OT- The Queen's Christmas Day Message to the Commonwealth

[Andy_Faber]

A significant proportion - by no means all - of Brexit support had it’s roots in racism

I'd LOVE to see the unbiased post-Brexit analysis you've based that comment on. Most Brexit supporters are racist?

[ramAnag]

How on earth do you translate, ‘a significant proportion of Brexit support had its roots in racism’ as equalling me claiming, ‘most Brexit supporters are racist’?

It is simply a fact that Jo Cox was murdered, the day after she’d taken part in an anti Brexit demonstration, by someone who belonged to a far right organisation and who shouted ‘Britain first’.

It is also a fact that, in the immediate aftermath of the referendum, a number of attacks took place on immigrants of various descriptions by people who felt the outcome of the referendum somehow gave credence to their prejudice.

I very much doubt that either the ‘Britain First’ supporters or the halfwits who attacked migrants were of the ‘Remain’ persuasion. As such, in a vote which was as close as it proved to be, such ‘knuckleheads’ would have been responsible for ‘shoring up’ the narrow Brexit ‘victory’ and do indeed have their ‘roots in racism’, all of which, I hope you’ll recognise, is a very far cry from claiming ‘most Brexit supporters are racist’.

[Andy_Faber]

How on earth do you translate, ‘a significant proportion of Brexit support had its roots in racism’ as equalling me claiming, ‘most Brexit supporters are racist’?

It is simply a fact that Jo Cox was murdered, the day after she’d taken part in an anti Brexit demonstration, by someone who belonged to a far right organisation and who shouted ‘Britain first’.

It is also a fact that, in the immediate aftermath of the referendum, a number of attacks took place on immigrants of various descriptions by people who felt the outcome of the referendum somehow gave credence to their prejudice.

I very much doubt that either the ‘Britain First’ supporters or the halfwits who attacked migrants were of the ‘Remain’ persuasion. As such, in a vote which was as close as it proved to be, such ‘knuckleheads’ would have been responsible for ‘shoring up’ the narrow Brexit ‘victory’ and do indeed have their ‘roots in racism’, all of which, I hope you’ll recognise, is a very far cry from claiming ‘most Brexit supporters are racist’.

you're being a bit inconsistent there R, I recall in an earlier comment you refuted any connection between Muslim perpetrators of terror and the Muslim community as a whole, why now are you linking an infinitesimally small (although I would agree too large) bunch of far right loonies with all who chose the 'No' box?

[ramAnag]

you're being a bit inconsistent there R, I recall in an earlier comment you refuted any connection between Muslim perpetrators of terror and the Muslim community as a whole, why now are you linking an infinitesimally small (although I would agree too large) bunch of far right loonies with all who chose the 'No' box?

Au contraire Andy. I feel I’m being absolutely consistent. I do believe Muslim terrorists represent a tiny minority of Muslims but I will accept that in the current climate most acts of terror are perpetrated by ‘militant, radicalised’ Muslims.
Likewise, Britain First is what was once known as the National Front, a small but significant group of overtly racist bully boys. Coupled with support from the worst excesses of UKIP I don’t believe it takes too much imagination to recognise that the ‘success’ of the Brexit campaign was without doubt indebted to the support of these two, in the first case fundamentally and in the second, largely, racist organisations.

N.B. To be clear, that is not the same as saying most of the Brexiteers were motivated by racism, but a significant number clearly were.

[swaledale]

I'd LOVE to see the unbiased post-Brexit analysis you've based that comment on. Most Brexit supporters are racist?

Tut tut your grasp of quantities is tenuous, a significant proportion could be anything from 20 - 50% neither equates to "most Brexit supporters are racist!

[roger_ramjet]

So significant is between 20 and 50... like maybe 28%. So a signicicant number of people voted leave, not tbis minority that rA has been going on about 😂

[swaledale]

you're being a bit inconsistent there R, I recall in an earlier comment you refuted any connection between Muslim perpetrators of terror and the Muslim community as a whole, why now are you linking an infinitesimally small (although I would agree too large) bunch of far right loonies with all who chose the 'No' box?

Those who actually proclaim to be or are actually members of far right groups may indeed be few in those who share similar sentiments towards immigrants were many in number, even those in places like Clacton, Doncaster and Teesside, where immigrant populations are very low were often to be heard quoting that immigration was the main reason for voting no. Indeed many eminent Conservative MP's made questionable statements about immigrants and the EU. Also ironically labour MP's one of german heritage and one of Irish heritage were vehement leavers and made similar utterings. it was heart warming to see immigrants who had been welcomed into the fabric of UK society proclaiming that immigration was the main issue.

So being "right wing" is not synonimous with being racist but a good deal of those for voting for Brexit, though not all by any means were using language that was racist.

[swaledale]

I’m proud of being British.
I’m proud of our royal family and especially the Queen.
The heirs seem to be forward looking and are held in high esteem around the world.
Why want to change the traditions of a millennia.
Of course only figureheads but OUR figureheads of our great country.
Long Live The Queen!!

The Royal family isn't British though! Its european, the Queen is of German heritage (prussian if one is being picky) and the Duke of Greek heritage, aside from that why would you want to doff your cap to someone who is only there through an accident of birth - tradition is all very well but the world moves on. fortunately or we would still be sending children out to work - but then thats maybe the UK pysche? We dwell in the past and complain when the rest of the world moves on and looks on us as a quaint historical theme park!

[swaledale]

It's hers passed down from Monarch's past. If we remove her as Queen all these palaces belong to her and the rest of royal family who own minor castles

Sorry where the **** did they get the land from in the first place? Its yours and mine by right, it was stolen from those who had worked it for generations, they have no more right to ownership than any other citizen in this land!

[Andy_Faber]

Au contraire Andy. I feel I’m being absolutely consistent. I do believe Muslim terrorists represent a tiny minority of Muslims but I will accept that in the current climate most acts of terror are perpetrated by ‘militant, radicalised’ Muslims.
Likewise, Britain First is what was once known as the National Front, a small but significant group of overtly racist bully boys. Coupled with support from the worst excesses of UKIP I don’t believe it takes too much imagination to recognise that the ‘success’ of the Brexit campaign was without doubt indebted to the support of these two, in the first case fundamentally and in the second, largely, racist organisations.

N.B. To be clear, that is not the same as saying most of the Brexiteers were motivated by racism, but a significant number clearly were.

I think you're giving such organisations more credit than they are due. Taking Comrade Swale's latest swipe seriously just for once, 'significant' would be 1,269,502, and I do not accept that there were that many people motivated by racism as commonly defined.