Would you sacrifice the naming rights

[ghostrider]

I'll say it again. This club is not in debt, except to the owner of the club.
If the owner sells the club he's not going to sell it for a set price and then say " ohhh, by the way, I might as well tell you that you've also got a few hundred million debt to sort out before you start doing anything else."
He's going to sell it for a set price which makes the club itself debt free after it's bought for that set price.

Unlike Hall and Shepherd who sold the club for profit and also left the debt to the new owner who was naive (?) enough to jump into the deep end to find the debt as a massive anchor and chain around his neck...but he solved the debt problem by taking it away from the banks and outside monetary interest and gathered it all in house, owed personally to himself as an interest free loan rather than accruing interest on a debt alone before any debt is paid.

However...like I said. Unlike Hall and Shepherd who trousered a fortune and left debt, Ashley will trouser whatever he trousers in with his asking price for the club....lock stock and barrel, with no shock horror due diligence issues.

That's the difference and that means that although theoretically we can say we are in debt as it stands, it's a debt that does not carry forward and nor is it a debt that has any detriment on the club's future in terms of financial stability or interest build. Ashley has saw to that but it gets swept under the rug in favour of him somehow taking the club to the cleaners and pocketing fortunes....somehow.


It wasn't too long ago (and people can admit it or not) that some fans were lauding Ellis Short for the job he was doing in terms of not being afraid to buy players and pay them decent money to try and build a team.
I saw a few posters on here that wished we had an Ellis Short and not Ashley.
I'm more than sure nobody is wishing that, even as it stands...right?

I saw how many wanted us to copy the Southampton model. I remember once that some fans wanted us to copy the Dave Whelan way, because apparently this man knew how to run a club and Ashley was just a FCB who couldn't run one.


The reality is a tad different but the arguments will roll on until Ashley leaves, because the dislike for him is at fever pitch with some and at a stubborn dead end with others who will rarely give an inch in terms of any good he's done.......it's all bad apparently.

People are quite entitled to their thoughts though, because it's entirely up to each and every individual to decide what they think is right or wrong about the running of the club and/or the potential long term value of it in monetary terms and obviously footballing stance against the elite.
But just remember that we could be under a much much worse ownership than people think Ashley already is.

It's one of the reasons why I'd rather have him than take a chance on some PCP type coming in....because they're the real wolf in sheep clothing type, I believe.

[TheOtherTerryMac]

but he didnt create the majority of the debt
and if he had known about it he could of and would of taken the debt from the asking/selling price
either way he didnt create the majority of it
so if you take what he inhertited away from what it is now it isnt that bad

but either way it has stopped him investing

would you swap sunderlands position for ours and our debt ??

we dont have any debt
we have a loan from ashly
as do many other clubs

sunderland had a debt of 110 mill a year ago and interest was 8 mill a year on that aloan

Pboro you come over as being fairly intelligent to say we don’t have any debt it’s a loan off Ashley. Give ya heed a shake man

Your in business and if the business was in debt and I loaned you £250k to pull you out the shyte. You couldn’t then say Oh my business is ok now I got an interest free loan off Terry

It does not matter who loaned The Club the money it’s still a debt that the Club owes just google the Club debt and it will tell you that we owe the owner £150 million. The only difference from a bank loan is that we are not paying interest.

Ashley has stated that he will not put anymore money into the club, so how as a club are we to progress buying new players and trying to pay off a huge debt

That is why no one wants to buy the club as we are so much in debt.

[pboromag]

pboro you come over as being fairly intelligent to say we don’t have any debt it’s a loan off ashley. Give ya heed a shake man

your in business and if the business was in debt and i loaned you £250k to pull you out the shyte. You couldn’t then say oh my business is ok now i got an interest free loan off terry

it does not matter who loaned the club the money it’s still a debt that the club owes just google the club debt and it will tell you that we owe the owner £150 million. The only difference from a bank loan is that we are not paying interest.

Ashley has stated that he will not put anymore money into the club, so how as a club are we to progress buying new players and trying to pay off a huge debt

that is why no one wants to buy the club as we are so much in debt.

but you say other clubs dont have debt
this is how they get around it fella

we generate huge amounts from tv etc
you are not telling me the likes of bournemouth who are 53 mill in debt get all their money from their owner they dont
neither do we

[Zippity]

If Ashley had maximised our revenue streams rather than used us as a vehicle to advertise Sports Direct (amongst other things) then over ten years he could have paid himself back that £150 million. The club is getting nothing back in return for all the free advertising and outsourcing of the concessions, etc. It's no good saying 'ah, but we're not paying interest on a bank loan'...it's his club, he bought-and increased-the debt, it's his debt. Even the free advertising might have been enough to almost clear the debt but no....he is only interested in milking us for as much as he possibly can.

