In January..........

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Originally Posted by Carpe_diem

^^ This, exactly.

Running a football club isn't like running a property empire, or indeed any other business. The idea that a person is successful in one sphere and therefore will automatically be successful in another is flawed and shows a high level of arrogance. There'd be no shame in admitting that he's out of his depth and bringing in advisers who know what they're doing. We might have had a more successful ten years if he'd only done so rather than being full of his own self-importance and trying to leverage the good name of the club to further his business interests.

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You've clearly forgotten the "football men" he brought in, Fat Turry and Trevor Birch. Both much more experienced in football than McCabe. Turry the driving force in the appointment of Red Wine Robbo and his free spending and BIrch who cost us, I believe, £600k a year and helped us plumb the depths despite his high standing in the game. Then there's Basset who wanted a manager to relive the glory days he achieved but playing hoof twenty five to thirty years after it was discredited by good coaches.

As for furthering his business interests, he was active in China before NW took us back to the PL. Fradi was a land deal, or that was the idea before local interests wanted in. Again, l doubt SUFC were a big name in Budapest at any point.

While, it's cost us having to watch lower division football for six years, we had a choice. The only person paying for McCabes mistakes is McCabe.


Easy this running a football club.


(But l've read most clubs make losses, surely that can't be right?)

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Originally Posted by Carpe_diem

...We might have had a more successful ten years....

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We might have disappeared in a puff of smoke too...

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Originally Posted by Carpe_diem

... if he'd only done so rather than being full of his own self-importance and trying to leverage the good name of the club to further his business interests...

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I hear this quite often, but after his Chengdu/Fradi thing was dropped, what bit of his activities in the last 10 years constitute 'furthering his business interests at the expense of SUFC', do you feel..?

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Originally Posted by FatherKnowsBest

We might have disappeared in a puff of smoke too...




I hear this quite often, but after his Chengdu/Fradi thing was dropped, what bit of his activities in the last 10 years constitute 'furthering his business interests at the expense of SUFC', do you feel..?

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Neither of those deals cost the FC anything. McCabe swallowed them via the old Plc set up and covered them with hard cash.

Bloody facts.

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Originally Posted by Holden_C

You've clearly forgotten the "football men" he brought in, Fat Turry and Trevor Birch. Both much more experienced in football than McCabe. Turkey the driving force in the appointment of Red Wine Robbo and his free spending and BIrch who cost us, I believe, £600k a year and helped us plumb the depths despite his high standing in the game. Then there's Basset who wanted a manager to relive the glory days he achieved but playing hoof twenty five to thirty years after it was discredited by good coaches.


Easy this running a football club.


(Which is why most clubs make losses)

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Why is it that anyone who suggests that the club could be run better has 'easy this running a football club' lark levelled at them?

I know it's not easy. I couldn't do it, but I wouldn't have the arrogance to assume that I could.

You make a fair point about Robinson and Birch, but again, they were his appointments. Birch had seen some small success at Derby, although he's really an administrator rather than a football chairman, and where did Turry come from? What was his pedigree?

Also to answer FKB's point, yes - we might have disappeared in a puff of smoke, although evidence from other clubs (Leeds, Pompey, et al) would suggest not. It's only the tiny clubs that tend to disappear - it might have been that we'd have been a more attractive purchase for someone else if we'd have been on our uppers.

The whole point of getting Robson in was to further the brand, and by extension his own business interests. The fact that his strategy of bringing in a 'name' and then buying or linking with other clubs to build on that brand failed utterly explains a lot about why it's not so publicised now, but you can bet your bottom dollar that when he's extolling the virtues of Scarborough Group the football club gets mentioned as well.

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Originally Posted by Holden_C

Neither of those deals cost the FC anything. McCabe swallowed them via the old Plc set up and covered them with hard cash.

Bloody facts.

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In financial terms, perhaps not. In terms of the fact that we weren't being managed properly because our Glorious Leader was busy trying to expand his empire, definitely.

