Was wondering about batteries

[BCram]

and how they are going to be used to store wind turbine energy so that when the wind dies down the batteries will supply the power. Anybody know if this is actually good science?

[Dodbroon]

and how they are going to be used to store wind turbine energy so that when the wind dies down the batteries will supply the power. Anybody know if this is actually good science?

Within the Hydro Electric energy production there are pump storage systems already in place where cheaper overnight electricity is used to pump water up to a reservoir for the production of power at times when it is required. I don't know how many such systems are in place. Cruachan is certainly one, others may exist. Surely, theoretically, power from wind turbines could be used for the pumping up of the water. Building new dams would take time and money but maybe the addition of pumps to restock water reservoirs at existing dams is a possibility in effect duplicating the Cruachan system.

On the other hand I could be havering rubbish!!

[islaydarkblue]

Within the Hydro Electric energy production there are pump storage systems already in place where cheaper overnight electricity is used to pump water up to a reservoir for the production of power at times when it is required. I don't know how many such systems are in place. Cruachan is certainly one, others may exist. Surely, theoretically, power from wind turbines could be used for the pumping up of the water. Building new dams would take time and money but maybe the addition of pumps to restock water reservoirs at existing dams is a possibility in effect duplicating the Cruachan system.


On the other hand I could be havering rubbish!!

The hydro electric dam at Pitlochry is a pump storage system.
The power from wind turbines could only be used to pump up the water to a reservoir about the dam if the wind was blowing.
You need to remember that if is too windy wind turbines have to be switched off in case their spinning blades go out of control and shear off.

[Deeranged]

The hydro electric dam at Pitlochry is a pump storage system.
The power from wind turbines could only be used to pump up the water to a reservoir about the dam if the wind was blowing.
You need to remember that if is too windy wind turbines have to be switched off in case their spinning blades go out of control and shear off.

The reason they have to be switched off in high winds is that there's the potential the tip speed could exceed limits - tip speed is the controlling factor on any rotating aerofoil blade and can cause excessive vibration or flutter if the maximum operating design speed is exceeded. I doubt it would happen on a wind turbine but should the tip speed exceed the speed of sound it would definitely vibrate excessively and cause flutter as the properties explained by Boyle's law reverse at supersonic speeds and the blade effectively tries to work against it's direction of rotation in the area affected. In order to avoid the tip reaching dangerous speeds there's a gear box which will feather the blade to reduce the energy uptake and there is also a brake to stop the rotation.

The chance of a blade shearing off is almost zero even when excessive vibration / flutter takes place and there will be sensors to slow the blade by feathering or to apply the brake if required. Think of an aircraft propellor blade, it will be rotating at much higher velocity than a wind turbine blade but they really aren't prone to shearing.

[islaydarkblue]

The reason they have to be switched off in high winds is that there's the potential the tip speed could exceed limits - tip speed is the controlling factor on any rotating aerofoil blade and can cause excessive vibration or flutter if the maximum operating design speed is exceeded. I doubt it would happen on a wind turbine but should the tip speed exceed the speed of sound it would definitely vibrate excessively and cause flutter as the properties explained by Boyle's law reverse at supersonic speeds and the blade effectively tries to work against it's direction of rotation in the area affected. In order to avoid the tip reaching dangerous speeds there's a gear box which will feather the blade to reduce the energy uptake and there is also a brake to stop the rotation.

The chance of a blade shearing off is almost zero even when excessive vibration / flutter takes place and there will be sensors to slow the blade by feathering or to apply the brake if required. Think of an aircraft propellor blade, it will be rotating at much higher velocity than a wind turbine blade but they really aren't prone to shearing.

A number of years ago I saw a photograph on the internet of a large wind turbine where one of its blades had sheared off during storm force winds.
About four years there was a property for sale in the Rhinns area of Islay. Included in the sale was a free standing wind turbine which had blown over in stormy weather.
There was a photograph of the wind turbine which toppled over.

[Deeranged]

A number of years ago I saw a photograph on the internet of a large wind turbine where one of its blades had sheared off during storm force winds.
About four years there was a property for sale in the Rhinns area of Islay. Included in the sale was a free standing wind turbine which had blown over in stormy weather.
There was a photograph of the wind turbine which toppled over.

Seimens Gamesa had an issue with material from an OEM I believe that resulted in a one off failure - not sure it was a shear though, more likely a complete detach at gear hub. Obviously I could be wrong.

I'd think if the fallen turbine on Islay was four years ago on a private property it will have been an early type of turbine installed by a dodgy contractor. The monstrosities you see blighting the environment on top of hills all over the country are much better designed, much more robust and are unlikely to fall over.

I can understand why someone would have visions of these things throwing blades or falling over mind. They just look clumsy and most definitely look out of place in our countryside.

[The AuldYin]

Within the Hydro Electric energy production there are pump storage systems already in place where cheaper overnight electricity is used to pump water up to a reservoir for the production of power at times when it is required. I don't know how many such systems are in place. Cruachan is certainly one, others may exist. Surely, theoretically, power from wind turbines could be used for the pumping up of the water. Building new dams would take time and money but maybe the addition of pumps to restock water reservoirs at existing dams is a possibility in effect duplicating the Cruachan system.

On the other hand I could be havering rubbish!!

No you're right, these are called mechanical batteries, pump the water up as the turbines generate excess energy in high winds let it run back down the hill when more energy is needed. Another way of doing it is simply lifting heavy weights up in the air as excess energy is produced and lower them back down as you need the energy.
I was told today everything is down to cost, is it cost effective to make hundreds of Hydro electric dams and the wind farms needed to power them? Who knows.
People get paid to answer these questions when really they should have simply came on here for the answers. The real problem is there are far too many flat earthers out there.
As for the wind turbines the answer is the same, cost, they can very easily make wind turbines to withstand any amount of wind but they would cost a lot more it's easier to make them cheaper and turn them off and on as we need them, especially as we can't use the energy produced at certain times, it's nothing to do with bits shearing off in the wind.

[islaydarkblue]

and how they are going to be used to store wind turbine energy so that when the wind dies down the batteries will supply the power. Anybody know if this is actually good science?

This is the main problem with wind turbines and solar panels.
Huge batteries which are expensive would have to be installed to store electricity generated by wind turbines and solar to have a continuous supply of electricity when the wind does not blow and/or it is cloudy.
Solar panels are no use during the winter months when there are only a few hours of daylight.
When wind farms are installed, Scottish Renewables who are the mouthpiece for the renewable industry in Scotland are always careful to say that a new wind farm could produce enough electricity for say 20,000 homes.
They never state that the new wind farm will produce enough electricity for say 20,000 homes because they know that the wind in Scotland does not blow all the time and they also know that when there are storms the wind turbines will have to be switched off until the storm dies out.

[BCram]

Just Googled wind speeds and turbines. Operating range is 7 to 55mph. Now looking to see if there are stats for how often the turbines are stopped because of too much wind.

[islaydarkblue]

Just Googled wind speeds and turbines. Operating range is 7 to 55mph. Now looking to see if there are stats for how often the turbines are stopped because of too much wind.

The house next door to me on Islay has a 2.5KW Provan wind turbine erected in the large garden. During windy weather it cannot be switched off because the rope has broken and the makers of the wind turbine have gone bust.