O/T Next Labour Leader thread

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Originally Posted by great_fire

Thankfully the electorate have rejected Roly's left-wing extremism

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I am far from extreme left pudding...put it this way my views are a lot less extreme than yours... so whats your excuse?

Dunno why I am getting the character assassination today from the usual suspects. I could ask for the mods to do summat about it but hey I'm a tolerant guy...I'm not one for banning and its Christmas soon. Santa will be on his way ..yay!

I see Dan Jarvis is being mentioned as well.

Not very popular in Barnsley though since becoming their part-time MP.

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Originally Posted by wendun

Good morning, raging. I'm not sure which bits of animal's post you particularly like. I have listened now to several Labour MPs and ex-MPs and they all stated that on the doorstep the main issue for former Labour voters was Corbyn with in one case four times as many and in another five times as many people bringing that up compared to Brexit.
There won't be a space in the centre for Labour to move to and McCluskey and Momentum won't let them move there.
A few weeks back on here I posted that as a lifelong Labour voter I thought we were heading for disaster because Johnson was outmaneuvering Corbyn across the board. Mike and Roly went ballistic as usual shooting the messenger. Instead of reflecting on why they got things so wrong they seem (roly at least) to want to pursue a witchhunt of "offensive views". They really will never learn.

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I liked the reality that there is no single cause of labour's demise. Likewise, its foolish to blame it just on Brexit. Without a doubt, Corbyn's time with the electorate was was past, but to simply think that replacing Corbyn with a centrist mp will be the route back to power would be folly. As animal says, centrist labour mps have been defeated twice in the last ten years also.

I've asked several times of different people and not got an answer. If labour moved to the centre and pledged to not touch any taxes, or just a penny in the pound for everyone, where would we get the money to pay for the improvement to decimated services after the last 30 years? Any ideas yourself?

I think we need a strong unifying person, someone accessible, relatable, warm and powerful in debate. Someone that can take some of the more powerful and popular policies of recent years and make a strong case again for public investment, but without the 'wish list' of this election and the personal historical baggage of Corbyn.

Who? I like Angela Rayner, Jess Phillips and from my local areas Wes Streeting (very centrist but a great young energy and very authentic) and Faiza Shaheen who have Duncan - Smith a close run.

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Originally Posted by CASPER-64-FRANK

You’re letting your emotions get the better of you pal.
I too have seen plenty of recessions and the hardships, redundant three times through no fault of my own.
Once through Government policy, once through an engineering recession and once when two directors were taking more out than what was coming in. Never moan, groan, just get on with it, with the belief things can only get better and it did , I’ve come full circle, it’s almost 2020, far left is outdated and won’t ever win.
No offence intended.

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No offence taken Frank but 10m voted for it on a turn out of 67% which despite a humiliation isn't a small number .

It would be a mistake to totally ignore 10m people , a seat or two around a future centre Labour Party table would be wise in my opinion .

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Originally Posted by ragingpup

I liked the reality that there is no single cause of labour's demise. Likewise, its foolish to blame it just on Brexit. Without a doubt, Corbyn's time with the electorate was was past, but to simply think that replacing Corbyn with a centrist mp will be the route back to power would be folly. As animal says, centrist labour mps have been defeated twice in the last ten years also.

I've asked several times of different people and not got an answer. If labour moved to the centre and pledged to not touch any taxes, or just a penny in the pound for everyone, where would we get the money to pay for the improvement to decimated services after the last 30 years? Any ideas yourself?

I think we need a strong unifying person, someone accessible, relatable, warm and powerful in debate. Someone that can take some of the more powerful and popular policies of recent years and make a strong case again for public investment, but without the 'wish list' of this election and the personal historical baggage of Corbyn.

Who? I like Angela Rayner, Jess Phillips and from my local areas Wes Streeting (very centrist but a great young energy and very authentic) and Faiza Shaheen who have Duncan - Smith a close run.

