OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Fair enough. Possibly too difficult to explain to you without reigniting previous fall outs which I have no wish to do.
Suffice it to say that, in the tiny world of this forum, your levels of tolerance as a moderator are, imo, extremely selective.

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No sorry still lost, not sure what that?s got to do with my genuine attempt at discussion

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

I'll forgive you the condescending nature of 'we need to remember', but whilst I'd agree based on very flimsy evidence that 'the right' might be more violent, I'd disagree with the tolerance bit, from what I can see 'the left' are currently far less tolerant, and I think that stems from the gradual reversal of / pushback against, things having gone 'their way' for half a century. I prefer 'liberal' to 'left' in this context

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Your use of the word Liberal is crucial, here, though of course even that term is subject to interpretation. Because I see no evidence that the "left" have had things gone their way for half a century! Given that attitudes and political allegiances seem to ahve veered ever more towards the right in the last 3 decades.

But of course I forget as someone who considers their views not to be right of centre, I guess its inevitable you will consider that left or liberal views have dominated.

I'm intrigued, I know its considered natural for the average person as they get older to become more small c conservative and for their political views to be more right wing. But given your statements on matters as in the above post of yours it seems you are following this trend. But what exactly are the things that have gone in favour of the "Liberals"?

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

Apologies, I just re read my post and it reads a bit sarcastic. not intended as such.

He's a bully, and we've had that discussion already. Very annoying when he's bullying the wrong way (IMO Ukraine for instance), leaves a bad taste in the mouth even when bullying the right way (IMO DEI, DOGE, returning (the correct) illegals). BUT there's still tremendous pushback to his antics, you wouldn't get that in China, NK, Iran for instance. He's dictating but IMO not a dictator. Maybe thats a nuance

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So you think there is a "right way" to bully? Surely even you, who claims not to have right wing views do not think that?

Oh no you do, because it seems Diversity Equality and Inclusion is also a fair target, whilst summarily dismissing people from jobs and destroying government departments is acceptable to you? Whilst control of immigration isn't right wing, deporting people without due process certainly is.

In fact its a common right wing trope to claim that it would be much better if the inconveniences of law and basic humanity were dispensed with!

But you famously claiming not to hold right wing views, seem to be indicating that removing equal opportunities, an unelected billionaire destroying government departments and sacking people and the illegal deportation of people, doesn't leave a bad taste in your mouth.

As I've said before, there were people who claimed that Hitler did some good things, I mean yes he killed millions but he did get good auto bahn's built!

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

No sorry still lost, not sure what that?s got to do with my genuine attempt at discussion

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Okay, you’ve clearly got your hands full with Swale and I’ve got more important things to concentrate on. As I said, too difficult to explain without returning to previous disagreements, so I’ll leave it there.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Okay, you’ve clearly got your hands full with Swale and I’ve got more important things to concentrate on. As I said, too difficult to explain without returning to previous disagreements, so I’ll leave it there.

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I have nothing in my hands. But I?m not surprised you?ve opted out of the discussion, although as youve claimed victory when I?ve withdrawn in the past I guess I should do the same.

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

I have nothing in my hands. But I?m not surprised you?ve opted out of the discussion, although as youve claimed victory when I?ve withdrawn in the past I guess I should do the same.

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Mm still waiting for your explanation on how there is a "right way" to bully. Though tbh its not required, given your tendency to post such statements and then claim your don't have right wing views. mm

For those that claim the far left are not violent, need to remember, that the left are not chased/ portrayed as such by the media.
Even the recent pictures of the police riot training, and using their instigator with a Union flag arm band said it all.

The far left are in fact very organised and secretive, using tactics straight out of 1930's Germany.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/art...w-about-antifa

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Okay, you’ve clearly got your hands full with Swale and I’ve got more important things to concentrate on. As I said, too difficult to explain without returning to previous disagreements, so I’ll leave it there.

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Surprised your happy with the word bullying here?

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

I have nothing in my hands. But I?m not surprised you?ve opted out of the discussion, although as youve claimed victory when I?ve withdrawn in the past I guess I should do the same.

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Honestly AF, what do you want? My observation was that Swale seemed to be getting the better of you…again, so I opted to leave you two to it.
As regards ‘claiming victory’, I can’t remember ever doing that. It’s not something I do and frankly I don’t really know what you’re talking about. Obviously I believe in my views as you do in yours. We both think we’re correct but ‘claim victory’? I think that’s just your unfounded perception.

I’ve attempted to discuss on the question of tolerance and intolerance and on each occasion you claim that ‘I’ve lost you’. If that’s the case there’s little point in continuing. If you want me to explain I will do.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Honestly AF, what do you want? My observation was that Swale seemed to be getting the better of you…again, so I opted to leave you two to it.
As regards ‘claiming victory’, I can’t remember ever doing that. It’s not something I do and frankly I don’t really know what you’re talking about. Obviously I believe in my views as you do in yours. We both think we’re correct but ‘claim victory’? I think that’s just your unfounded perception.

I’ve attempted to discuss on the question of tolerance and intolerance and on each occasion you claim that ‘I’ve lost you’. If that’s the case there’s little point in continuing. If you want me to explain I will do.

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I didn?t see anyone getting the better of me, I think that?s your bias showing through

Yes you have claimed. ?Victory? a number of times when I?ve withdrawn from a discussion. I?ll have to trawl back a bit further than the last time I proved you wrong but I will if you wish

If you don?t want a grown-up discussion that?s fine, I brought up the subject of the paradox of tolerance which you seemed to engage with but then went off at a tangent, then withdrew. Genuinely, I didn?t understand