QPR Post Match Thoughts

[caytonmiller]

I don’t and neither do you. What we do all know is that most football commentators and pundits will say beating teams around you is important. We also know who is predicted to be in the bottom group so it makes sense to see those games as more likely to be games you would target to get points from. We also know that we are nearly a third of the way through the season, probability tells you which teams are likely to be in the group we are in. Lastly I never said we only have to win those games, I am saying that those are the games that at the end of the season will have a big say in where we finish. If you think not getting points against teams like Wednesday, qpr, Huddersfield and Bristol won’t impact us so much, that is fine, it is your view, I do not share that view.

So how are we suppose to target the bottom teams. Wouldn't this mean resting our best players in the harder games? Not sure that would go down well.
Plus if we target the bottom teams and like last 2 games we only get 1 point from them. Where does that leave us?. Easy to say target those games but there's no guarantee of winning them, don't forget even those other 5 teams in the bottom 6 have better squads than us.
We have to play the strongest team in every game. The championship is all about playing 6-7 games then getting 10 days rest.

[Grist_To_The_Mill]

For some reason we seem to have developed a theory that there are teams in this league we should be beating. Everything else taken into account there are no teams we should be beating, however there are teams we need to be beating to survive. If we should beat teams below us then what's the point of the league even carrying on. Leicester and Ipswich should be given promotion now and the rest should pack it in. But they just lost and drew their games so what happened there? We hate it when fans say 'we should be beating teams like Rotherham' so why is it OK for us to say we should be beating teams like SW and QPR. Nobody rolls over in this league and every point we get is a scrap, we know that and today we got one point. Just another 36ish and we'll be safe.

As for PW. I think he was with us so long some fans are still deeply entrenched in their grief over him leaving us. Don't forget he did just that, left us. We didn't sack him. We didn't hound him out. Whatever his tactics were or would have been is immaterial. He's not here any more and that was his choice. People seem to be forgetting that.

That's very true and he left us at a crucial time of the season with a " **** you I'm taking the money"

As for his time here Warne played 4-5-1 at home on many occasions. We didn't like it then so why should we like it now under MT?

[Timbertop]

We are playing like a lower league 1 side. Surely we have better players than that level but this manager seems unable to get the best from them. But what replacement of substance would take the job on ? Just don't see the "love in" with Hugill. He's just a slow scrapper but being Taylor's marquee signing he daren't drop him.There was far more movement and cohesion with Nombe and Kelly paired upfront.

[Pocket rocket]

I've dried my eyes now and and had a bowl of nourishing soup. I think I'll be able to soldier on

Seriously though, I wasn't actually offended at the Wendy comparison, although as far as football comparisons go they don't get much worse!

My point is that the current situation is clearly causing a divide amongst fans and I'd like to think that's because we all care about the club so much that we feel the need to speak out. But there does seem to be a suggestion from people backing Taylor (and it's not just you I've seen others allude to it) that the ones who are criticising Taylor are somehow forgetting that "we're only Rotherham." Almost like that is a one size fits all answer to every game we play in the Championship. I just don't think that excuses Taylors tactical choices.

I am genuinely interested to hear the views of people supporting Taylor about the 4-3-3 formation that has never worked? On paper we have 3 up front, but all I see is Hugill isolated. Yesterday the front three were Hugill plus Fred and Clucas? I'd like to hear how that can be defended when we have Kelly and Nombe on the bench. Hell even Mcguckin must be worth a shot. I'll not bring Eaves into it. This tactic failed us against Bristol City at home, was utterly ineffective against Coventry in the first half, saw us humiliated against Wednesday and saw us have to claw a point back, again at home, against a side that have lost 6 in a row.

I would love to hear the people sticking up for Taylor defend these tactical choices but all I'm hearing at the minute is 1, There's nobody to replace him. 2, We're only Rotherham so we're expected to be crap and all who disagree are entitled whingers (or Wendies ). 3, He kept us up last season. (His contribution was 36 points in 36 games, Warne got us 14 in 9, Peltier 0 in 1. I am over Warne but it cannot be denied that last seasons survival was a combined effort)

If that is the criteria to stay in the job no matter what happens on the pitch then fine, we might as well pop the Champagne now and look forward to getting back to our comfort zone in League One. I do miss the annual trip to Wembley to be fair

I explained my thoughts on MT on the replacement for Taylor thread which you asked me to.
I don’t think it’s that we can’t get anyone better or we’re only Rotherham for me i go back to other managers who have tried to keep us up at this level.

All have either struggled or just about managed it. My feelings are that MT is capable of keeping us up.
Injuries/ poor selection bad luck have all contributed to our league position.
I feel at the moment that some are that convinced he’s got to go it’s like no I want a bike for Christmas and nothing else will be good enough he’s just got to go hasn’t he.
If we win Tuesday it still won’t be good enough for some.
I’m genuinely interested with our budget where in the league people think we should be.
I would say bottom 5 well we’re only a win and other results go our way and that’s where we are with a game in hand to.
The table is where our budget should put us. The tactics I understand people questioning but would the outcome be different maybe a couple more points but overall I’m not sure.

