Solihull Appoint Ardley

[uysapie]

NA had 28 games to avoid relegation, down to him that we went down. Then he blew the chance of an immediate return, glad he's gone!

[Jampie]

In my extensive experience of failing at things, and somewhat less extensive experience of learning from those failures, I've found that apportioning "blame" is useless at best, but more usually counterproductive.

If you want to find out what actually went wrong and what lead to the failures, you need everyone involved to speak the truth. And you just never get that if you engender a blame culture.

If you were Ardley's boss do you imagine he'd be more or less effective at re-examining his training methods and tactics if he thought there was a chance you were going to sack him after each game lost because you blame the manager of the day for all of the club's failings?

Apportioning "blame" for the relegation is a waste of time and energy to me. I'm very interested in what happened and why, and not at all interested in who to blame for it.

There's a few things we know about the season, like match results, and plenty of rumours.

I'm not keen to retread old ground but I do want to give an example of something that probably went on but we have no real confirmation of, that I haven't previously laid out.

Nolan was sacked after a six game winless run, after taking the club from the relegation zone to the playoffs during his stint. If I were a player at that time I would be quite peeved to see my manager sacked in those circumstances. It's almost inevitable given the esprit de corps he'd engendered in his time at the club, that at least some of the players, let's call them the Pro-Nolan Faction felt that that decision was unfair, unwise etc.

And you gotta admit they'd have a point.

Next, at the risk of repeating myself, the fact is that Nolan was sacked without a replacement of any kind lined up. I don't want to get into it too much but I can't imagine that ever being a good idea.

Then we had Kewell appointed. Now the Pro-Nolan faction might not have taken well to Kewell, given that he was thrust upon them after their much-loved boss was unfairly (in their eyes) dismissed. However, no doubt some players warmed to him, and by the time he, in turn, was sacked, you probably had a Pro-Kewell faction too. When he was sacked I certainly felt he had not been given a fair shake, and so did he. He basically said as much in an interview. No doubt at least some of the players thought the same thing.

Again, Kewell was sacked with no replacement lined up, which to my eyes was an incredibly dumb repeat of an incredibly dumb mistake. I've absolutely no doubt some of the players felt the same way.

Then you had Ardley appointed. The third manager for the season, he walks into a dressing room that's split into multiple factions. The Pro-Nolan faction, the Pro-Kewell faction, and I suspect a third group that overlapped both of those groups, the This-Club-Is-Clueless-What's-The-Point faction. If you look at performances in the remaining games in the season, it sure looked like that third group included a lot of players at one time or another. I'm sure nobody disputes that the players were deeply demoralised by the chaos at the club.

The rest is history. Ardley, as manager, failed to turn the club's fortunes around, as had the previous two managers. Unlike the previous two managers he was given the rest of the season to do so, and unlike those two had the dubious honour of presiding over our relegation.

So yeah, Ardley had one job and he failed to do it. I don't know anyone who thinks otherwise. But to lay 100% of the blame at his feet, or use that failure to assert he's a bad manager overall, is absurdly reductive to me. There was a string of strategic cock-ups that ended in his appointment to the club, and I've absolutely no doubt he inherited a dressing room that was two parts cheesed off and at least one part checked out.

It's entirely possible that a better manager could have kept us up. I'm sure the best manager in the world would have. But we weren't the kind of club that attracts or can afford the best manager in the world. We were a club run by a man who "accidentally" posts his gentleman sausage to twitter and appoints three managers a year.

[Jampie]

Probably worth mentioning at this juncture something I thought when Doyle was appointed IB's assistant... it's likely that move delivered the dressing room to IB, and signed the Pro-Ardley faction onto his ticket.

Results prior looked a lot like the team weren't sold on IB / had mixed feelings about him / were possibly miffed that their boss had been sacked from the playoff spots... but appointing the team's most respected member and captain as assistant could absolutely alleviate that. With Doyle sold on the Burchnall project, no doubt his influence could be brought to bear on the rest of the squad.

All speculation of course, and I hesitated to mention it at the time, but it seems relevant now.

[drillerpie]

Probably worth mentioning at this juncture something I thought when Doyle was appointed IB's assistant... it's likely that move delivered the dressing room to IB, and signed the Pro-Ardley faction onto his ticket.

Results prior looked a lot like the team weren't sold on IB / had mixed feelings about him / were possibly miffed that their boss had been sacked from the playoff spots... but appointing the team's most respected member and captain as assistant could absolutely alleviate that. With Doyle sold on the Burchnall project, no doubt his influence could be brought to bear on the rest of the squad.

All speculation of course, and I hesitated to mention it at the time, but it seems relevant now.

I've seen this mentioned several times by several posters, across the pro/anti Ardley spectrum, and it has pretty much entered into folklore now. I don't agree with it.

