OT. Schools...normality and Coronavirus.

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Originally Posted by mistaram

Sorry Geoff evidence does not point to children being minimal to low risk of infecting adults All the experts say they do not know and that's the case for every country

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Well Denmark seems to show that this is the case, they have opened schools and no sign of infections rising.

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Originally Posted by Ram59

On that basis, no shop workers, bus drivers, policeman, fire fighters, ambulance drivers, car workers, building workers, etc, etc, should go to work tomorrow, because they're safety can't be guaranteed.

The country has to start getting back to normal and we all have to take some kind of risk, some more than others.

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I have to agree with you, there is no absolute safe position and I'd wager that once peoples wages stopped being paid, they won't be so happy to stay at home!

We are not assessing the risks properly, we are not learning from other countries - which is why we haven't adopted South Korea's app which works but trying to develop our own which doesn't.

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Originally Posted by MadAmster

I've posted this before but I'll post it again, Tricky.

In 2002 I had 2 stents put in my 100% blocked left coronary artery. I see the cardio once a year and my local health centre also once a year, 6 months apart from the cardio. My stats come back perfect.

I have been on meds for high blood pressure since then and measure my BP regularly. 117 over 74 yesterday afternoon. 123 over 80 this morning. No problems there.

Idem ditto on meds for cholestorol. For years my blood tests have shown healthy cholestorol levels.

A few years back I was diagnosed with Sleep Apnoea. 28 breathing stops per hour, average length 23 seconds. Longest was 52 seconds. They only measure stops in excess of 10 seconds. In total I was not breathing for between 15 and 20 minutes of every hour I slept. Since then I have been on a CPAP every night and I now average 1.5 stops per hour and the machine spots it and immediately forces air into my lungs. All is well.

I also have the problem that I am 6 inches too short for my weight. Another issue.

However, there is good news. As I said my stats are all good. On top of that I ref 2 or 3 times a month and keep up with play. Most of the players are in their mid 20s. 4 weeks ago I got my racing bike out and cycle 3 or 4 times a week. Started with a 22Km ride, slowly going further and this weekend (or maybe even tomorrow) I will de doing a 50K ride at an average of 20mph. I am very fit despite all the above.

The above also puts me firmly in the "at risk" group. Current estimates is that I should reach the 82 years my pension is based on quite easily and carry on further. Now, if I were to catch CV-19 tomorrow and die a week later, it would be CV-19 that killed me, not the underlying conditions. If I hadn't caught CV-19, then I wouldn't have got sick and died. The underlying conditions might have speeded things up but they wouldn't be the cause of my dying, it would have been CV-19. That is the point.

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Ah yes but 56,000 on average die each year from a respiratory disease, we don't get all uptight about that do we?

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Originally Posted by swaledale

That would be a first, Farage and truth are not commonly found together, but I guess there are those dumb enough to believe his ravings!

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On Sky news finally mucker. Did their own fact finding and it mirrored Sir Nigels. Guess I'm dumb then.
A lot of questions need answering.
Perhaps they should ask you XD

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Originally Posted by swaledale

I have to agree with you, there is no absolute safe position and I'd wager that once peoples wages stopped being paid, they won't be so happy to stay at home!

We are not assessing the risks properly, we are not learning from other countries - which is why we haven't adopted South Korea's app which works but trying to develop our own which doesn't.

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We don't speak south Korean for a start!

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Originally Posted by AdiSalisbury

We don't speak south Korean for a start!

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Google Translate.

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Originally Posted by swaledale

Ah yes but 56,000 on average die each year from a respiratory disease, we don't get all uptight about that do we?

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I'm not uptight, merely explaining to Tricky why he is wrong about cause of death of those with underlying health issues who subsequently get CV-19 and die NOT being CV-19 in many cases.

The difference between CV-19 and a lot of the annual respiratory deaths is that the "others" are not caused by a contagious virus that you can pass on to others.

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Originally Posted by MadAmster

I'm not uptight, merely explaining to Tricky why he is wrong about cause of death of those with underlying health issues who subsequently get CV-19 and die NOT being CV-19 in many cases.

The difference between CV-19 and a lot of the annual respiratory deaths is that the "others" are not caused by a contagious virus that you can pass on to others.

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Maddy, I never doubted what you are saying.
Take myself. My immune system has been irradiated. It is still recovering and will be for some time.
If I get Covid, there is a chance it could be severe in me.
But by the same token, so could most illnesses.
Would I take my chances with Covid or cancer? Give me the Covid any day of the week. Combine the two/or any other and it's a different matter.
But the same could be said with normal flu or Measles

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Originally Posted by swaledale

Ah yes but 56,000 on average die each year from a respiratory disease, we don't get all uptight about that do we?

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I really don’t understand this attitude from an otherwise intelligent poster.

What has the fact that 56,000 die each year from a respiratory disease, or that 1800 die annually in traffic accidents got to do with anything?

The fact is we are in the midst of a pandemic which has killed 35,000 people in this country over the last nine weeks!

You can put forward an argument for fighting Coronavirus via a totally different route if you wish, but at least be honest about it, because what you really seem to be saying is that you accept a ‘survival of the fittest situation’ which sees a viral ‘culling’ of the old, the sick, those with underlying health conditions, the diabetic, overweight middle aged males, people of BAME origin etc.

If it were remotely possible to attribute political characteristics to a virus, it is rapidly assuming the appearance of something Hitler and the Nazis would have wholeheartedly approved of, but it seems most un-Swale like to be so hell bent on putting profit and economic recovery - however important that undoubtedly is - before people’s lives.

P.S. Tricky, not having a go, just interested. I thought you were ‘working’ as a volunteer for the NHS. Surely the health connotations you describe should prevent that.

The economic recovery is not about profit per se, though that helps. Its about preventing huge numbers of non covid deaths due to under-resourced NHS and other public services, due to huge hits against the public purse in falling tax revenue of various shades.

Economy doesn't work, taxes fall, expenditure must fall as the magic money tree has no leaves left after covid support has taken them.

Those extra subsequent deaths won't be counted as Covid deaths, but they will be down to the inability to restart post covid initial waves.

Sure we can all hunker down for a other 3, 6 months sat at home watching netflix, whatever but one day the bullet will need to be bitten. In 6 months we would walk into a devastated environment with all public services being massacred, hyperinflation as money is printed to keep the basics going etc etc.

Economically we can no more let covid overwhelm us than we could let it overwhelm the NHS 9 weeks ago. We have to avoid cuts to the NHS in the future when tax take may be down 25%

Or to put it in teacherspeak, if future deaths don't get through to you, a 25% cut in education budget, the inevitable job losses, increase in class sizes, slash and burn of SNC budgets etc, reduced quality education for all