Careless Tories!

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Originally Posted by swaledale

Its an illustration of my contempt for people who say "Maybe Braverman has a point"! whilst not observing the fact that a Home Secretary's job is avoid stirring up division and encouraging the more extreme elements of society to engage in violence!

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I presume that contempt is aimed at me (although it may be aimed at Tory voters, Brexit voters, the elderly, men with ruddy faces, the good people of Norfolk and anyone who disagrees with you, including your former rear gunner - your contempt certainly is a ‘broad church’). Fair go, it’s only a forum
But let me explain. The issue has two parts: whether she’s right, and whether she should have used her position to elocute her belief in the way she did. Now, take the ‘Tents by lifestyle’ issue. I can confirm through time helping at a ‘soup kitchen’ in Derby that some people DO choose to live ‘off grid’ including in tents, sheds, doorways etc despite at least temporary ‘in brick’ (as they called it) accommodation being available, and being offered to them regularly. So on that one she’s ‘right’ based on my experience. Where she was IMO wrong was in, scuse my French, ‘gobbing off’ about it in the way she did. She got the outcome she deserved for that. So there you go, a thought through, bile-free line of reasoning, All just IMO

Maybe Braverman has a point

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

Yes. I was being ironic.

I understand that when asked why the Tories needed to rake up Cameron for a top job, a spokesman replied 'because we've nearly run out of MPs for ramAnag to hate'

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Lol...harsh and not quite true.
Fundamentally I disagree, as you might just have noticed, with most Tory policies.
I don’t ‘hate’ all Tories though and I think I’ve only been specific, in my most ‘direct’ criticism, about Williamson, Braverman, Johnson, Hancock, Patel, Coffey and Rees Mogg.
Given that only one of them hasn’t been sacked or had to resign I’m maybe not such a bad judge...and if Farage could get permanently lost, or bitten by something seriously venomous, in the Australian ‘jungle’ over the coming weeks then the world would, imo, be a better place.

P.S. I was never actually Swales’ ‘rear gunner’. I just happen to agree with most of his political stances. As regards the way he makes his point, that’s nothing to do with me, but I’m quietly pleased to see that he now has you in his sights rather than me. ;D

"I’ve only been specific, in my most ‘direct’ criticism, about Williamson, Braverman, Johnson, Hancock, Patel, Coffey and Rees Mogg."

Good to see you as a fan of Truss, Zahawi, Bridgend, Cox. Patterson......

I might be being naïve in this but... I have always thought that, among the written and unwritten rules of UK Government, there is one about showing a united front and not straying from the official line. Basically, if you don't agree with something you either keep schtum or you resign. In this particular case, it appears that Braverman did neither. Worse, she had put the article up for vetting, been told to make some changes and then submitted it without making the required changes. Sunak could do no other than sack her. She deserved to go.

With regard to the point she wanted to make about the police favouring the pro Palestinian protestors above the "right wing" protestors, I haven't seen anything on arrest numbers compared to numbers taking part, not seen what those arrested had supposedly done, to pass comment.

What I have heard is that the Met is currently scouring video of both sides, looking at placards. Where the placard breaks the Law they intend to use the video to trace the perp and make an arrest, They are doing the same with regard to chants, if it breaks the Law try to trace the perp and make an arrest. That seems a reasonable thing to me.

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Originally Posted by MadAmster

What I have heard is that the Met is currently scouring video of both sides, looking at placards. Where the placard breaks the Law they intend to use the video to trace the perp and make an arrest, They are doing the same with regard to chants, if it breaks the Law try to trace the perp and make an arrest. That seems a reasonable thing to me.

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If applied even handedly through to bringing to justice, excellent. ‘Even handedly’ is the key

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Originally Posted by Geoff Parkstone

"I’ve only been specific, in my most ‘direct’ criticism, about Williamson, Braverman, Johnson, Hancock, Patel, Coffey and Rees Mogg."

Good to see you as a fan of Truss, Zahawi, Bridgend, Cox. Patterson......

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The opposite of being specifically and directly critical isn’t being a ‘fan’, GP. Forgotten about Truss - as many are trying to do. I was also critical of her, you’re right and guess what? She left in disgrace too.

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

If applied even handedly through to bringing to justice, excellent. ‘Even handedly’ is the key

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You may or may not agree with the pro Palestinian marchers on Saturday, AF...but you surely don’t believe that they set out with the same intentions as Robinson’s mob of assorted right wing bully boys and bored football hooligans.

Personally I deplore the actions of Hamas on 7th October, but I find it very difficult to differentiate between the ‘terrorism’ they employed on that sad day and the actions of Israel ever since.
The vast majority of the marchers last weekend were demonstrating their support for a cease fire. I’m sure there were some anti Israeli sentiments expressed too, which just serves to illustrate how complex the job of policing such events and appearing ‘even handed’ must be. A job only made even harder by the interference of Braverman.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

You may or may not agree with the pro Palestinian marchers on Saturday, AF...but you surely don’t believe that they set out with the same intentions as Robinson’s mob of assorted right wing bully boys and bored football hooligans.

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Au contraire, at the worst of ‘Robinson’s mob’ were there for a punch up, at worst of the ‘opposition’ were calling for a holy war/expunging of a UN state/genocide. MA is right, if the police are even handed, time and the courts will actually tell

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

Au contraire, at the worst of ‘Robinson’s mob’ were there for a punch up, at worst of the ‘opposition’ were calling for a holy war/expunging of a UN state/genocide. MA is right, if the police are even handed, time and the courts will actually tell

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Let’s be right, Andy. There were HUNDREDS (possibly small thousands) of Robinson’s mob hell bent on causing violent disruption. There were HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS (possibly up to half a million) of Pro Palestinian/Anti War protestors. Can you imagine what would have happened if the latter group had behaved in the same way as the former?
I’ll agree with you that some - a minority - hold very questionable anti Semitic views but beyond that we may have to agree to differ.