The performances at the end of Ardley's reign were absolutely dire. Let's not forget that the players themselves called a 'this is not working' crisis meeting not long before he was sacked.

The performances under IB were better almost immediately. Even during the barren spell in his first 8 games or so there were games when the attacking play was way better than what we'd seen before, and we created numerous chances. If it wasn't for the fact that Wootton was missing at least one sitter per game during that time IB would've started with a much better record. I believe ncfcog's xg stats confirmed this at the time.

Yes we marked Doyle's appointment with a great win and performance against Sutton, but to say this was due to a pro-Ardley faction finally accepting IB, or a celebration of Mo Ross being sacked, is fanciful IMO.

[laddo]

In my extensive experience of failing at things, and somewhat less extensive experience of learning from those failures, I've found that apportioning "blame" is useless at best, but more usually counterproductive.

If you want to find out what actually went wrong and what lead to the failures, you need everyone involved to speak the truth. And you just never get that if you engender a blame culture.

If you were Ardley's boss do you imagine he'd be more or less effective at re-examining his training methods and tactics if he thought there was a chance you were going to sack him after each game lost because you blame the manager of the day for all of the club's failings?

Apportioning "blame" for the relegation is a waste of time and energy to me. I'm very interested in what happened and why, and not at all interested in who to blame for it.

There's a few things we know about the season, like match results, and plenty of rumours.

I'm not keen to retread old ground but I do want to give an example of something that probably went on but we have no real confirmation of, that I haven't previously laid out.

Nolan was sacked after a six game winless run, after taking the club from the relegation zone to the playoffs during his stint. If I were a player at that time I would be quite peeved to see my manager sacked in those circumstances. It's almost inevitable given the esprit de corps he'd engendered in his time at the club, that at least some of the players, let's call them the Pro-Nolan Faction felt that that decision was unfair, unwise etc.

And you gotta admit they'd have a point.

Next, at the risk of repeating myself, the fact is that Nolan was sacked without a replacement of any kind lined up. I don't want to get into it too much but I can't imagine that ever being a good idea.

Then we had Kewell appointed. Now the Pro-Nolan faction might not have taken well to Kewell, given that he was thrust upon them after their much-loved boss was unfairly (in their eyes) dismissed. However, no doubt some players warmed to him, and by the time he, in turn, was sacked, you probably had a Pro-Kewell faction too. When he was sacked I certainly felt he had not been given a fair shake, and so did he. He basically said as much in an interview. No doubt at least some of the players thought the same thing.

Again, Kewell was sacked with no replacement lined up, which to my eyes was an incredibly dumb repeat of an incredibly dumb mistake. I've absolutely no doubt some of the players felt the same way.

Then you had Ardley appointed. The third manager for the season, he walks into a dressing room that's split into multiple factions. The Pro-Nolan faction, the Pro-Kewell faction, and I suspect a third group that overlapped both of those groups, the This-Club-Is-Clueless-What's-The-Point faction. If you look at performances in the remaining games in the season, it sure looked like that third group included a lot of players at one time or another. I'm sure nobody disputes that the players were deeply demoralised by the chaos at the club.

The rest is history. Ardley, as manager, failed to turn the club's fortunes around, as had the previous two managers. Unlike the previous two managers he was given the rest of the season to do so, and unlike those two had the dubious honour of presiding over our relegation.

So yeah, Ardley had one job and he failed to do it. I don't know anyone who thinks otherwise. But to lay 100% of the blame at his feet, or use that failure to assert he's a bad manager overall, is absurdly reductive to me. There was a string of strategic cock-ups that ended in his appointment to the club, and I've absolutely no doubt he inherited a dressing room that was two parts cheesed off and at least one part checked out.

It's entirely possible that a better manager could have kept us up. I'm sure the best manager in the world would have. But we weren't the kind of club that attracts or can afford the best manager in the world. We were a club run by a man who "accidentally" posts his gentleman sausage to twitter and appoints three managers a year.

A comprehensive and superb post that pretty much sums up my thoughts on the relegation season to a t! I recommend all read it whether they agree or not it gives the view I believe many share.

You simply can't make multiple big dumb mistakes with nothing lined up in preparation. Jampie's focus on the playing squad is the interesting part for me.

Not only would the rapid hiring and firing confuse and annoy certain sections of the playing squad but three different managers, three different playing styles, three different managerial approaches and relationships in one season can't be easy.

I can only imagine the WhatsApp chats between the players during that complete mess. No wonder the performances stunk the place out!

[Carlton_Pie]

In my extensive experience of failing at things, and somewhat less extensive experience of learning from those failures, I've found that apportioning "blame" is useless at best, but more usually counterproductive.

