England U17 make World Cup Final after beating Brazil

[Bloomeram]

Congratulations to the Nations U17 side as they now play in the U17 World Cup Final
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41749649

[MadAmster]

When you look at how well the age groups from U17 to U21 have done in World and Euro tournaments of late, it makes you wonder what it is that will go wrong between now and them reaching the senior squad..............

Will we be the next country to dominate youth tournaments and then ultimately fail for the big prizes?

It would be great to think that we can take these groups of young World and European Champions and finalists and semi finalists and comr up with a young senior squad that can take on and defeat the world in a few years. I'd love it to happen but......... just like Derby, we all know how good Engalnd are at messing it up, big time. Or will we finally do it in 4 to 8 years time?

[Bloomeram]

When you look at how well the age groups from U17 to U21 have done in World and Euro tournaments of late, it makes you wonder what it is that will go wrong between now and them reaching the senior squad..............

Will we be the next country to dominate youth tournaments and then ultimately fail for the big prizes?

It would be great to think that we can take these groups of young World and European Champions and finalists and semi finalists and comr up with a young senior squad that can take on and defeat the world in a few years. I'd love it to happen but......... just like Derby, we all know how good Engalnd are at messing it up, big time. Or will we finally do it in 4 to 8 years time?

In a word 'MONEY' the youngsters are not the finished article yet but show promise. The leading clubs in England prefer to spend mega bucks on European and World stars, so no places left for our rising stars and they go out on loan to lower league and foreign teams.

The death of English football started with the Premier League and has declined ever since......

[Andy_Faber]

Congratulations to the Nations U17 side as they now play in the U17 World Cup Final
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41749649

In the comments to this, someone wrote

'We can obviously produce good players at younger ages but what happens to them?(rhetorical). They don't get the chance in Premier League because managers are too scared to play them and they then fall be the wayside.
Perhaps when we leave the EU and get control of our borders (tongue in cheek) our Sports Minister can get the government to stop issuing visas and force clubs into using home talent'

I think that's a load of rubbish. Our professional structure is big enough that English players not given a chance with their parent PL club can be 'farmed out' to EFL or other leagues on loan to develop their game (and add value to the host club). I've been in recent contact with a youngster for whom exactly this situation is happening and his parent PL club have him a) on a long contract and b) under the clear impression he is out for development purposes and will be back next year fighting for a first-team place. There are only three possible reasons not to pick English players - a) managers have blinkers on, and why would they, b) English players ask for too much money, in which case they get what they deserve, or c) pound for pound they aren't good enough.

[DerbyDaDream]

Better to watch the youths play then the senior side but wether it will make a difference in improving the senior squad performance in a few years time will be the million pound question, for the simple reason being is that they will either be simply ignored by the senior team because they not getting notice because they don’t get regular football at their clubs and so they prefer the usual big guns to remain in the side so the youth set-up is completely non existence.

Shame but that’s how English football is now with the money involved due to TV rights and why we will always be behind other big nations when it comes to international level.

[roger_ramjet]

The success of our League system causes the death of our National side: sadly I think this is true. Even if our young players get within a gnat's crochet of the first team, then they are rotated in and out of the side and maybe get a few minutes here and there as a substitute: the lucky ones get sent out on loan and generally tread water until disappearing.

Look at the Chelsea squad - about 8 team's worth of players, 34 of whom are on loan across Europe and in our lower (and indeed Premier) leagues. More than half of these are non home countries produced, and seem to be bought simply to prevent opponents buying them (and, in turn, loaning them out just the same). Perhaps if there was an embargo on buying non domestic players under a given age it may help the development of English qualified youth. Its not just a Brexit thing though, as Chelsea have players from Africa, South America, USA, Croatia amongst their loaned out stock.

But then again, maybe its just that our home produced players peak too early in their football life. Take a situation close to home - Will Hughes. He came into our side at 16, looked like the next new star kid off the block, got plenty of exposure, plenty of experience but seemed to slowly regress in comparative terms as he gained experience (and injury).

Now he is to be found at a mediocre (yes, overperforming this year, I admit) premier side, not even able to get into the matchday squad apart from a fleeting appearance in the plastic cup. Last year he was far from a constant in our team. His career seems to be withering on the vine.

So is it Money or is it the way we develop our kids from the age 16 onwards. Do we overcoach these youngsters, do we turn them into robots by taking away their individuality, flair and so on by filling them full of tactics, plans, systems etc? Do we institutionally overcoach their skills away and create a corps of players who have lost their edge when compared to other s who have retained their flair. I suspect so.

RIP Fats Domino

[swaledale]

I suspect its a combination of reasons.

Home talent costs more in transfer fees than foreign players, clubs take the cheaper option
Yes there is less willingmess by Prem league or indeed Champ managers to play youngsters regulary due to the pressure to succeed, this means they dont get game time with their parent club and are not assimilated into the first team squad as used to happen.
Loans are fine, but they can also be a hindrance to player development, because ultimately they are not playing with their own team mates, not being coached by club coaches and living away from home.
The salaries some players earn at a young age must have an impact, where is the incentive to develop if one gets more money in a month than most of their peers will earn in a year at a very young age?
The relatively new system introduced by the prem whereby lower league clubs dont get a proper fee for youngsters they develop is counterproductive.
Football is short term these days, clubs dont build teams, they buy them for instant success and if it fails one season or even succeeds, wholesale changes are made to teams every year.

[Romanis]

I've always said youth teams are ***** in the long run.

Take Italy, Spain and Germany. It's no surprise they have been world champs this century, given how well their youth teams at Euros and the various under 20, etc world cups.

I was very lucky in 1997 to be in Malaysia to watch that generation of Spaniards at the Under 17 WC. Iniesta being the best player. 10 years later they were top of Europe and the rest is history. England will do well to encourage and groom this batch but it'll take around 10 years before it truly bears fruit.

[ManxRam]

When I look at the team sheets for the younger lions there are loads of double barrelled names.

Public school boys or broken homes?

Sign of the times

[DerbyDaDream]

If clubs put more faith in their young players it would make a huge massive difference to the English game but I don’t have much trust in them to make a difference.