Reds Hierarchy Say Enterprise In Real Danger Of Financial Failure

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Exiletyke

Said this last October

Look no further than the Sport Business Summit of 2 or 3 years ago where Patrick Cryne & Billy Beane shared a platform along with many others. Beane had connections in the sport world with many like minded people & I think that's where the idea was spawned
James Cryne had long been a follower of Beane's Moneyball strategy & the rest is history

Don't accept it was a last minute decision

---

You could well be right Exile that the initial connection was made at that summit .

What's interesting is that it suggests that Beane was the driver of the group and it was he who wanted to explore the possibility of using his theory in football with James Cryne the willing bell ringer .

It's possible it was Beane who reached out for further investors to come along with him and he came up with Lee , Conway and the others .

It's generally assumed that the group brought Beane in but your post has me looking at this in an entirely different way this morning .

If Beane had been the face of the consortium with his " Moneyball " policy then alarms would have sounded out from the fanbase and the club looking to be sold as nothing more than a cross sport experiment headed by a someone from a completely different sporting background and indulging himself with investors pocketing any profits .

The events of January and the summer of 2017 would have put the meat on the bones .

The way it's played out to the public is that the 6 investors have brought Beane in through the back door , I've yet to hear anything of him through the club or the media other than that he's on board in some capacity .

Well we know its more than just capacity because he basically runs recruitment , fell out early doors with Hecky and it was the subject of recruitment that saw Stendel leave the club .

James Cryne and Billy Beane operate in the shadows with Conway and Spud the faces but the reason we are where we are as a club is possibly more down to them than we've been led to believe .

My post and your view would make Patrick and James Cryne plus Billy Beane far more complicit in the clubs present position than possibly the others who are whilst on board with it but are simply protecting their investment and were brought in rather than actively sought to purchase the club and Patrick's terminal illness was in reality just a very unfortunate coincidence and the deal was getting done in any case .

The plot thickens .

What is interesting about Beane from the film Moneyball and from what I've read is that he's not in to this theory for the money , that's the impression you form about him at least .

He's in it to be the guy who beat the system and his ego .

He turned down multi million dollars from JJ Henry to manage the Boston Red Sox to remain at the A's who he described as

" there are rich clubs and there are poor clubs in baseball then there's 50 feet of cr@p and then there's us "

" we are the last dog at the bowl "

If we were a baseball franchise in the MLB we'd be the Oakland A's .

So you can see how Beane would be interested in getting involved here .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by animallittle3

What is interesting about Beane from the film Moneyball and from what I've read is that he's not in to this theory for the money , that's the impression you form about him at least .

He's in it to be the guy who beat the system and his ego .

He turned down multi million dollars from JJ Henry to manage the Boston Red Sox to remain at the A's who he described as

" there are rich clubs and there are poor clubs in baseball then there's 50 feet of cr@p and then there's us "

" we are the last dog at the bowl "

If we were a baseball franchise in the MLB we'd be the Oakland A's .

So you can see how Beane would be interested in getting involved here .

---

Didn't he decide that going for home runs all the time wasn't going to win a title with average players and developed a system of conservative play to get the job done? Or something along them lines.

There is definitely a need for quality recruitment models of the type supposedly offered by Mr Beane at Dog's clubs---

Barnsley FC--bottom of second tier Championship table in England

FC Thun--bottom of Swiss top tier table

KV Ostend--second bottom of Belgian top tier table

Toulouse (ongoing purchase talks)--bottom of French top tier table

Dog seems to be circling above Europe like a vulture looking for road kill/wounded clubs in precarious football positions, to strike when the clubs are at their cheapest and then pick over the dead carcasses leaving just bones and dust behind. Vulture capitalism.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SBRed48

There is definitely a need for quality recruitment models of the type supposedly offered by Mr Beane at Dog's clubs---

Barnsley FC--bottom of second tier Championship table in England

FC Thun--bottom of Swiss top tier table

KV Ostend--second bottom of Belgian top tier table

Toulouse (ongoing purchase talks)--bottom of French top tier table

Dog seems to circle above Europe like a vulture looking for road kill clubs in precarious football positions, to strike when the clubs are at their cheapest and then pick over the dead carcasses leaving just bones and dust behind.

