OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

There's an easy solution which as moderator I'm happy to implement and which would reduce rancour at a stroke. Lock the politics threads, and don't allowany more. Works (almost) on DCFCFans, works on any number of other sport and music forums I troll, works on facebook, works on Threads. Its hard work for administrators on big forums because to be honest folk just can't help themselves, but it does work for the most part. And those who can't keep politics/personal worldviews out of the mix are either 'let go' or wander off elsewhere, for instance to Urban75.

Its not red, but I do have a button

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Well of course you can if you want to, after all it appears to be YOUR forum these days and it’s something you’ve be wanting to do for a while.

One word of warning, I’d have a look at the relative number of posts on various threads and, from a survival point of view, give consideration to the fact that the interest in the political ones seems to vastly outweigh all the others.

Perhaps an easier solution might be that you, as moderator, display a level of respect that should go with that position, stop seeing yourself as being above questions that are put to you and actually start doing some moderating and stop displaying the blatant favouritism that has come to typify your tenure.

Beyond that, you play with your little ‘button’ till your heart’s content but consider this, who starts much of the ‘rancour’ - because, imo, you and GP are as guilty as anyone - and how many posts do you think you’ll have each week without the politics?

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Originally Posted by Andy_Faber

There's an easy solution which as moderator I'm happy to implement and which would reduce rancour at a stroke. Lock the politics threads, and don't allowany more. Works (almost) on DCFCFans, works on any number of other sport and music forums I troll, works on facebook, works on Threads. Its hard work for administrators on big forums because to be honest folk just can't help themselves, but it does work for the most part. And those who can't keep politics/personal worldviews out of the mix are either 'let go' or wander off elsewhere, for instance to Urban75.

Its not red, but I do have a button

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Given the way this site functions, your button likely wouldnt work anyway!

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

Well of course you can if you want to, after all it appears to be YOUR forum these days and it’s something you’ve be wanting to do for a while.

One word of warning, I’d have a look at the relative number of posts on various threads and, from a survival point of view, give consideration to the fact that the interest in the political ones seems to vastly outweigh all the others.

Perhaps an easier solution might be that you, as moderator, display a level of respect that should go with that position, stop seeing yourself as being above questions that are put to you and actually start doing some moderating and stop displaying the blatant favouritism that has come to typify your tenure.

Beyond that, you play with your little ‘button’ till your heart’s content but consider this, who starts much of the ‘rancour’ - because, imo, you and GP are as guilty as anyone - and how many posts do you think you’ll have each week without the politics?

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Whilst not disagreeing with you that the political threads generate a high volume of traffic compared to the sports type content, there is an issue of quality over quantity. The Brexit thread (why is it still live?) may contain a lot of posts, but if you were to take out all the duplicated points bith before it happened and then subsequent, there probably only 100 unique comments - a few more than a Derby v Millwall thread I grant but as that threads been going about 10 years.... Before the vote there was a mass of polarised input into what should happen, then a ton of wailing and gnashing of teeth and since then a whole mass of "I told you so" fatuous recrimination. To be honest if I see another "such an such an advisory group have "proved" that Brexit hasnt worked" post again I think Ill shoot someone. Other than to vent anger, its pointless. Its happened and anyone who thinks half a dozen powerless blokes on here can do anyjthing about it really needs their bumos read. So for me this one can be closed for all I care.

The running politics thread does at least address a variety of topics and for those that enjoy such cross debate it has a value to the extent that any political thread on a football forum can. Unlike Brexit new issues are raised which can provole discussion, but it too suffers by seeing the same polarised opinions trotted out whatever the topical question of the day is - discussions rapidly descend into blaming the right wing for everything, be it the press, Farage, Trump... ergo rancour ensues because whilst there is "debate" after a fashion we can all predict each others reactions to any issue raised and know exactly who will agree with who. Is it debate if nothing you can say can influence anyone else in the slightest? So whilst the current politics thread has some value in occasionally raising spirited debate it rapidly ends up with ranks closed. I guess most of us like it because we enjoy winding each other up, hence a couple of members stay away and let the others engage in a dogfight.

As for AF, I think your criticism is harsh in that, despite being a moderator, he is still allowed to have an opinion of his own and we are too small a group to have a "speaker of the house" who has to remain neutral. Im quite sure if any of us were the moderator we'd all adopt the same style of trying to juggle opinion vs unpiring. You may not agree with his opinion but its unfair to deny his right to have it because he is the moderator.

