O/T And we wonder why we trust Starmer

[frogmiller]

It's not a small piece at all.

You and Russian propogandists are literally using a 35-year-old informal discussion by one deaceased reresentative of the US to a deceased representative of a state that no longer exists, to imply that modern day Russia is justified in invading the sovereign state of Ukraine.

I'd love for you to sit for just one moment, reflect on that, and question how you found yourself in this position. I don't think you will though. You say I'm not accepting an argument, but all I have done is asked a question based on something you said, and you appear to have confirmed my interpretation.

So you had preconceived ideas.

Your interpretation is based on what I thought of a 35 year old representative.

You are misinformed!

[Timbertop]

If only we had a leader like Trump. What an inspiring speech tonight. Hope comrade Kier was watching and quivering.

[John2]

So you had preconceived ideas.

Your interpretation is based on what I thought of a 35 year old representative.

You are misinformed!

Frog, are you incapable of reading, or just of following basic conversational convention?

I am misinformed, because you failed to properly inform me. In my opening post I speculated as to why I believed you had made the false claim you had, and asked you to clarify what I had gotten wrong if you didn't agree.

I asked you to challenge my preconcieved idea and you didn't. So yes, maybe I did, you should take some responsibility.

You again are dancing around and not stating your actual position. It's a bizarre way of approaching discussion that would probably get scored down in a secondary school debating society.

[frogmiller]

Frog, are you incapable of reading, or just of following basic conversational convention?

I am misinformed, because you failed to properly inform me. In my opening post I speculated as to why I believed you had made the false claim you had, and asked you to clarify what I had gotten wrong if you didn't agree.

I asked you to challenge my preconcieved idea and you didn't. So yes, maybe I did, you should take some responsibility.

You again are dancing around and not stating your actual position. It's a bizarre way of approaching discussion that would probably get scored down in a secondary school debating society.

I wouldn't entertain a debating society or participate in one. Why would I want to argue all day?

The reason I posted originally yesterday was the point that Keir Starmer has said that he is willing to sacrifice British troops in a peace keeping mission in the Ukraine or as he said putting boots on the ground.

Here is what I said on my opening post yesterday.


Starmer is willing to sacrifice our kids for his handlers!

As America tries to negotiate a starting point with Russia Starmer is offering up our troops as peace makers!

Even the European leaders are now laughing at him!

Last edited by frogmiller; Yesterday at 12:16 PM. Reason: spelling


Where is your response. nothing is hidden or complicated!

[Grist_To_The_Mill]

I wouldn't entertain a debating society or participate in one. Why would I want to argue all day?

The reason I posted originally yesterday was the point that Keir Starmer has said that he is willing to sacrifice British troops in a peace keeping mission in the Ukraine or as he said putting boots on the ground.

Here is what I said on my opening post yesterday.


Starmer is willing to sacrifice our kids for his handlers!

As America tries to negotiate a starting point with Russia Starmer is offering up our troops as peace makers!

Even the European leaders are now laughing at him!

Last edited by frogmiller; Yesterday at 12:16 PM. Reason: spelling


Where is your response. nothing is hidden or complicated!

It?s quite amazing how much propaganda the average UK citizen accepts without questioning it. Oh those nasty Russians etc, we should help those poor oppressed Ukrainians etc etc

[John2]

It?s quite amazing how much propaganda the average UK citizen accepts without questioning it. Oh those nasty Russians etc, we should help those poor oppressed Ukrainians etc etc

Russia is a dictatorship that murders its political opposition and invades soverign countries. It's quite shocking ho succesful their misinformation campaign has been against some on here.

Obviously the preference would be that Putin immediately withdraws his troops from Ukraine and that the war ends.

Everyone agrees we want the war to end, frog acts like its some sort of righteous position.

Militaries exist because some countries want to expand by force at a huge cost to human life. Some militaries exist to expand, some exist to fight against those expansionists.

Our country had a pretty bad history of expansion, but also in the world wars a pretty good policy of fighting exainst the brutal expansionists.

Europe has been much more prosperous and succesful since we went such a long period without war. The reason was because WW2 wa so brutal and involved so much loss we collectively agreed it war is a terrible idea.

If Russia were to end the war on favourable terms, they will adopt the attitude that war is succesful, and Ukraine will be the first of many.

Appeasemant doesn't work.

You brainwashed lot on here might be willing to simplify it as "let's just give Russia what it wants and stop everything". But Russian victory substantially increases the risk that your grandkids generation will end up dead in a much bigger war instead. That's the reality. The bigger picture is more complicated than some of the minds here can comprehend.

[frogmiller]

Russia is a dictatorship that murders its political opposition and invades soverign countries. It's quite shocking ho succesful their misinformation campaign has been against some on here.

Obviously the preference would be that Putin immediately withdraws his troops from Ukraine and that the war ends.

Everyone agrees we want the war to end, frog acts like its some sort of righteous position.

Militaries exist because some countries want to expand by force at a huge cost to human life. Some militaries exist to expand, some exist to fight against those expansionists.

Our country had a pretty bad history of expansion, but also in the world wars a pretty good policy of fighting exainst the brutal expansionists.

Europe has been much more prosperous and succesful since we went such a long period without war. The reason was because WW2 wa so brutal and involved so much loss we collectively agreed it war is a terrible idea.

If Russia were to end the war on favourable terms, they will adopt the attitude that war is succesful, and Ukraine will be the first of many.

Appeasemant doesn't work.

You brainwashed lot on here might be willing to simplify it as "let's just give Russia what it wants and stop everything". But Russian victory substantially increases the risk that your grandkids generation will end up dead in a much bigger war instead. That's the reality. The bigger picture is more complicated than some of the minds here can comprehend.

Who has said to give Russia what they want?

It will come down to negotiation John. " frog acts like its some sort of righteous position." Kinell what is wrong in not wanting this to contiue whan there is a chance for it to stop?

You seem like you want to take control of Russia and destroy it! It is exactly what you presume Russia wants to do for the Ukraine.

[ragingpup]

It?s quite amazing how much propaganda the average UK citizen accepts without questioning it. Oh those nasty Russians etc, we should help those poor oppressed Ukrainians etc etc

Ok, question for you and frog too. What in your opinion is Russian's motive for invading Ukraine and what evidence for thinking that?

[Grist_To_The_Mill]

Ok, question for you and frog too. What in your opinion is Russian's motive for invading Ukraine and what evidence for thinking that?

Maybe we would have an answer to that had we asked the Ukrainians their opinions in the first place. Maybe many were happy being connected to Russia and not the wonderful west?

But we are fed the company line and we all join in with the company song with chicken keeevs on the buffet

[frogmiller]

Ok, question for you and frog too. What in your opinion is Russian's motive for invading Ukraine and what evidence for thinking that?

I have no evidence of what happened in any meetings or negotiations from any party which is exactly your possition! We can only go on what was said at the time 3 years ago.
Putin didn't like the Orange revolution? or the way America interfered with the elections? The faulse promise by the EU to fast line the mebership of the Ukraine. Maybe he wanted a buffer between Russia and NATO and didn't want NATO bases on his border.

There are many reasons why Putin could have been upset!

What is your opinion on why the war should keep going?