Back 6

[1955pie]

I have just looked at our nominal back 6 players of goalkeeper, 3 centralish defenders and 2 wingbacks.
In all 4 league matches to date 5 of the 6 were at the club last season.
Now to my mind, if they weren't able to cope with a high press last year then why should we expect them to this year?
This appears to be a failure of recruitment, not of playing style.
Pivotal to our owners' desire to play a certain style of football is the goalkeeper who sees a lot of the ball and needs to be good with his feet.
I like Sam Slocombe but he is not the player we need in that situation and must be the first to be replaced. Now I don't think we could be so lucky as to get another Patterson but he does need to be better than Jaros.
I'm hoping that something will happen after the league transfer window closes on 1st Sept when clubs know what they have got and who needs to go out on loan.
Same with other positions maybe.
And lets hope RR and/or MP don't go the other way though.

[BanjoPie]

I have just looked at our nominal back 6 players of goalkeeper, 3 centralish defenders and 2 wingbacks.
In all 4 league matches to date 5 of the 6 were at the club last season.
Now to my mind, if they weren't able to cope with a high press last year then why should we expect them to this year?
This appears to be a failure of recruitment, not of playing style.
Pivotal to our owners' desire to play a certain style of football is the goalkeeper who sees a lot of the ball and needs to be good with his feet.
I like Sam Slocombe but he is not the player we need in that situation and must be the first to be replaced. Now I don't think we could be so lucky as to get another Patterson but he does need to be better than Jaros.
I'm hoping that something will happen after the league transfer window closes on 1st Sept when clubs know what they have got and who needs to go out on loan.
Same with other positions maybe.
And lets hope RR and/or MP don't go the other way though.

Sounds as if you are more knowledgable than all the Notts coaching staff - why haven't you applied for the job of head coach?

[ncfcog]

I have just looked at our nominal back 6 players of goalkeeper, 3 centralish defenders and 2 wingbacks.
In all 4 league matches to date 5 of the 6 were at the club last season.
Now to my mind, if they weren't able to cope with a high press last year then why should we expect them to this year?
This appears to be a failure of recruitment, not of playing style.
Pivotal to our owners' desire to play a certain style of football is the goalkeeper who sees a lot of the ball and needs to be good with his feet.
I like Sam Slocombe but he is not the player we need in that situation and must be the first to be replaced. Now I don't think we could be so lucky as to get another Patterson but he does need to be better than Jaros.
I'm hoping that something will happen after the league transfer window closes on 1st Sept when clubs know what they have got and who needs to go out on loan.
Same with other positions maybe.
And lets hope RR and/or MP don't go the other way though.

I think the way to beat a high press is two-fold. Firstly, employ a high press of your own to tilt the unwanted pressure in your favour and secondly move the ball forward quicker. I think we have seen that both of these are something LW has been working on and it shows in the stats. We currently have one of the best PPDA (Passes Allowed per Defensive Action) stats in the league and I've definitely noticed an intention to get the ball forward a lot more than last season.

As you point out though, other than Baldwin, our other defensive players have just spent more than a season learning how to play it out from the back, now they're being asked to get the ball forward sooner and be a little more direct. Hopefully they'll get the hang of it sooner rather than later.

[1955pie]

Sounds as if you are more knowledgable than all the Notts coaching staff - why haven't you applied for the job of head coach?

Sorry - No need to be sarcastic. Just giving an opinion on which position I think needs to be sorted first.
Looking for common ground between last season and this. That's all.

[countygump]

I think the way to beat a high press is to-fold

Nah, we've tried that and it's never worked for us before, Oggie.

Trouble is, it truly is a back 6. Two fullbacks who are expected to get forward is not ideal. We need to try to play, or adopt a formation that allows us to play, further up the pitch. We have also had a very high W.A.L.O.C, rating in a couple of matches.

[ncfcog]

Nah, we've tried that and it's never worked for us before, Oggie.

Arrgh, bleddy auto-correct!!

We have also had a very high W.A.L.O.C, rating in a couple of matches.

Not as many as last season though!

[Magpies1959]

ncfcog, moving the ball forward quicker, is indeed a way to beat the high press. It sounds very simple, but also increases the risk of the ball coming back at you quicker, just saying. We did use this tactic against Florist and it worked well, maybe we didn't fancy our chances of playing through their much more mobile/quicker press.

[jackal2]

ncfcog, moving the ball forward quicker, is indeed a way to beat the high press. It sounds very simple, but also increases the risk of the ball coming back at you quicker, just saying.

And of course, moving the ball quicker is more difficult for National League players than it is for Premier League players, because they're not as good, mentally or technically. That's why I can't see the logic of playing high risk football close to your own goal with players who are going to make mistakes more often than those at the highest levels. It doesn't mean you shouldn't try to play attractive attacking football, but don't over-complicate things in your own defensive third. Take the risks in areas well clear of your own goal where you've still got cover behind you.

[1955pie]

And of course, moving the ball quicker is more difficult for National League players than it is for Premier League players, because they're not as good, mentally or technically. That's why I can't see the logic of playing high risk football close to your own goal with players who are going to make mistakes more often than those at the highest levels. It doesn't mean you shouldn't try to play attractive attacking football, but don't over-complicate things in your own defensive third. Take the risks in areas well clear of your own goal where you've still got cover behind you.

But getting better players would reduce those risks further.

[kill_the_drum]

Talking purely about last season, I’ve never understood this constant issue with playing out from the back. Over the whole season we gifted one goal from losing the ball cheaply and that was Ed Francis playing a blind back pass. On a few occasions we got penned in with a high press but as our home record proves, we overwhelmingly came out on top in most games. Our poorer away form wasn’t from a high press, it was that opposing teams had more possession so did more damage.
Our issue is, and has been since dropping down here, is what we do when we haven’t got the ball. We are soft. We don’t press on crosses and we don’t kill an attack before it starts.
So to start playing percentage balls, which guarantees the opposition more possession, will highlight our weaknesses even further.
On Saturday we started playing it long and every single ball came straight back to us with Chesterfield in possession.
We got back in the game when we made the changes, upped the tempo, moved the ball quick through the lines and dragged them out of position.
However we still looked dangerously weak when we lost the ball.
Until we can dominate teams physically and rush them when they have the ball, I’m more than happy to play possession football.