign that common sense will prevail and that both sides can have their cake and eat it.

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Wishful thinking
1. those that dare to challenge the club, must be treated with contempt or the house of cards falls
2. they need money
3. they will demand/demand/demand, concession after concession, with the free rule
4. Security is tied in Junkers dream of a European army. Seeing as the UK has such a large armed service in comparison, this has dented his teeth. We are a nuclear power after all.

I still don't see why we are having this conversation? THIS STARTED AS A FREE TRADE DEAL.
Now we are having to negotiate and give in, to regress 40 years.
Whole thing stinks and always has.

The whole EU concept is doomed to fail. There's just too many countries of different scale in it. TTR is right it started off as free trade and unfortunately has taken too many things in. Anyway Brexit discussions should go to that long running thread.
That thread is the 1 place where we can limit TTR's 'political intellect' to just the 1 thread.

And yes don't read too much in what is termed as 'political intellect' as far TTR is concerned.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

I don’t speak as a fan of Corbyn, Ram...decent man but poor leader and far too flawed as a potential PM, imo.
Having said that, I don’t believe there is anyone in the Tory Party who isn’t equally deeply flawed and infinitely more unpleasant.
Don’t get this Labour Party love in with Russia thing though. The roots of the theory lie in Labour having alleged communist sympathies I suppose, but seeing as Russia, and Putin in particular, has far more in common with fascism than any form of communism these days then why would Corbyn be sympathetic to Putin?
I honestly think he was just suggesting...get the evidence before you start making accusations...and that seems absolutely right to me.

As regards your comments on the European reaction to our stance...I too have been pleasantly surprised and I agree totally with your last sentence. The closer the relationship with the rest of Europe the better for me...have always accepted the need for change but what we are (likely) to throw away just saddens me.

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I wonder if your 'decent man' Corbyn thinks there is enough evidence to blame the Russians yet?

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Originally Posted by Ram59

I wonder if your 'decent man' Corbyn thinks there is enough evidence to blame the Russians yet?

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No idea Rammy. I just wish they’d all stop beating each other up over anti - Semitism, the Russians etc and concentrate on the real threat to this country...bloody Brexit!

I have to agree with you there, all this anti semitism controversy is hiding the fact that the Labour party are no more united over brexit than the Tories are.

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Originally Posted by Ram59

I have to agree with you there, all this anti semitism controversy is hiding the fact that the Labour party are no more united over brexit than the Tories are.

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Absolutely right. They’re all f’in useless and scared to death of being called undemocratic while most of the Brexitears themselves are equally frightened of admitting they were so horribly wrong and have really dropped us in it.
Much as I think the ‘people’ haven’t got a clue the only way out now would seem to be a ‘People’s Vote’. It’ll spell the end of May but at least we’ll be able to abandon plans for stockpiling medicines and food and using Channel bound motorways as car parks.
Next week I’m off back to the Spanish house I was staying in when the Referendum result was announced, costs a lot more now of course, but I reckon things might come almost full circle in terms of announcements while we’re away. ;D