OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

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Originally Posted by swaledale

The reason is simple demographics, I repeat this every time, but you seem not to understand there are not enough people to do the jobs available due to the drop in birth rate.

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IMO all down to the 1%, the shareholders wanting to keep up growth at any price. The less people you have, the less goods and service you need which results in less people needed in work. That's fine, until Shareholders realise that will mean less dividend and they can't be having that. Growth year on year, regardless of the situation, is what they demand and government gives it to them. The falling birth rate means the UK has to get immigrants in or the shareholders will complain. EU migration is being replaced by non-EU immigration. Not exactly a step forwards is it.

Pensions? Of course, the UK needs more people in work and paying taxes in order to fund pensions. That's a given. Take a look at countries like France, Netherlands, Germany and others and you will see that their version of NICs are paid into pension funds. It's not current taxpayers forking out the pension money. Pensioners paid into the fund all their working life and that "pot" pays out more than the UK pension. In NL the full state pension is now €16734 a year. Taxed at 20%. Having paid contributions over less than the prescribed number of years, my state pension is a proportion of that. Idem ditto my UK state pension. Works pension on top of those. France and Germany don't have a flat rate. There is a max of around €28K. What you actually get in state pension is based on lifetime average annual earnings. To get the max you need a lifetime average earnings of just under €80K. As you can see, comparisons are hard to make due to the different systems used.

According to Statista...last month 55% of voters now believe Brexit to have been a mistake.
Only 32% continue to think it was a good move and the ‘don’t knows’ remain at between 11-14%.

Wonder what those on here who have defended Brexit on nothing more than the basis of democratic accountability will make of that.

Personally I very much hope such realisation at least spells the end of one Nigel Farage’s hugely damaging political ‘career’.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

According to Statista...last month 55% of voters now believe Brexit to have been a mistake.
Only 32% continue to think it was a good move and the ‘don’t knows’ remain at between 11-14%.

Wonder what those on here who have defended Brexit on nothing more than the basis of democratic accountability will make of that.

Personally I very much hope such realisation at least spells the end of one Nigel Farage’s hugely damaging political ‘career’.

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Morning mate.
Just to help you in your cry fest.
Details: United Kingdom (Great Britain); YouGov; March 29-30, 2023; 2,002 respondents; 18 years and older; GB Adults

© Statista 2023

You're welcome.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

According to Statista...last month 55% of voters now believe Brexit to have been a mistake.
Only 32% continue to think it was a good move and the ‘don’t knows’ remain at between 11-14%.

Wonder what those on here who have defended Brexit on nothing more than the basis of democratic accountability will make of that.

Personally I very much hope such realisation at least spells the end of one Nigel Farage’s hugely damaging political ‘career’.

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I'd expect to see the numbers move in favour of remain considering the over 75s we're hugely in favour of leave and a lot of them will be gone now. The younger generation who wanted to stay but couldn't be arsed to go and vote would probably vote now.

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Originally Posted by Trickytreesreds

Morning mate.
Just to help you in your cry fest.
Details: United Kingdom (Great Britain); YouGov; March 29-30, 2023; 2,002 respondents; 18 years and older; GB Adults

© Statista 2023

You're welcome.

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Ah...you’re back...was getting concerned, hence the ‘dog whistle’. You never could resist. ;)
Not sure of your point, or how pointing out the result of a recent ‘poll’ constitutes a ‘cry fest’.

You may think differently, but there is increasingly little to offer in terms of defending/supporting the manifestation of a political strategy/philosophy which you alone, on here, actually support. Your tears, not mine...‘mate’.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Ah...you’re back...was getting concerned, hence the ‘dog whistle’. You never could resist. ;)
Not sure of your point, or how pointing out the result of a recent ‘poll’ constitutes a ‘cry fest’.

You may think differently, but there is increasingly little to offer in terms of defending/supporting the manifestation of a political strategy/philosophy which you alone, on here, actually support. Your tears, not mine...‘mate’.

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Yes, I'm back. Full of life after island hopping and snorkelling with the little fishy's

My point was, you just tossed in a " survey" telling the whole sorry story in your eyes, to fuel you incessant cry fest.
When the reality was, 2000 people were asked on YOUGOV.

I don't know if you're a member on Yougov(I am). But one of their own surveys, about membership, showed that 2/3 of its membership are left leaning Labour professionals like yourself.

Now depending where they asked that question, you could get a different answer everytime.
Ask it in London and it will be higher.
Ask it in Lancashire and it will be way lower.

But 2000 opinions from a biased group, isn't supporting your representation of "the voters" and is so very wrong.

I aint crying. Neither I nor anyone I know regrets leaving.
Just because you wish us to do so, doesn't make it true.

Still, at least you didn't drag the Tories into it. XD

Okay...glad you enjoyed yourself.

I quoted an up to date standard sized poll from a reliable source but you obviously know best and believe Brexit has been advantageous to the country. I suspect you’re in the minority but again...no cry fest and nothing ‘incessant’...indeed I haven’t commented on Brexit before today since March 6th.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Okay...glad you enjoyed yourself.

I quoted an up to date standard sized poll from a reliable source but you obviously know best and believe Brexit has been advantageous to the country. I suspect you’re in the minority but again...no cry fest and nothing ‘incessant’...indeed I haven’t commented on Brexit before today since March 6th.

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TTR does have a point re Yougov, its own analysis suggests it’s been ‘hijacked’ to some extent by the far left which sort of reinforces an earlier point I made that small c conservative opinions tend to be shared less until it matters

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

TTR does have a point re Yougov, its own analysis suggests it’s been ‘hijacked’ to some extent by the far left which sort of reinforces an earlier point I made that small c conservative opinions tend to be shared less until it matters

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Tbh I don’t know enough about Yougov or its relationship with Statista (who I quoted) to comment. To return to my original point...it appears, whichever way you look, that the tide (ie the court of public opinion) has well and truly turned as regards our perception of Brexit and that, imo, is the important issue here.

P.S. Given some (most) of the sources quoted by TTR, the irony of him referring to an independent poll as biased shouldn’t go unnoticed. ;D

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Tbh I don’t know enough about Yougov or its relationship with Statista (who I quoted) to comment. To return to my original point...it appears, whichever way you look, that the tide (ie the court of public opinion) has well and truly turned as regards our perception of Brexit and that, imo, is the important issue here.

P.S. Given some (most) of the sources quoted by TTR, the irony of him referring to an independent poll as biased shouldn’t go unnoticed. ;D

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The relationship is that in this case Statista get their data directly from Yougov so the comment made by TTR supported by me regarding the probable left-biased nature of Yougov polls is valid.