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Fair point GP...bit of both I think, but at the end of the day...the only avowedly Remain Party in the country won the seat back from the Tories and the Brexit Party got less than 10% of the vote.Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Parkstone
Whichever way you look at it that isn’t a ringing endorsement of Bodger’s new Premiership or any sort of mandate for a no deal Brexit...what it does reinforce perhaps is the reasoning behind the Leavers’ refusal to consider a second referendum.
Exactly AR.Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryRam
Perhaps the Brexit party should have stood to one side as well then, if tactical voting is the order of the day?
This was a Welsh vote and Plaid Cymru, bailed out.
Says it all really.
To claim a remain victory, is quite frankly, laughable.
Clearly it isn’t ‘laughable’, Tricky because the party that won is a 100% Remain party.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trickytreesreds
It may have been the political equivalent of a scratchy last minute og 2-1 win but you’ve been claiming ‘victory’ on such grounds ever since the Referendum.
Putting things in context...we have a brand new full of (misplaced imo) optimism PM and Brexit has been the single issue dominating UK politics for over three years. Not only did the brand new PM’s Party lose the seat but, as I’ve said, the Brexit Party attracted less than 10% of the vote. I don’t think I claimed spectacular ‘victory’ but what I did say was that it wasn’t a resounding endorsement of either Brexit or it’s arch advocate...now which bit of that is incorrect?
If we could turn back time....
I wonder what the outcome would have been if the Tories had not fielded a tainted candidate and if the Brexit party had followed Plaid Cymru with tactical withdrawals to direct Brexit voters to a clean tory candidate.
The world is full of what ifs!
If we could turn back time...Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Parkstone
I wonder if we’d have been spared the last forty months of nonsense if the Tory Party hadn’t ransomed the country’s future to sorting its own problems out, if the Referendum hadn’t been dominated by lies and rule breaking and if the main opposition Party had had any sort of half decent leadership.
As you say, GP...’the world is full of what ifs!’...and the cricket’s starting.
Could be argued (as Geoff did), that this was not a single issue election.Quote:
Originally Posted by ramAnag
The Tories have moved nearer to being a Leave party with Boris at the helm, that will swing some of the Brexit Party voters back to them.
For the Lib Dems to scramble over the line on such a single mandate and others pulling out, then they should be worried. Very worried.
I would think that given the circumstances of this by-election, the losers would be more happy than the winners.
The Tories and The Brexit Party need to be aware of this scenario going forward. It will work against them.
Indeed...as GP has already suggested and I have already acknowledged.Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryRam
The Cabinet has moved more towards Leave, doubt the Party has. Difficult to assess with them all on holiday.
They’d have been a lot more ‘worried’ had they lost.
Really? Bet the Tories were absolutely cock-a-hoop last night.
You’re probably right on the last one but there’s so much self interest in politics today - and those two Parties in particular - I’m not sure they’ll be able to work it all out. Certainly hope you’re right. ;D
I thought the 'cabinet' in total was more remainers than leavers. Granted the more important roles have leavers in them but overall it is a remain cabinet.Quote:
Originally Posted by ramAnag
I disagree about the Tories last night. They would have written off that seat after all the drama beforehand.
I think we can say that the cabinet are all leavers now as the only choice BoJo is giving is whether or not there will be a deal and they all had to sign up to No Deal being on the table as a real option in the negotiations. He says we will be out on October 31st. It's merely a matter of how.
On another note, and I realise it's "only the Telegraph" but they printed this today claiming the EU has more to fear from a No Deal Brext than the UK does. Are they right or just printing more project fear?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business...TSAItbkYRjgA2E
The EU does have a lot to lose and when you get past the rhetoric they understand this.. I was last week in Brussels attending some meetings and they really don't want us to leave without a good relationship. The transition period (without and back stop) makes a lot of sense for everyone. 2 years to finalise a deal is doable if we keep petty squabbles and politics out of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by MadAmster
I was also in Paris and if ever there was a reason to leave the EU, it's the French. What a mess that country is socially. It is teetering on the edge. Feelings are very strong there on a number of issues and the 'far right', as you lot would call it is growing stronger.
Employment laws in France are a nightmare, all driven by socialist policies. Keep em. It's like the dark ages.
I'm all for Johnson having Remainers in his cabinet, as long as they are seen and not heard. (Joke Alert)