Would it be negative?

No doubt Davy, but you are missing the very point you brought up. You called Ardley a Tool cos he was an idiot who kept messing up.

I'm just showcasing that Moniz, however attractive and entertaining the football was at the Lane (and it really was, loved it) he kept repeating the same mistakes away from home whilst Notts manager. He kept messing up by not changing the approach and we were so soft and open away from home.

That makes him also a tool in your eyes, same for Curle.

You are right though NCM definitely wanted Curle gone due to the home performances, and home results. The football was defensive, ineffective at home and a clear drop in attendances illustrated it.

The Pitchforks have a long history on here long before the current manager. It's a cycle , we've seen it on here many times before

Quote:

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Originally Posted by laddo

No doubt Davy, but you are missing the very point you brought up. You called Ardley a Tool cos he was an idiot who kept messing up.

I'm just showcasing that Moniz, however attractive and entertaining the football was at the Lane (and it really was, loved it) he kept repeating the same mistakes away from home whilst Notts manager. He kept messing up by not changing the approach and we were so soft and open away from home.

That makes him also a tool in your eyes, same for Curle.

You are right though NCM definitely wanted Curle gone due to the home performances, and home results. The football was defensive, ineffective at home and a clear drop in attendances illustrated it.

The Pitchforks have a long history on here long before the current manager. It's a cycle , we've seen it on here many times before

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I agree there has been a cycle of pitch forks as you put it coming out time after time

The point being in a lot of cases they were wrong, especially in the case of Curle, the home performances may well have been ineffective (,Average home form can be compensated by excellent away form which is what Curle Had) but the position in the table has to be taken into account, as well as the level of the league in which they were operating, strange the attendences dropped when we were at our highest in the pyramid for years , and since

I still blame Chad Evans going to jail, for us not getting a play off position that season. Sheffield United were winning most of their games till that happened, then they only drew their last 3 games after Chad went to jail, one of those games was against stevenage, who got a point from that match, enabling them to pip us to 6th place on goal difference

i can understand why people think the constant change of managers is our downfall, but it is replacing them with worse managers, and having no idea who the replacement will be, that has really been our downfall and why stick with one of our worst in Ardley baffles me completely , yes stick with a good one, even an average one, but a crap one ?????

Agree Davy, I didn't want Curle sacked at all he's a L1 quality manager. Moniz I didn't want sacked at the time he was, although if he hadn't adjusted his tactics away from home pretty soon it was inevitable unfortunately.

Also agree that you have to judge the sacking of a manager by the quality of a replacement. As you have mentioned rightly before we often replace a manager with an inferior one. With that being the case why the hell do so many people on here still want to chop and change every single season knowing the next one is going to be no better or more likely worse???? Each change putting us financially worse off, and preventing any sort of stability.

Makes no sense to me. Give a manager a proper go, if he fails replace and try again. Just not swapping managers mid season every other season.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by laddo

No doubt Davy, but you are missing the very point you brought up. You called Ardley a Tool cos he was an idiot who kept messing up.

I'm just showcasing that Moniz, however attractive and entertaining the football was at the Lane (and it really was, loved it) he kept repeating the same mistakes away from home whilst Notts manager. He kept messing up by not changing the approach and we were so soft and open away from home.

That makes him also a tool in your eyes, same for Curle.

You are right though NCM definitely wanted Curle gone due to the home performances, and home results. The football was defensive, ineffective at home and a clear drop in attendances illustrated it.

The Pitchforks have a long history on here long before the current manager. It's a cycle , we've seen it on here many times before

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Guess i shoul explain messed up in more detail, messed up by relegating us, messed up by failing to get us promoted by being played of the park by harrogate , and showing the same failures from 18 months before ( a defense that crumbles under Pressure)

For your information i can not remeber Monitz, Curle or Nolan relegating us , ( Ardley is still making the same mistakes that relegated us THIS SEASON (, a defense that crumbles under pressure) so i hope that clears up how Ardley messed it up

EDIT . Monitz was the manager when we were relegated from league 1, but he only became manager in April, whereas Ardley was manager from November in league 2

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Originally Posted by Davy500

I agree there has been a cycle of pitch forks as you put it coming out time after time.

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It's the same at all clubs, a run of poor results usually leads to calls for the manager to go, mainly through a combination of disappointment and frustration. I don't usually join in, in fact the only three managers I've wanted to be sacked before they were in the last 20 years are McParland, Fullarton and Ardley. In each case the reason was that I just couldn't see them taking the club forwards.

To me that's a reasonable personal assessment, but to the odd weirdo it somehow puts me in the pitchfork brigade!

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Originally Posted by Davy500

Maybe, but it does,nt change the fact we were high in League 1 with Curle, and he had a good points per a game ratio , so maybe supporters should have been happy with that, instead of wanting him out

I believe we have never occupied a position as high in the pyramid since then

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I think you missed the joke there Davy ;)

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Originally Posted by Elite_Pie

It's the same at all clubs, a run of poor results usually leads to calls for the manager to go, mainly through a combination of disappointment and frustration. I don't usually join in, in fact the only three managers I've wanted to be sacked before they were in the last 20 years are McParland, Fullarton and Ardley. In each case the reason was that I just couldn't see them taking the club forwards.

To me that's a reasonable personal assessment, but to the odd weirdo it somehow puts me in the pitchfork brigade!

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So in summary there is a large middle ground between the pitchfork carrying angry mob who overreact to every negative result and the we must defend the manager at all costs Pro Ardley Poster Boys. Shock. Horror.

At least most people can recognise that NCM is a circus, a soap opera it doesn't operate in real life. You can post almost anything however crazy and get away with it

The weirdest thing in your sensible post Elite is you didn't want Kimowya sacked?! You could see him taking the club forward??
Awful manager, well out of his depth and far too nice ;)

It’s a difficult balance between results and performance.
Curle got results away from home (for a while) but it was absolutely dreadful to watch.
He probably wouldn’t have been under as much pressure if he hasn’t been completely pig headed about it. He persisted in telling supporters that he was playing “3 up front” at home, which he clearly wasn’t.
Fans can put up with crap football if the results are there. But a manager telling them they are stupid doesn’t help.
Nolan’s hoofball got results but could be awful to watch. That only buys you so much time.
Moniz teams were great to watch but couldn’t get the results. Had he been given more time maybe he could have found a way to make it work.
Curle was never going to change. I think he was always up against it with fans. But didn’t help himself either.
The problem with Curle wasn’t sacking him. It was not replacing him with a capable manager.

We all agree we have too many managers. Unfortunately there are probably very few who actually, given more time would have made a significant difference.

But that says more about the recruitment than the focused on dismissals.

If they were just sacked to early, how many would you re employ?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by laddo

The weirdest thing in your sensible post Elite is you didn't want Kimowya sacked?! You could see him taking the club forward??
Awful manager, well out of his depth and far too nice ;)

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Kiwomya would join the list with the likes of Mills, Thordarson, Ince and Sheridan where I wasn't sorry to see them go, but I didn't actively call for their dismissal. I was very close to the point where I no longer confidence in them, but the chairman pulled the trigger first.

That list shows that I must be very patient when it comes to calling for a manager's head rather than a pitchforker!