Anyway, thats my tenpenceworth, you can agree or disagree, its a free vote. But if this were a democracy I'd vote to close Brexit thread and put the other political thread on probation. This is not a post about individuals, but rather about repetetive debate and anger venting by ALL parties involved.

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Originally Posted by Geoff Parkstone

Whilst not disagreeing with you that the political threads generate a high volume of traffic compared to the sports type content, there is an issue of quality over quantity. The Brexit thread (why is it still live?) may contain a lot of posts, but if you were to take out all the duplicated points bith before it happened and then subsequent, there probably only 100 unique comments - a few more than a Derby v Millwall thread I grant but as that threads been going about 10 years.... Before the vote there was a mass of polarised input into what should happen, then a ton of wailing and gnashing of teeth and since then a whole mass of "I told you so" fatuous recrimination. To be honest if I see another "such an such an advisory group have "proved" that Brexit hasnt worked" post again I think Ill shoot someone. Other than to vent anger, its pointless. Its happened and anyone who thinks half a dozen powerless blokes on here can do anyjthing about it really needs their bumos read. So for me this one can be closed for all I care.

The running politics thread does at least address a variety of topics and for those that enjoy such cross debate it has a value to the extent that any political thread on a football forum can. Unlike Brexit new issues are raised which can provole discussion, but it too suffers by seeing the same polarised opinions trotted out whatever the topical question of the day is - discussions rapidly descend into blaming the right wing for everything, be it the press, Farage, Trump... ergo rancour ensues because whilst there is "debate" after a fashion we can all predict each others reactions to any issue raised and know exactly who will agree with who. Is it debate if nothing you can say can influence anyone else in the slightest? So whilst the current politics thread has some value in occasionally raising spirited debate it rapidly ends up with ranks closed. I guess most of us like it because we enjoy winding each other up, hence a couple of members stay away and let the others engage in a dogfight.

As for AF, I think your criticism is harsh in that, despite being a moderator, he is still allowed to have an opinion of his own and we are too small a group to have a "speaker of the house" who has to remain neutral. Im quite sure if any of us were the moderator we'd all adopt the same style of trying to juggle opinion vs unpiring. You may not agree with his opinion but its unfair to deny his right to have it because he is the moderator.

Anyway, thats my tenpenceworth, you can agree or disagree, its a free vote. But if this were a democracy I'd vote to close Brexit thread and put the other political thread on probation. This is not a post about individuals, but rather about repetetive debate and anger venting by ALL parties involved.

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You have your opinion and I have mine. We’re both equally entitled to them.

As it happens I don’t enjoy ‘winding up’ others. I just enjoy debate/discussion, simple as that.

Ultimately I think we’re all adult enough to decide what we want to comment on and, as long as things remain in the realms of decency, then they should be left well alone and interference free.

First and foremost this is a DCFC site followed I think, in no particular order, by comments relating to football in general, other sports, music, films and current affairs. Personally I have virtually zero interest in motor racing, just as you have similarly expressed a lack of interest regarding soul music, but I don’t think either of us would seek to ban or do away with comments on those particular subjects…we just accept we have nothing to offer.

Live and let live. Threads live or die according to the level of interest in them and as regards the Brexit thread, well it’s still very much a ‘live’ issue isn’t it, so why not let people comment? If there is no interest it’ll just fade away naturally.

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Originally Posted by ramAnag

You have your opinion and I have mine. We’re both equally entitled to them.

As it happens I don’t enjoy ‘winding up’ others. I just enjoy debate/discussion, simple as that.

Ultimately I think we’re all adult enough to decide what we want to comment on and, as long as things remain in the realms of decency, then they should be left well alone and interference free.

First and foremost this is a DCFC site followed I think, in no particular order, by comments relating to football in general, other sports, music, films and current affairs. Personally I have virtually zero interest in motor racing, just as you have similarly expressed a lack of interest regarding soul music, but I don’t think either of us would seek to ban or do away with comments on those particular subjects…we just accept we have nothing to offer.

Live and let live. Threads live or die according to the level of interest in them and as regards the Brexit thread, well it’s still very much a ‘live’ issue isn’t it, so why not let people comment? If there is no interest it’ll just fade away naturally.

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Political opinion creates rancour wherever it is raised. F1 and soul music don't.