And now, what does the club own? Not the stadium, nor the academy. In what way are we better off for McC's involvement since he took over?

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Originally Posted by Carpe_diem

...The whole point of getting Robson in was to further the brand, and by extension his own business interests... .

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Terry Robinson was the one who pushed Robson. McCabes mistake was listening to him and being sold the idea. I think the one making the 'extension' is you.

Bearing in mind that Scarborough group is far larger, better known and more powerful in those circles that matter than little SUFC. I have to ask again, how is the club being compromised by him mentioning the club as a sidebar to Scarboroughs interests, as you suggest?

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Originally Posted by Carpe_diem

Why is it that anyone who suggests that the club could be run better has 'easy this running a football club' lark levelled at them?

I know it's not easy. I couldn't do it, but I wouldn't have the arrogance to assume that I could.

You make a fair point about Robinson and Birch, but again, they were his appointments. Birch had seen some small success at Derby, although he's really an administrator rather than a football chairman, and where did Turry come from? What was his pedigree?

Also to answer FKB's point, yes - we might have disappeared in a puff of smoke, although evidence from other clubs (Leeds, Pompey, et al) would suggest not. It's only the tiny clubs that tend to disappear - it might have been that we'd have been a more attractive purchase for someone else if we'd have been on our uppers.

The whole point of getting Robson in was to further the brand, and by extension his own business interests. The fact that his strategy of bringing in a 'name' and then buying or linking with other clubs to build on that brand failed utterly explains a lot about why it's not so publicised now, but you can bet your bottom dollar that when he's extolling the virtues of Scarborough Group the football club gets mentioned as well.

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Robinson had been in football for a while including chairman at Bury and had good contacts in the North West. He was the one who chose Robson. I'm sure McCabe thought having an ex England captain in situ would help the club in football terms but wouldn't help in laying bricks for Chinese Deoartment stores. It was fairly obvious that after suggesting McCabe should have appointed football men as advisors you would criticise the two he did, with hindsight of course.

Birch is a football specialist. He had a bit of "success" in a certain takeover at Chelsea.

Both appointments didn't work, rather like the Hussey signing in fact.

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Originally Posted by Carpe_diem

In financial terms, perhaps not. In terms of the fact that we weren't being managed properly because our Glorious Leader was busy trying to expand his empire, definitely.

And now, what does the club own? Not the stadium, nor the academy. In what way are we better off for McC's involvement since he took over?

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He did what you suggested above. Brought in a "football man" as chairman. Now you seem to be saying that despite handing the day to day running over, he himself should have managed things better?

McCabe owned everything before anyway, by virtue of his huge majority sharehokding. It's a straw man argument that has no basis in fact.

Well we have an academy producing players. Are you've going to swallows Warnocks nonsense claim that it was all his baby?

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Originally Posted by Holden_C

He did what you suggested above. Brought in a "football man" as chairman. Now you seem to be saying that despite handing the day to day running over, he himself should have managed things better?

McCabe owned everything before anyway, by virtue of his huge majority sharehokding. It's a straw man argument that has no basis in fact.

Well we have an academy producing players. Are you've going to swallows Warnocks nonsense claim that it was all his baby?

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I can't be arsed to get into a pointless argument with you, Holden. You have your opinions, I have mine. I know you like arguing and trying to prove your intellectual superiority, but it's not my idea of a good time.

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Originally Posted by Carpe_diem

I can't be arsed to get into a pointless argument with you, Holden. You have your opinions, I have mine. I know you like arguing and trying to prove your intellectual superiority, but it's not my idea of a good time.

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You're in a circular argument with yourself not me. You said he should have appointed football men with more expertise than him, forgetting he did and then , accuse him of not managing properly.

It's not about any intellectual superiority it's about facts. Your posts in this thread contain mainly opinion and erroneous opinions at that, rather than actualities, repeating claims that have been poo pooed many times.

Facts are always an issue for those who have long standing agendas based on what they like to believe happened rather than what did and are usually the reason posters back out of debate, leaving only a few minor insults as residue.