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The anti left crew would clearly want to believe that Momentum henchman dressed in black trenchcoats and wearing dark glasses walked in to Labour Party HQ one monday afternoon and announced " we are taking over now " , " the revolver and the bottle of whisky are in the next room if you want to resign " .

You can't just simply take over a political party , there has to be a reason why , you can't win two leadership contests either on the back of 30k momentum members either .

My point is and one which you have picked up on is that the centre of the party have to look at themselves too if this party is to ever see government anytime soon .

A thorough analysis needs to be taken and last 10 years put on the table .

Far too convenient for some to simply blame the left and Corbyn it goes far deeper than that and those who wish to see a centre party who did well on Thursday in government with a votable mandate may want to look at the result more closely .

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Originally Posted by animallittle3

That's fair enough flour but it isn't the working class who are waging the class war is it ?

The last 9 years tell you that .

Every action leads to a reaction .

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There was a reason for the austerity Animal and it was a reaction to the actions of others before them. I don't think it was done to northern people out of spite.
I am aware it has affected some people more than others but the ones in power have now promised to fix it. I suggest we give them a chance and then judge them.
During their tenure their actions have allowed interest rates to be fixed at a consistently low level and employment levels are buoyant. If the average man can find work and can afford his mortgage then he,s got a fighting chance. There are issues still and there's work to be done. They acknowledge that so let's see. BJ is in the north today......

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Originally Posted by animallittle3

No offence taken Frank but 10m voted for it on a turn out of 67% which despite a humiliation isn't a small number .

It would be a mistake to totally ignore 10m people , a seat or two around a future centre Labour Party table would be wise in my opinion .

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I’m not saying come back to the Tony Blair days, just put a leader in charge that can appeal to the majority of the country.
55% in the U.K. don’t want the Tories.
Unfortunately it’s democracy and first past the post, that’s how it works, hardly representative of the 55%.
Let’s move on and see what 2020 brings.

My Westminster mole tells me Lisa Nandy will be the next Labour leader. She has been heavily backed by the right people. Odds have shortened from 25-1 to round about 4-1. Wish he'd told me yesterday ! Rebecca Wrong-Daily is current favourite at about 3-1 but isn't popular with the moderates. They will certainly go for a Northern candidate.

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Originally Posted by animallittle3

No offence taken Frank but 10m voted for it on a turn out of 67% which despite a humiliation isn't a small number .

It would be a mistake to totally ignore 10m people , a seat or two around a future centre Labour Party table would be wise in my opinion .

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Hmm, Labour chose to ignore 17.4 million people.........

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Originally Posted by CASPER-64-FRANK

I’m not saying come back to the Tony Blair days, just put a leader in charge that can appeal to the majority of the country.
55% in the U.K. don’t want the Tories.
Unfortunately it’s democracy and first past the post, that’s how it works, hardly representative of the 55%.
Let’s move on and see what 2020 brings.

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Blair managed to attract middle class voters from a working class base any new leader is going to have unite a middle class London platform and attract working class voters back .

Different things going on here Frank when you dig down in to the weeds from the mid 90's , to add to that the UK is a far different country from those days .

It's extremely complex , the Labour Party have been losing support in its traditional heartlands for the best part of 20 years which clearly includes the Blair years .

For me to highlight Blair as an issue and yourself Corbyn doesn't get to the heart of the matter , too simplistic and convenient in my opinion .

The responsibility has to be shared , debated , analysed and more importantly a willingness to get off their @sses from London and get connected again in the heartlands .

Lisa Nandy made a good point today about shifting Labour HQ out of London , it would be a good start in my opinion .

The Labour Party need to understand that when you are fecked over by your own its the worst kind of treachery if you like there is , that's not an easy position to build from and when the Blair years formed part of that narrative it's perhaps not a good idea to present the same formula , getting called thick , bigots and you didn't know what you voted for are all comments attributed to the centre of the party , not good Frank not good at all .

Difficult years ahead because Johnson fecking up isn't particularly great either as we know who will pay the price for that and I'm not going down the road of " you voted for the idiot I hope you suffer " because we need to move away from that and build bridges .