[Grist_To_The_Mill]

I explained my thoughts on MT on the replacement for Taylor thread which you asked me to.
I don’t think it’s that we can’t get anyone better or we’re only Rotherham for me i go back to other managers who have tried to keep us up at this level.

All have either struggled or just about managed it. My feelings are that MT is capable of keeping us up.
Injuries/ poor selection bad luck have all contributed to our league position.
I feel at the moment that some are that convinced he’s got to go it’s like no I want a bike for Christmas and nothing else will be good enough he’s just got to go hasn’t he.
If we win Tuesday it still won’t be good enough for some.
I’m genuinely interested with our budget where in the league people think we should be.
I would say bottom 5 well we’re only a win and other results go our way and that’s where we are with a game in hand to.
The table is where our budget should put us. The tactics I understand people questioning but would the outcome be different maybe a couple more points but overall I’m not sure.

No I don't think we can get anybody better that Taylor either.

Maybe we need a few more players that don't carry imaginary tea trays onto the pitch

[Derbymiller]

So how are we suppose to target the bottom teams. Wouldn't this mean resting our best players in the harder games? Not sure that would go down well.
Plus if we target the bottom teams and like last 2 games we only get 1 point from them. Where does that leave us?. Easy to say target those games but there's no guarantee of winning them, don't forget even those other 5 teams in the bottom 6 have better squads than us.
We have to play the strongest team in every game. The championship is all about playing 6-7 games then getting 10 days rest.

Ok I know we very rarely see eye to eye, And I certainly don’t want an argument, discussing things in text style messages isn’t easy. First point, I am not saying we shouldn’t play our best team in games, I don’t know how you got that from my posts. You seem to think I am saying we only have to beat the teams around us!! That is not what I am saying, I am saying not getting good results against such teams hurts us more over a season. It is to do with the likelihood of the fact that points lost to those teams end up being crucial at the end of the season. So you would hope that the team, plays their best and works their hardest in those games to increase the chances of getting good results. The chances of getting good results from teams at the top is lower than teams in the bottom half, it has to be teams at the top win more than teams in the bottom, teams at the bottom are there because they are not as good. It is clear in games against Hudderfield, Bristol, Wednesday and Qpr we did not give our best. Now we have played 14 games out of 46 (nearly a third) we have 10 points we have 70% of those from teams in the bottom half it is more likely this trend will continue.

[DerekMiller]

I explained my thoughts on MT on the replacement for Taylor thread which you asked me to.
I don’t think it’s that we can’t get anyone better or we’re only Rotherham for me i go back to other managers who have tried to keep us up at this level.

All have either struggled or just about managed it. My feelings are that MT is capable of keeping us up.
Injuries/ poor selection bad luck have all contributed to our league position.
I feel at the moment that some are that convinced he’s got to go it’s like no I want a bike for Christmas and nothing else will be good enough he’s just got to go hasn’t he.
If we win Tuesday it still won’t be good enough for some.
I’m genuinely interested with our budget where in the league people think we should be.
I would say bottom 5 well we’re only a win and other results go our way and that’s where we are with a game in hand to.
The table is where our budget should put us. The tactics I understand people questioning but would the outcome be different maybe a couple more points but overall I’m not sure.

Since King Ronnie got us to the second tier back in 2001, we have played 13 seasons in the Championship. We have been relegated 4 times. Three of those were under Paul Warne, although I only think we can attribute two of those to him. His first season he took over from the Stubbs/Jackett fiasco and had never managed a first team game in his life so it was a foregone conclusion. The only other manager to take us down since 2001 was Mick Harford, and that was after taking over from a chaotic goodbye to Ronnie Moore's first reign. Harford tried to change the style we played. He adopted a passing game that was slightly prettier to watch and took us all the way to 24th in the table.

Ronnie, Evans and Warnock all kept us in this league by playing a well drilled, high press, blood and guts style that was never going to get us promoted but ensured we survived. Warne, in my opinion, just fell short. He played the same way, and in those two seasons that it was all his team and tactics, we fell short mainly because he kept a small squad that ran out of steam in the latter half of the season. This was a problem even in Warne's promotion seasons from League one and left us with nailbiting finishes. The reasons for the small squad are still debated to this day, with some saying TS didn't back Warne in January, others (including Warne himself) saying Warne didn't like a big squad and didn't want to sign more players than he felt comfortable with. Either way, for me that was Warne's undoing in the Championship.

So, your analogy about previous managers doesn't really hold up given that we have survived 9 of our last 13 attempts at this league with the same, or less, budget. For Taylor to achieve the vision of progressing us to the next level as a club, survival is a must. It's a basic criteria that we need to achieve as a minimum every season to allow incremental build.