---

I think they must be trying to make one good one out of 4 sh1t ones. They would achieve this by recruiting raw talent on the continent and if they're any good sending them to Barnsley on a loan to buy deal. Otherwise I can't see the point in it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ponte_Steve24

Didn't he decide that going for home runs all the time wasn't going to win a title with average players and developed a system of conservative play to get the job done? Or something along them lines.

---

It was more about spotting under - valued players whether that be in the majors or the minors to make them competitive .

They lost their star hitter to the Yankees in the film who had a decent batting average and got on base a lot .

They couldn't replace him like for like with the budget they had , not even close .

So they crunched the stats and came up with three guys who cost them a $280k dollars pa salary who when combined hit star hitters batting average and got on base exactly the same number of times .

The same logic applied to football would be to replace Kieffer Moore's 20 league goals and recruit 3 players who'd get you 7 goals each over the season and still be under budget .

Kieffer wants 18k a week so you'd recruit the three replacements on 3k a week .

That as far as I can see is the logic behind some of it but obviously there's more to it than just that .

You could argue they replaced Moore with Chaplin who has actually scored more championship goals than Moore this season on his own and was a third of the price we sold Moore for .

Some of this does actually work .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by animallittle3

It was more about spotting under - valued players whether that be in the majors or the minors to make them competitive .

They lost their star hitter to the Yankees in the film who had a decent batting average and got on base a lot .

They couldn't replace him like for like with the budget they had , not even close .

So they crunched the stats and came up with three guys who cost them a $280k dollars pa salary who when combined hit star hitters batting average and got on base exactly the same number of times .

The same logic applied to football would be to replace Kieffer Moore's 20 league goals and recruit 3 players who'd get you 7 goals each over the season and still be under budget .

Kieffer wants 18k a week so you'd recruit the three replacements on 3k a week .

That as far as I can see is the logic behind some of it but obviously there's more to it than just that .

You could argue they replaced Moore with Chaplin who has actually scored more championship goals than Moore this season on his own and was a third of the price we sold Moore for .

Some of this does actually work .

---

However, if you stick Andersen and Diaby in defence it negates the goals Chaplin scores XD

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ponte_Steve24

However, if you stick Andersen and Diaby in defence it negates the goals Chaplin scores XD

---

That is why baseball is baseball and football is football steve and doesn't all transfer .

However give the dice another shake and you sell Andersen and Diaby for £4m and replace em with Pinnock and Lindsay for a million along with Chaplin for Moore you are in business .

What fecks this policy up is that the price of failure is relegation and financial consequences .

In the MLB it's just a shyte season and next spring will soon come around and you go again .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by animallittle3

That is why baseball is baseball and football is football steve and doesn't all transfer .

However give the dice another shake and you sell Andersen and Diaby for £4m and replace em with Pinnock and Lindsay for a million along with Chaplin for Moore you are in business .

What fecks this policy up is that the price of failure is relegation and financial consequences .

In the MLB it's just a shyte season and next spring will soon come around and you go again .

---

Unfortunately, the model we use works no matter what division you're in. If you load your squad up full of young'uns that can do the basics. It's good enough for League 1. Maybe even a promotion. You sell on the better players in the Championship. If you're not up to promotion you have a decent enough squad for League 1 on lengthy contracts worth very little.

Only plus is I can't see us ever dropping into League 2. If that were to happen under this recruitment model it would have happened by now. If we are confirmed as relegated at some point this will be our third crack at it in 5 years lol XD

And loads of fans come back if we are doing well, then they say what a fantastic model we have so people buy season tickets for a Championship relegation campaign.
A lot of us have got off the rotating mouse wheel, it will take others longer to realise before they step off!!