The fact is, we are a club with a £150 million debt-to our owner- and that's why we are screwed as regards a buyer-either we are a club for sale at £250 million but then with a huge £150 million debt or we are a £400 million club with no debt...and £400 million is a ludicrous amount which no-one in their right mind would pay.

[Kal]

If Ashley had maximised our revenue streams rather than used us as a vehicle to advertise Sports Direct (amongst other things) then over ten years he could have paid himself back that £150 million. The club is getting nothing back in return for all the free advertising and outsourcing of the concessions, etc. It's no good saying 'ah, but we're not paying interest on a bank loan'...it's his club, he bought-and increased-the debt, it's his debt. Even the free advertising might have been enough to almost clear the debt but no....he is only interested in milking us for as much as he possibly can.

The fact is, we are a club with a £150 million debt-to our owner- and that's why we are screwed as regards a buyer-either we are a club for sale at £250 million but then with a huge £150 million debt or we are a £400 million club with no debt...and £400 million is a ludicrous amount which no-one in their right mind would pay.

^^^ This ^^^

Is the truth. It will of course, be ignored by Tweedledee and Tweedledum.

[TheOtherTerryMac]

If Ashley had maximised our revenue streams rather than used us as a vehicle to advertise Sports Direct (amongst other things) then over ten years he could have paid himself back that £150 million. The club is getting nothing back in return for all the free advertising and outsourcing of the concessions, etc. It's no good saying 'ah, but we're not paying interest on a bank loan'...it's his club, he bought-and increased-the debt, it's his debt. Even the free advertising might have been enough to almost clear the debt but no....he is only interested in milking us for as much as he possibly can.

The fact is, we are a club with a £150 million debt-to our owner- and that's why we are screwed as regards a buyer-either we are a club for sale at £250 million but then with a huge £150 million debt or we are a £400 million club with no debt...and £400 million is a ludicrous amount which no-one in their right mind would pay.

Well Zip I’m pleased you can see that we have a huge debt to the owner and as you say if he had of been paying for the advertising we would more or less be debt free now

Then you will get the return of it’s his club and he can do what he wants. He is milking the club to promote sports direct for free.

[pboromag]

the advertising isn't worth 2/4 mill a year
if the loan was with the bank the interest would be higher than the amount generated from his advertising

we wouldn't get 2 mill a year naming rights on the stadium

so even having it as a interest type mortgage as the debt we wouldn't have paid it off

not even the debt generated by sheppard etc

and if he did use some of the money to pay the debt
where is he going to get the money to pay the wages staff transfer fees rafa etc etc
you can only spend it once

if he took the 4 mill a year advertising ovr 12 years 48 mill

what would the interest be on that loan without even eating into it ,not a lot more

[TheOtherTerryMac]

the advertising isn't worth 2/4 mill a year
if the loan was with the bank the interest would be higher than the amount generated from his advertising

we wouldn't get 2 mill a year naming rights on the stadium

so even having it as a interest type mortgage as the debt we wouldn't have paid it off

not even the debt generated by sheppard etc

and if he did use some of the money to pay the debt
where is he going to get the money to pay the wages staff transfer fees rafa etc etc
you can only spend it once

if he took the 4 mill a year advertising ovr 12 years 48 mill

what would the interest be on that loan without even eating into it ,not a lot more

So your trying to say that all of the Sports Direct advertising which is plastered on everything around the club with constant TV exposure is not even worth £2 million a year

I give up

[toptoon]

^^^ This ^^^

Is the truth. It will of course, be ignored by Tweedledee and Tweedledum.

Fair enough but what do you think about Ghost´s post 41 above. Or did that get ignored too?

The club continues to be screwed by it´s owners resulting in no success on the pitch and it always has been - that´s why we have no cups. Some people have short memories and think it´s only Ashley that´s the problem. As I´ve said may times on here, Newcastle fans have never liked any owner of the club since I can remember, even John Hall, FFS.

[Kal]

Fair enough but what do you think about Ghost´s post 41 above. Or did that get ignored too?

The club continues to be screwed by it´s owners resulting in no success on the pitch and it always has been - that´s why we have no cups. Some people have short memories and think it´s only Ashley that´s the problem. As I´ve said may times on here, Newcastle fans have never liked any owner of the club since I can remember, even John Hall, FFS.

I'm afraid most of Ghosts posts get ignored. I make no apologies for this as i cherish my sanity. As for former Toon owners, whilst Shepherd/hall didn't get past the final hurdle (trophy) they did give us two prem runners up spots, two FA cup finals, numerous Champions league/Europa league qualifications and turned St James's Park from what it was to what it is today.

Ashley has done ....???