If you want to find out what actually went wrong and what lead to the failures, you need everyone involved to speak the truth. And you just never get that if you engender a blame culture.

If you were Ardley's boss do you imagine he'd be more or less effective at re-examining his training methods and tactics if he thought there was a chance you were going to sack him after each game lost because you blame the manager of the day for all of the club's failings?

Apportioning "blame" for the relegation is a waste of time and energy to me. I'm very interested in what happened and why, and not at all interested in who to blame for it.

There's a few things we know about the season, like match results, and plenty of rumours.

I'm not keen to retread old ground but I do want to give an example of something that probably went on but we have no real confirmation of, that I haven't previously laid out.

Nolan was sacked after a six game winless run, after taking the club from the relegation zone to the playoffs during his stint. If I were a player at that time I would be quite peeved to see my manager sacked in those circumstances. It's almost inevitable given the esprit de corps he'd engendered in his time at the club, that at least some of the players, let's call them the Pro-Nolan Faction felt that that decision was unfair, unwise etc.

And you gotta admit they'd have a point.

Next, at the risk of repeating myself, the fact is that Nolan was sacked without a replacement of any kind lined up. I don't want to get into it too much but I can't imagine that ever being a good idea.

Then we had Kewell appointed. Now the Pro-Nolan faction might not have taken well to Kewell, given that he was thrust upon them after their much-loved boss was unfairly (in their eyes) dismissed. However, no doubt some players warmed to him, and by the time he, in turn, was sacked, you probably had a Pro-Kewell faction too. When he was sacked I certainly felt he had not been given a fair shake, and so did he. He basically said as much in an interview. No doubt at least some of the players thought the same thing.

Again, Kewell was sacked with no replacement lined up, which to my eyes was an incredibly dumb repeat of an incredibly dumb mistake. I've absolutely no doubt some of the players felt the same way.

Then you had Ardley appointed. The third manager for the season, he walks into a dressing room that's split into multiple factions. The Pro-Nolan faction, the Pro-Kewell faction, and I suspect a third group that overlapped both of those groups, the This-Club-Is-Clueless-What's-The-Point faction. If you look at performances in the remaining games in the season, it sure looked like that third group included a lot of players at one time or another. I'm sure nobody disputes that the players were deeply demoralised by the chaos at the club.

The rest is history. Ardley, as manager, failed to turn the club's fortunes around, as had the previous two managers. Unlike the previous two managers he was given the rest of the season to do so, and unlike those two had the dubious honour of presiding over our relegation.

So yeah, Ardley had one job and he failed to do it. I don't know anyone who thinks otherwise. But to lay 100% of the blame at his feet, or use that failure to assert he's a bad manager overall, is absurdly reductive to me. There was a string of strategic cock-ups that ended in his appointment to the club, and I've absolutely no doubt he inherited a dressing room that was two parts cheesed off and at least one part checked out.

It's entirely possible that a better manager could have kept us up. I'm sure the best manager in the world would have. But we weren't the kind of club that attracts or can afford the best manager in the world. We were a club run by a man who "accidentally" posts his gentleman sausage to twitter and appoints three managers a year.

It was NA fault

[ForeignLegion]

Jesus H Christ will this ever end?

[matt_magpie]

A comprehensive and superb post that pretty much sums up my thoughts on the relegation season to a t! I recommend all read it whether they agree or not it gives the view I believe many share.

You simply can't make multiple big dumb mistakes with nothing lined up in preparation. Jampie's focus on the playing squad is the interesting part for me.

Not only would the rapid hiring and firing confuse and annoy certain sections of the playing squad but three different managers, three different playing styles, three different managerial approaches and relationships in one season can't be easy.

I can only imagine the WhatsApp chats between the players during that complete mess. No wonder the performances stunk the place out!

Good analysis I think it’s fair to say each manager was set up to fail, how much Nolan was involved in the initial transfers I don’t know but I think Hardy was heavily. The reason people still talk about it is because no one bar on the inside really knew what was going on and I guess as much as it’s in the past a lot of us are intrigued to know how we spectacularly got relegated that season to none league. The one thing we know now is we have the polar opposite as owners who are looking at long term and not short term, I think fans will have to be patient their not going to throw loads of money at us or make knee jerk decisions to appease the fans.

[crazyfists]

Jesus H Christ will this ever end?

It'll never end, after the nuclear apocalypse in 2156, a survivor will look under a rock and find two Notts fans arguing over whether Ardley really was to blame for the relegation season 138 years ago.

[laddo]

It'll never end, after the nuclear apocalypse in 2156, a survivor will look under a rock and find two Notts fans arguing over whether Ardley really was to blame for the relegation season 138 years ago.

One would definitely mention the Macclesfield home game on Boxing Day 2018 that's for sure.