His style of play is not working. He achieved an average of 1 point per game last season, which in fairness would have kept us up had he been there from day one, but only because Reading had points deducted. This season, his points per game tally will see us reach 33 points unless there is a massive turnaround in performances. For that to happen he needs to ditch this 4-3-3 nonsense with only one attacker on the pitch. But he has shown he is not willing to do this in must win games. Based on this, I genuinely can't see how he will turn it around. He's clearly not a motivator and his tactics have left us all baffled and frustrated.

I did read your comments on Taylor on the other thread and saw nothing to convince me that he can turn this around. One thing I did agree with though, is that he's found the Championship to be a shock and much harder than he realised. But I've not seen a single thing in the last year to make me think he's started to adapt

[Grist_To_The_Mill]

No, it's rightly aimed at coach Clueless in the dugout
I really hope that this is enough for there to be an emergency press conference / announcement tonight but fear that Matt finish will hang on to the manager's job for a few more, highly damaging games

#TaylorOutTonightPlease

Or some of our players are stealing a wage and when asked to perform get a hamstring tweak?

[Pocket rocket]

Since King Ronnie got us to the second tier back in 2001, we have played 13 seasons in the Championship. We have been relegated 4 times. Three of those were under Paul Warne, although I only think we can attribute two of those to him. His first season he took over from the Stubbs/Jackett fiasco and had never managed a first team game in his life so it was a foregone conclusion. The only other manager to take us down since 2001 was Mick Harford, and that was after taking over from a chaotic goodbye to Ronnie Moore's first reign. Harford tried to change the style we played. He adopted a passing game that was slightly prettier to watch and took us all the way to 24th in the table.

Ronnie, Evans and Warnock all kept us in this league by playing a well drilled, high press, blood and guts style that was never going to get us promoted but ensured we survived. Warne, in my opinion, just fell short. He played the same way, and in those two seasons that it was all his team and tactics, we fell short mainly because he kept a small squad that ran out of steam in the latter half of the season. This was a problem even in Warne's promotion seasons from League one and left us with nailbiting finishes. The reasons for the small squad are still debated to this day, with some saying TS didn't back Warne in January, others (including Warne himself) saying Warne didn't like a big squad and didn't want to sign more players than he felt comfortable with. Either way, for me that was Warne's undoing in the Championship.

So, your analogy about previous managers doesn't really hold up given that we have survived 9 of our last 13 attempts at this league with the same, or less, budget. For Taylor to achieve the vision of progressing us to the next level as a club, survival is a must. It's a basic criteria that we need to achieve as a minimum every season to allow incremental build.

His style of play is not working. He achieved an average of 1 point per game last season, which in fairness would have kept us up had he been there from day one, but only because Reading had points deducted. This season, his points per game tally will see us reach 33 points unless there is a massive turnaround in performances. For that to happen he needs to ditch this 4-3-3 nonsense with only one attacker on the pitch. But he has shown he is not willing to do this in must win games. Based on this, I genuinely can't see how he will turn it around. He's clearly not a motivator and his tactics have left us all baffled and frustrated.

I did read your comments on Taylor on the other thread and saw nothing to convince me that he can turn this around. One thing I did agree with though, is that he's found the Championship to be a shock and much harder than he realised. But I've not seen a single thing in the last year to make me think he's started to adapt

I said all either struggled or just about managed it so my analogy does add up they may have managed it but it was tough.
Your making stuff up now I said with our budget it’s a struggle I didn’t say it’s not possible.
As far the basic requirement he achieved that last season.
You are making yourself sound desperate now. MT did what your claiming is a basic requirement.
He did that last season.
I’m not engaging with you anymore on MT everything you’ve said you are contradicting yourself.
He’s achieved what in your words is what we need to have an incremental build.
I think your dislike for him is clouding your judgement.
That’s it from me I can’t keep going back and forth with someone who claims he can’t achieve what he has already achieved. It’s just stupidity and I can’t get down to that level I’m afraid.

[Ronners]

On the plus side yesterday I thought some of our football, especially 2nd half, was really good with both Bramhall and Dexter bombing down the line with nice interplay in midfield and getting in behind with some dangerous crosses. I thought their number 10 Chair was not only their best player but THE mom, not just for his goal but a constant threat, but Dexter also did well against him and still managed to get himself forward, please Wolves don't recall him in january, what a player this lad could become.
On the minus side, is Viktor told to constantly hit the ball long? because our full backs regularly run out wide in space, when he gets the ball, but he just waves them forward and lumps it straight down the pitch. I thought both teams defended well, and Morrison looked, to me anyway, as though, he was looking fitter and more in control, and whilst they never had a 1 v 1 with Viktor, they played some great balls putting players in round the back, and some wicked crosses that they'll be disappointed not to have converted at least one. Ayala, although he was only on for around 12/13 mins looked comfortable and on that showing could be a real good signing, Odoffin was outstanding but all in all a decent point for us and the fact Cafu played the full 90 mins is also a good sign. UTM