Is Brexit a live issue? In my view no, the debate has been a dead issue for nearly 10 years. What is the issue is what direction is right for the country to now take with regards to Europe. Brexit was done and dusted years ago, we must move on from "but he said on the bus" to what is right for Britain today - a Britain with many new challenges that didn't exist in 2016: Russian aggression, uncontrolled immigration, failing economies both here and in Europe. We can learn from history but have to have regard for changing times and situations. We can reopen a debate with "should we consider rejoining, if wanted by Europe, but that's no a Brexit issue, it's a whole new debate that can play out before a much changed plebiscite.

If the Brexit thread is closed the discussion will move to whatever other political thread is running.

Unless of course we are now living in the utopia farage , Johnson etc promised us?

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Originally Posted by Geoff Parkstone

Political opinion creates rancour wherever it is raised. F1 and soul music don't.

Is Brexit a live issue? In my view no, the debate has been a dead issue for nearly 10 years. What is the issue is what direction is right for the country to now take with regards to Europe. Brexit was done and dusted years ago, we must move on from "but he said on the bus" to what is right for Britain today - a Britain with many new challenges that didn't exist in 2016: Russian aggression, uncontrolled immigration, failing economies both here and in Europe. We can learn from history but have to have regard for changing times and situations. We can reopen a debate with "should we consider rejoining, if wanted by Europe, but that's no a Brexit issue, it's a whole new debate that can play out before a much changed plebiscite.

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Again we disagree. The question of should we consider rejoining is absolutely a Brexit issue because you know as well as I do that any attempt to rejoin or re establish a better relationship with Europe will immediately be denounced as anti democratic by all those who support Brexit. Also the escalating threat Russia poses to Europe and the simultaneous threat to NATO posed by Trump make a united Europe much more important than many might have envisaged nine and a half years ago.

As regards AF from your earlier post. In no way am I suggesting he isn’t entitled to have an opinion and I fully recognise that one may moderate while holding an opinion. What I don’t believe a moderator should EVER do however is go out of their way to antagonise another forum member. That’s what Rats was all about and that, imo, is what AF has done - aided and abetted by you - this week. The clue is in the ‘job title’.

"The question of should we consider rejoining is absolutely a Brexit issue"

It absolutely isn't - the decision making environment and electorate has moved on 10 years. It's a shame angry remainers haven't moved on as well but instead keep on repeating the tired old arguments.

Move on, open your mind to the new challenge, construct a compelling case for seeking to rejoin, but don't continue the whinging refrain of "we done bad". Be positive not negative.

Did Germany become an economic power in post war Europe by wringing their hands at the past errors. No it looked forward not backwards and succeeded

Brexit has cost Billions and will continue to do so. Fact.

The trade deals signed since then are hardly worth the paper they're written on.

There is, more than likely, a healthy majority in favour of with rejoining the EU or at least joining the Customs Union in order to bring our trade with the EU back to pre Brexit levels and reduce the time consuming form filling.

Back in March 2017, a caller to Farage's LBC show asked if he'd quit politics in the case of Brexit being a disaster. He replied that, if it were a disaster, he'd go and live elsewhere. Many would now ask why he's still here...

Brexit has dented the economy and nobody has yet found a panel beater competent enough to hammer out the dents. One thing I'm sure of is that Farage is NOT a panel beater.

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Originally Posted by Geoff Parkstone

"The question of should we consider rejoining is absolutely a Brexit issue"

It absolutely isn't - the decision making environment and electorate has moved on 10 years. It's a shame angry remainers haven't moved on as well but instead keep on repeating the tired old arguments.

Move on, open your mind to the new challenge, construct a compelling case for seeking to rejoin, but don't continue the whinging refrain of "we done bad". Be positive not negative.

Did Germany become an economic power in post war Europe by wringing their hands at the past errors. No it looked forward not backwards and succeeded

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Okay. We differ. Politely for once.

As MA has pointed out, the economic ramifications of Brexit rumble on in much the same way as the economic ramifications of Covid and furlough. The difference is that the former was complete self inflicted and an example of UK PLC shooting itself in the foot.

I am also bewildered that its main architect has managed to continue to carve out a political career and now sees himself as a PM in waiting. For that reason alone - and there are many others - Brexit, and all its implications, continues, imo, to be an issue, although I recognise the irony of your attempt to dismiss it actually resurrecting it as a topic for discussion.